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Guest Column

The bearable lightness of debating Malema

2009-10-30 08:00

Tim Cohen

When the ANC Youth League phoned to ask me to participate in the debate, my head sort of spun. I had visions of what we used to do when National Party ministers came to address us at Wits; it involved lots of shouting and heckling, and if things went really well, a few chairs got tossed and the teargas would come out.

I also thought: am I really now Enemy Number One? Have I really become that? The middle-aged, middle-class, slightly portly white guy singled out as the apogee of everything awful in their eyes?

Like most writers, I’m a terrible public speaker; I like to fashion and recast. Speaking aloud, I lose track and stumble. And my opponent would be one of the best rabble rousers in the business. Was I nuts?

But then the youth league representative seemed so nice. I had previously been in a debate on Tim Modise’s talk show with league spokesman Floyd Shibangu, which had gone pretty well in the sense at least that we both got our points across. Planning Minister Trevor Manuel’s injunction that business people were “cowards” also rang through my brain. Personally I hate it when people don’t stand up for what they believe, and I do think South Africa suffers from a terrible lack of mutual honesty.

I was trapped. So I said yes.

I felt even more trapped walking into the Atlas Studios hall. Most of the hall were singing ANC songs; beautiful as always, but not exactly signifying a non-partisan crowd.

However, it wasn’t only the songs that rang in my ears, it was my brother Geoff’s text message: “You are really going to debate Malema ... and the upside for you is?”

'I could not have been more wrong'

As it happens, I could not have been more wrong. The league representatives were gracious to a fault. The crowd listened dutifully, and did not appear unduly offended by my stuttering, pro-capitalist message. They genuinely wanted to hear what I had to say – and then reject it. Thankfully, Old Mutual CEO Kuseni Dlamini was also there to bring an aspect of erudition and compromise to anti-nationalisation side of the debate, which I obviously could not.

But the true eye-opener for me was Malema himself. He was just masterful. He had that sense of poise and instant likability of a great speaker, combined with the feel for where the audience is that makes for the best kind of stand-up comic. Sure, he had a hometown audience; sure, he is by now a practiced public speaker; and the process was also skewed in his favour so the he both opened and ended the debate. Even so, I think in all honesty, if it were a boxing match, he won nine rounds out of ten.

His speech may have been filled with factual inaccuracies, misinterpretations and the conflation of facts and events. Yet his balance was spot on; he didn’t speak down nor up to his audience. He had that curious, instant oneness that some people just have with an audience.

All the great populists speakers of the past came instantly to mind, Huey Long in particular, perhaps also Eva Peron. Is the ANC transforming into a Peronist movement, I wondered; that confused mix of nationalistic capitalism and socialistic populism? It's possible.

As for Malema, I couldn’t help feeling slightly ashamed of my profession on his behalf. My only previous experience of him was the snippets I read in the press and that I had seen on television. In all of them, he’s typecast as “controversial” and “outspoken” – journalese sub-text for “wrong”.

I could sense reporters waiting for that one sentence which would satisfy the now firmly established public preconception. It’s the same way we used to report on AWB leader Eugene TerreBlanche, waiting with pens poised for that one nutty sentence which we could emblazon across the paper with the unwitting sub-text that he is awful and therefore the rest of us must be good.

Self-deprecating

Malema began his speech in a self-deprecating way, saying the poster advertising the meeting said he was going to give a “lecture” on privatisation. He reminded the audience of his own poor matric results, which drew a lovely ironic laugh. Then made a virtue out of his own ordinariness, pointing out his poor background.

The youth league’s argument on nationalisation is by now well known. Essentially, the argument is that if Botswana can have a 50% partnership with De Beers and still be regarded as a darling of the capitalist west, why can’t SA go the same route? Students from Botswana were paid R5,000 a month to go to university, he pointed out, evidently with some bitterness. Why can’t South Africans have the same benefit, which is financed in his mind at least, by the lucrative partnership with De Beers?

He deftly navigated the potential reefs he might have floundered on. He denied being a communist for example, or even a socialist. He added with a knowing smile, which drew cheers from the crowd, that there were communists that he liked. You were left in doubt, therefore, where he actually stands; a clever way of keeping in with the left wing but at the same time not totally alienating the right.

The race issue was the same; he kept making boldly racial statements about the ownership and management of mining companies, then immediately claiming that he was not being racist. He was simply pointing out the facts. Is it racist to say of mining company managers and owners: “They are all white men ... they don’t even let their wives through the door”? Probably not, but it’s pretty much in the middle of the grey area.

For all that, his prescription for nationalisation was actually quite tame. The Youth League is not, it seems, looking for wholesale nationalisation in the old style. Essentially it’s looking for a 60% shareholding in mining enterprises run at more or less arms length. He was prickly on the topic of money-hoovering public enterprises like SA Airways and Eskom, saying we should learn from our mistakes rather than be put off by them.

In fact, he got on his high horse about the issue, accusing me of implicitly claiming they were run badly because they were run by black people, despite my explicit argument that it doesn’t matter who runs nationalised companies; they typically fail not because of who runs them but because of confused lines of accountability. That’s pretty much playing the race card.

One of my reasons for participating in the debate was to try and get a feel for whether the nationalisation call is contrived or whether it emanates from a genuine sense that it’s a viable strategy. In a sense, you could say its strategic; the ANC proper allows the Youth League license to call for nationalisation but at the same time denies that it is part of its programme. Doing both simultaneously provides the ANC with muscle in its negotiations with the industry, but avoids having to explain to foreign investors, and some of its own senior members, that it is grabbing their assets.

Yet I came away with a strong sense that the call is organic; grass-roots ANC members genuinely, rightly or wrongly, want nationalisation and are passionate about getting it. I’m pretty sure, now, that they will. Perhaps in some slightly watered down form, but it’s coming.

This column was first published in The Daily Maverick, a recently-launched news and information website with a special focus on business and politics.

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Disclaimer: News24 encourages freedom of speech and the expression of diverse views. The views of columnists published on News24 are therefore their own and do not necessarily represent the views of News24.

Add your view to this conversation - comment below

Read more on:    politics  |  anc  |  julius malema

Comment on this story


Louis 10/30/2009 8:49:43 AM
I had this continuous battle in the corporate I used to work for that the best SOLD ideas are adopted, irrespective of the accuracy, validity or even sanity of the assumptions. Usually (always) the projects overrun by at least 35% of budget with 25% less functionality than intended. The problem is that we had other projects with good returns but (seemingly) not as spectacular than the ones that were signed off. The less glamorous projects were canned to free up resources for the well sold ones even though the certainty for these other projects were much higher. I do not tolerate sales people who promise the world but can not deliver. The same with politicians. In fact: I clasify this as lies and deceit. This column was an attempt to put a certain light, humorous spin on the animal that is politics but when the result is that billions of Rands are wasted on ill-informed policies based on ideology, not pragmatism, and people are suffering as a resul AND still being sold a lie, then there is little to laugh about.

Michael 10/30/2009 8:51:37 AM
What I gathered from your article... Malema is disarmingly charming, good with people, makes the occasional valid point, but fot he most part, has the IQ of a chewed toffee. That's about the same impression I had of him before.

Nol 10/30/2009 8:55:01 AM
So... The guys speaks crap really well?

Norman 10/30/2009 9:16:01 AM
That's the funny thing about the ANC (and all sub-leagues)
They've learned to make statements on both side of a fence, and deny or complain of misinterpretation when someone on either side of the fence takes exception. This allows them to harbour their true intentions right in front of our eyes without ever having to outright admit it in public. Nationalisation is coming, along with a whole bunch of other seriously concerning notions being touted by people who have no idea of their social or material implications.

Nathan 10/30/2009 9:33:52 AM
I agree with Michael and Nol.

Cynm 10/30/2009 9:48:05 AM
Can't help but notice similarities between Malema and Hitler. They were both great public speakers. They both speak directly to the people by telling them that they are/were doing everything in their power for the people. Their largest supporter group is the pour populace. They both blame the current ill's of the country on a certain population group(Remember what the end result was in Hitlers case). There are a lot more similarities which could be discussed. In the words of Yoda : Trouble, he is.

Donl 10/30/2009 10:40:23 AM
Tim Cohen really is one of the best journalists around. His commentary is always balanced and insightful. The message for me here is that Julius Malema has a constituency that he manages very very well for the benefit of the ANC. Listen to him, he's the vanguard. As Louis says, it's all in the pitch!

Tongogara 10/30/2009 11:33:54 AM
the issue of nationalisation is like the issue of the national health scheme....it works well in many many places and there is a stable method to follow in both. lets debate the merits of the issues and not the man behind the issues...
what tends to happen is that julius strikes a chord in adressing the needs of the people directley...then his critics cut him to pieces (althoug admitedley the public knows verry little about him because as the article confesses he is being type cast by the media)...do the majority of south africans want a national health plan, do the majority want nationalisation?? and if they do what is democracy!!

Pete 10/30/2009 12:12:19 PM
Good story. It is good to get another viewpoint. Malema is clearly more complicated than the portrayal in the media. Whether we like him or not, he represents an important constituency.

Boerseun 10/30/2009 12:22:05 PM
Good speakers are normally the ones who people listen to and sadly this is true, even if those speakers speak nonsense.

jo 10/30/2009 1:12:03 PM
Malema is an idiot. Heaven help us all if he becomes high up in this country. He is a racist

LuLuBug 10/30/2009 1:36:19 PM
Hmmmmm. Already in your introductory paragraph you give the game away mr Author. You hated the Nats, so subconsciously maybe, you decide to like Malema. I just often wonder why the brat's mother never taught him any manners. Because that he certainly does NOT have!

Ant 10/30/2009 1:39:53 PM
Sounds to me like the author - due to his own inadequacies - was overawed by the persona of the populist rabble rouser and now seeks to justify his own weakness by blurring the lines between the strength of personality of his opponent and the merit of his argument.

Face it. You had a golden opportunity to say it like it is, but instead you were too overawed to do so. Are public entities failing because of the inadequate skills of the affirmatives appointed to lead them? Damn right they are. But somehow, you didn't have the strength to tell it to them straight.

I guess you're right. You shouldn't engage in debates after all. Stick to writing self righteous liberal comments instead.

Big Al 10/30/2009 2:17:50 PM
Tim, its called Stockholm Syndrome - you are falling in love with your kidnapper!

Chwele 10/30/2009 2:24:22 PM
Not only is Julius Malema to be nominated and awarded the "Newsmaker of the Year" award, that is to say if he hasn't already earned the accolade, he should also be awarded the "Possibly Most Dangerous Man in South Africa Award"Mr Malema has a loose mouth and has proven tremendously entertaining at times. However, Mr Malema is slowly but surely establishing himself as a tremendously popular leader who in future years can have vast consequences for South Africa.Whilst Mr Malema has made a lot of laughable gaffs at times, there is no doubt that publicity in whatever way is good publicity. Mr Malema has proven to be the most visible of all the ANC leaders.He is building up a tremendous following amongst the lesser disposed sectors of the South African population and has somehow manged to avoid any liability for any of his postulations, which at best can be described as highly entertaining and at worst as naked racism.The real worry is that nobody, for whatever reason, in the ANC hierarchy seems prepared to temper Mr. Malema's loose mouth and reel him in from the precipes that his "exuberant" youthfulness or absolute idiocy land him in. The absolute lack of rebuke from the ANC hierarchy can be ascribed to many reasons, I,however, am limiting myself to only a possible two. The first being that Mr. Malema is a fire raging out of control and nobody, including Mr. Zuma, has got the guts to reign the upstart in. The second one being that Mr. Malema, the loose canon that he is, serves his politicasl masters brilliantly insofar that he "the joker" gets their messages out there without anybody realising that he is indeed the unofficial voice pipe for ANC. It is obvious that the ANC is under pressure from their leftist bedfellows, the SACP and Cosatu. Is it then pure coincidence that Mr. Malema is now harping on the nationalization of the country's mineral wealth or is he indeed slowly furthering the leftist faction in the ANC's doctrine of an African Democracy, which has so dismally failed everywhere else?I'm neither a prophet nor an alarmist, but I believe that South Africans as a nation, how fragmentized or polarized, should sit up and take cognisanze of the gentleman Malema. Be very wary of him because he could possibly haunt all of us in future and may even prove to have been the "King in waiting". If you consider all of the above absurd, then remember that this is Africa and more absurdities have manifested themselves in the bloodletting of millions in this complex and sometimes murky continent.

LuLuBug 10/30/2009 2:30:35 PM
@Jo Dont worry sweatpea!!! He is in such a frenzy of hate etc - that he will burn himself out loooong before his mature years.

sledgehammer 10/30/2009 3:01:50 PM
Tim, I think your analysis is close to what might happen in the future. The current situation where 10% of the population owns more than 80% of the wealth is untennable. Nationalisation or something close to it is one of spreading the cake.

Stef 10/30/2009 3:33:17 PM
sycophant? Perhaps he will support your writing.

abe 10/30/2009 4:35:08 PM
Chwele, very well said, i fully concur , excellently written !

DK 10/30/2009 5:03:15 PM
Like your take on the whole thing. It must have been interesting being in your seat. If the debate is supposed to swing the way of your opponent your points are just not heard are they!

EGE 10/30/2009 5:08:16 PM
Sledgehammer, I think that Nationalism does exactly the opposite, it does NOT spread the cake, but rather puts both the power and money in the same hands!

LEGEND OF THE GAME 10/30/2009 5:45:21 PM
julius fan all the way, what would sa be without him, BORING and BORING, cant believe SA especially suburbian south africa takes him seriously, entertains me, he must be on comdey central sometime, i'll pay to watch it....yoooorhhhhhh

Dikgosi 10/30/2009 6:37:42 PM
who knows, maybe the man has realised his shortcomings and decided the best plan is to stick his argument to statements he can back up with facts his one brain cell can remember. whatever you say mr writer, Malema needs to learn his way around fact finding and presenting facts. at this rate he will always be a pea-head to me; and i come from the same poor background as him, maybe even worse.

Steve 10/30/2009 6:56:22 PM
Robert Mugabe is highly articulate and very charming too....

Dries 10/31/2009 3:28:31 AM
Making racial statements and defending them as not being "racist" but merely statements of fact must show that the National Party influence of Martinus van Schalkwyk (who is now an honorary black) may be underestimated in the ANC.

DS 10/31/2009 7:49:48 AM
@ Chwele, extremely well written and to the point ...... agreed 100%

Marina Louw 10/31/2009 8:48:39 AM
I was also thinking of the many charismatic speakers of the past, those who brainwashed the public with irrational and twisted statements! Look what countries like Germany where Hitler and Argentina where Peron had mobilized the crouds, had to go through and suffer because of 'public high flyers'! Actually the SA media is to blame, for giving the 'Malemas' of society publicity. Why not comment on real stories where dedicated individuals give their lives to bring change to people around them. THEY are the real heroes of society, and not those who shout random remarks about nationalisation but drive around in fancy cars the capitalist taxpayers have sponcered! Please focus on
individuals whose positively assist their fellowmen.

Bruce 10/31/2009 9:28:15 AM
Well done Tim, surely debates and discussions like these can only improve common understandings although those skilled with the gift of the gab are hard to put on a spot, especially when they can play the race card at anytime. And surely those who keep seeing things in terms of race are .... racist? by definition. Sure we have a legacy of the past, but the divisions here are more along cultural lines than anything else, although as you know things on the ground with the youth and generally very positive. Was it Piet Koornhof at the Great Hall? lol

I have another point: why the squabble over state ownership of the mines? Firstly, is this an implicit admission that the industries moves to 'empower' (read 'enrich', 'co-opt') a select few in order to score BEE brownie points yet retain their privileged has failed? Is this just a case of other 'disempowereds' standing in line for their share or the mineral wealth pie? And lastly, isnt it a bit late: the abundant mineral riches have been long plundered by the imperialists: we are just the aftermath. Let's move on?

Yeah and I was also hoping Comrade Malema might be invited to attend the 25th anniversary of the ECC thise weekend: so he might have his racial blinkers defused and join the party there at Spier, apparently he is joller of note, although the same can be said of many of the former conscripts :)

allie 10/31/2009 1:04:07 PM
It`s media people like you that gives the Malemas the stature that they think they have.

Shakib 10/31/2009 2:27:23 PM
It's how the ANC divides and conquers - they start by taking press critics into their bosom and voila! - those critics become cheerleaders.

Sell-out.

thoughts 10/31/2009 7:08:33 PM
Its WHAT he thinks and says that is so dangerous. The fact that he can "win" a debate so easily is a "lose" for the country and all those masses who hang on to the sloganeering.

ex-pat 11/1/2009 3:04:37 AM
Chwele, you can't spell, but you are insightful and very eloquent - people, take note of what he has said.

billy 11/1/2009 9:30:04 AM
Tim "Brown Nose" Cohen

Vrye Denker 11/1/2009 10:58:38 AM
Sorry to break this to you, seeing as you are a pleasant individual, but you weren't invited to a debate: you were invited to a farce. If the deck is stacked against you and the audience is clearly a rent-a-crowd, you should rather run for the hills. I hope you learned a valuable lesson.

Francois 11/1/2009 11:00:15 AM
If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullsh1t, obviously Julius pulled the latter over you!

Bruce Hardman 11/1/2009 11:48:51 AM
Ant well said!!!! Chwele you are a joke!!!

Donald 11/1/2009 5:55:48 PM
Hi Tim
It has always been said that "everyman has his price" . What was yours?

Geejay 11/2/2009 1:43:27 AM
Finally a person who scored less than Malema for woodwork.

Nadsza 11/2/2009 8:52:45 AM
We are creating our own worst nighmare. Let me explain. Most of us feel and react very negatively towards Malema. We think he is a national threat and as such constantly monitor his actions and words. Due to our intense interest the media are responding in kind by constantly reporting on him. Because of all this his followers are starting to support him more passionately. They feel defensive towards him as the constantly embatttled underdog. They run on irrational emotions supported by a lack of education and experience. The best thing we could possibly do is to completely ignore him. COMPLETELY.

MikeF 11/2/2009 12:58:24 PM
The meeting with Prof Jansen must have been very therapeutic for Julius Malema.
I was expecting Julius to come out smoking and incite students to
riot/boycott for Prof JJ to be removed from the Free State University.

Instead Julius comes out of the meeting smoking the peace pipe, calmly and confidently supporting Prof JJ, declaring “we cannot feed Prof JJ to the enemy”.
This is in stark contrast to the ANC’s Blade who came out so sharply against Prof JJ’s “act of reconciliation”.

Julius should spend more time in the company of Prof JJ so that the Prof’s wise counsel can guide him to become the leader that President Zuma so dearly
wants Julius to become. Julius, spend more time in the company of Prof JJ, where egos are deflated and meaningful discussion and reasoning are inflated.

This exercise is a very small but significant example of the spirit of ubuntu, reconciliation and Nation building that is possible in our Country, if we will only allow it.
Viva Julius Malema Viva. Viva Professor Jansen Viva.

This is another one of our South African miracles.

cliffordk 11/3/2009 10:04:37 AM
malema mostly speak what is in his mind, he doesnt care on how people around him will react.he is the type of politician i will admire most.the problem is the media has already painted him with dark monster paint.i will compare him with mr president ROBERT he does take non sence.malema doesnt pretend while he speak.to me he is still a voice of those poor old ladies and men who eaten urinated food at the reitz resident.when malema express himself towards racial issues he speaks their language so to them he still a hero no matter what media says

Eugene 11/4/2009 1:43:31 PM
@Chwele: You're analysis is spot on. Old Peter Mokaba was in the same league as Julius. The problem is that guys like them can very quickly polarise the majority of people into believing their points of view. Let's think about this: If Malema should suddenly turn "Idi Aminish", could he and his partners in crime overthrow the ANC? Think about that for a moment... I think it is possible. Clearly Malema is a strategic tool being used by the ANC, but he populism could turn out to bite them, if his ego grows and he becomes more power-hunger. If you have the majority of poor people on your side, you could easliy manipulate them into believing that you are on their side. How easy is it to show that someone like Tokyo Sexwale has a billion in the bank and only cares about filling his own pockets. If you create a perception that you stand for the people, that you know their pain and also grew up poor, how easy can you not manipulate those people into turning against the ANC leaders?
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