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Viv

South Africa
News24 User

'People not helping themselves'

by Viv
2009-11-05 09:29

I often wonder what atrocities have to happen in this country before the masses realise that South Africa is making a fast decent into a Zimbabwe-like state.

How poor do people have to be before they stand up and fight for their rights? How many people have to be without running water and electricity before they stand up and fight? How many more people have to be without work before they stand up and fight?

How low must this country go before the masses realise that the government doesn't care about us common folk.

Why is it that at every election it is the same government, who steals from their own brethrens pockets, elected into power? How much more must be taken away before people realise they are not helping themselves by voting in a government just because they are the same colour.

How many more houses in Sandton must be bought for ministers with the working classes tax money?  

How many more schools must be without desks, books and basic necessities before their eyes are opened?

How many more hospitals must be without lifesaving equipment just because a minister wanted a fancy Mercedes?

Forget about what skin colour the president is and vote for a government that will bring this country back to its former glory.  Forget about apartheid and racism, we all live here in Africa so we might as well just get on with living together.

Viv

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jd 11/5/2009 9:37:40 AM
I like unicorns. This is old news. stop complaining and start planning. What possiblesequence of events could possibly get you to your ideals. Then see ifyou can make it happen.

Deon 11/5/2009 9:42:02 AM
Dear Viv - it's because the masses are all stupid and uneducated. As long as the government will exploit and use them as their "VOOOTAH'S"

Cracker 11/5/2009 9:50:43 AM
It is a hopeless situation. Each must ask him/herself the only sensible question still left: What can I do to get myself and my family out of this mess?

Zizo 11/5/2009 9:52:01 AM
Which planet are you living in? The poor have houses, water and electricity, they are exempted for other basic services like water, grants for previously disadvantaged (thanks to the ANC grannies receive as much as R800-00 p/m), fully furnished schools are now built in the villages and townships, tarred roads in villages, safety and security for all the masses, free hospital care (NHI in progress) which means the poor will be taken care of in places like the sandton medi-clinic, subsidized transport.

The government continue to put its full weight in service delivery and fighting corruption. You failed to mention where the government is failing. I assume it is because the government won't subsidise your ADT premium or the rugby stadium needs serious renovations. I am trying to show you the different level of needs that we expect from government. Your needs are in the top level while the disadvantaged are still approaching the lowest level.

Intelligent people voted for the ANC, I will vote for them until Jesus comes back.

samsam 11/5/2009 9:53:32 AM
Can this be done over night, did you do costing thereof,if you were concerned you would worry of apartheid consequences, people were marginalised denied, opportunities to advance themselves, for the current govt will take 350yrs to address racists failures

Koochie 11/5/2009 9:53:43 AM
Go to any country in the world, all Governments are the same, not just SA.

GT 11/5/2009 9:54:36 AM
Viv you are 100% correct, but the ANC keeps brainwashing the masses every election time, AND, it works !!! some people will believe anything if you give your story enough emotion and hype. Typical mass mentality ...

SimonP 11/5/2009 9:54:39 AM
From posts on this site it is clear that some want SA to descend into chaos, they hail Mugabe as a great African leader, often requesting the exact same policies he deployed in Zim should be deployed here.
The only reason anyone would want this is because they have an inferiority complex and actually want SA to be a victim so they can get their begging bowls out a plead to the evil west.

Eles 11/5/2009 9:56:25 AM
I think most people do not understand the consequence of their vote or mind too much that the ministers have the fancy cars and excessive lifestyles. They think it is their right - personally I think they are all way overpaid considering their general uselessness and incompetence. The tea lady at work takes her social grants for granted she has no concept of how the government gets their money. They listen to the Julius's of the country and agree? We are a ticking time bomb. I personally hold the ANC and each and every ANC voter accountable for this mess which is why I will not donate one cent to charity or employ anyone in my home. I used to be most caring and generous however you start to care less how can you honestly help people who don't want to help themselves. We need to close our borders to help our poor, create colleges for adult education for underprivileged to obtain skills by using lotto funds and have shelters where people can go for a hot meal. Street children need to be swept up into orphanages so that they can be taken care of and schooled before they turn to a life of crime and/or are abused. Government must sort out the hospitals the problem there is too many chiefs and not enough indians actually doing the work. Government must stop using tax payers money to bail out incompetent parastatals such as Eskom, SAA and SABC. Shape up or ship out ANC you are useless!

Johan 11/5/2009 9:56:32 AM
Former Glory....mmm for that to happen we need people in this country that want work....but like the poster said that was held in the air by one of the toi toi comrades.....we don’t want work we want jobs

Tsotsi 11/5/2009 9:57:13 AM
In Africa a country can never stoop too low for their inhabitants..... Sorry state(sic) of affairs!

ChapStick 11/5/2009 9:58:11 AM
The answer to all your questions is very simple...when the ANC ship sinks into the sea along with the stench of its thieving crew.

R4 11/5/2009 9:58:15 AM
History repeats itself, the SANDF memebers of the 1980's all owned T-Shirts with "Rhodesia is comming" on them at one time. The collapse of government is inevitable and the white man will once again be blamed and the uneducated massed exploited, given empty promises just to buy them (the leadership) time...what the masses must realise is that true democracy is defined as "the people shall govern" and this is clearly not the case at the moment!!
Democracy is being undermined by comunist unions and autocrats hungry for power!
Bugger "the struggle" the true liberals are all gone and retired, all's that's left are these ANC thugs like Malema riding the 'revolutionary comrade' train to stay in power...shame...

stephen 11/5/2009 10:02:13 AM
the reason why poverty is still existing is the fact that south africans are lazy not all but many. go to townships, you will see grown man sitting and smoking not working at all. They complain about a lack of jobs but when you buy newspapers there are jobs everywhere for skilled and unskilled people. So i cant blame the government cause there is equal opportunity for every one.

Sinudeity @samsam 11/5/2009 10:02:53 AM
Apartheid? You fail to see that the new ANC top dawg elites, are only there to serve a TINY minority. Just like apartheid. As for zizo and 'serves' delivered. Please. You get free housing, free electricity, you dont pay for it. The TAX payers pay for it. You are living in a democracy where you dont have to do ANYTHING, just get given. And those that do work, get taxed to death, to support these lifestyles.

@Eles 11/5/2009 10:04:23 AM
You SHOULD become the President!

Chich @ Zizo 11/5/2009 10:04:28 AM
Hey stop smoking crack!

Kgosi ya leboa 11/5/2009 10:05:19 AM
I still believe that this current government within the fifteen years that they have been in government has done so much for the masses than the previous regime that was in power for more than 300 years, this government although plagued by lack of skills has managed to raise thousands of black diamonds like myself with proper policies such as AA and BEE, and for that I think I would give them another twenty years and our problems would be wiped off, when the infrustaure was developed for the minority and now the majority is using it, there is bound to be an over usage, hence we have potholes, a clear indication that the roads that were meant for a few people are now being used by many people that this current government empowered to the point that they themselves can afford cars, the reason we have electricity outages is basically because the majority now can afford electricity that was meant for the few, hence we are now currently making proper infrastructural developments to address the shortage.

Halfwise 11/5/2009 10:06:06 AM
Can you please give JZ’s new gov a break please. He just walked into the office, let him settle down first.

Blame Apartheid 11/5/2009 10:08:54 AM
Keep the masses uneducated and uninformed and they will continue to vote ANC. The ANC know that if the masses were better educated and had access to information they would vote them out so it is ANC policy to keep the majority in this country poor and stupid. If it wasnt their policy why have they done so little in 16 years to better educate the masses.

Barry 11/5/2009 10:09:22 AM
Zizo, On what planet are you living?

Johan 11/5/2009 10:11:15 AM
@samsam 350years?....I would say never. Not this bunch of robbers and thieves that is currently in government. They are not interested of fixing anything. They only want to fill their pockets and the pockets of their friends with tax payer’s money

Poloyatonki 11/5/2009 10:12:23 AM
Have you ever asked yourself why we have poor people today, this whole thing was started by the injustice gov. its not going to be rectified today or tomorrow or even in your life time. And on top of that the apartheid masters went unpunished. Poverty is an apartheid wound that will take years to heal.

Dari 11/5/2009 10:17:44 AM
Just look at Zim - have you seen the masses there rise up and fight? Unfortunately, for the people to rise up the vast majority of the population has to be in dire straits. The ones who line their pockets have to be a select few, supported by an oppressive body of cadre which instills fear in the people. Just look at the mass uprisings in the late 80's in the former Communist East European countries. What you have here is a party which is supported by the majority of the population. Until the ANC loses the majority support there will be no mass movements.

@ Poloyantonki 11/5/2009 10:17:46 AM
Oh please then tell me why there is poverty in places like India even??? There was no apartheid there! Get real, look at facts, not opinions. stop talking and do something!

HN 11/5/2009 10:18:18 AM
How many more of them are going to be born without COMMON SENSE?? seems to me they want to be disadvantaged down todden with a hand out stretched and every turn. Heaven knows Africa have not evolved! History has not taught anyone African state a lesson YET! Now we have it on our door step, God help us.

R4@Poloyatonki 11/5/2009 10:20:00 AM
Just as I said 'blame the white man'...earn yourself some balls and move forward!!!Grow yourself and the nation and stop blaming the white man!!!

oral 11/5/2009 10:24:06 AM
I think the ANC has done a great job! Take a look at these examples of success:
1, Eskom
2, SAA
3, SABC
4, Education
5, Crime
6, Poverty
7, Illegal Emigrants

You see the ANC has done wonders with all the above and continue to do so! Cant really think of anything negative about them, and also look what great roll models the ANCYL are providing for our Youth!

Ruard 11/5/2009 10:24:12 AM
@Poloyatonki Where exactly do you think you would have been today, if the white settlers never came to South Africa...?

Kgosi ya leboa @Blame Apartheid 11/5/2009 10:24:26 AM
I am learned myself,in fact this year I would be completing my doctorate yet I am still voting the ANC, it is not about the education level, it is about the ability to weigh between the devils you have to vote for, the ANC remains the better devil amongst the political parties, whether by rhetoric or propaganda is does not matter, the truth is that they are making the right noises that attracts the majority, In fact the majority are far better than yourself sir that hide behind the computer and vilifying everything that the government does, the masses that you so much despise understand the concept of holding the government accountable, and they do so by not hiding behind the desks, they come in the front of the Television so that Jacob Zuma can understand their frustrations and speed up the service delivery.

NiCcI 11/5/2009 10:24:48 AM
@ZIZO - When last did you watch the news or TV? Just a week ago there was a programme about the poor people needing houses and how the home affairs people are selling these RDP houses fraudulently. There you already have one example of corruption and the poor not being taken care of. Not to mention the protests that have been going on about service delivery, for example at Standerton.

Furthermore, the government uses government money to buy their luxurious cars and houses, while the poor have to live in 1 or 2 bedroomed homes with 4 children! The fact that the government can't bail EISHKOM out also proves that funds are mismanaged due to especially corruption.

These are but a few examples of where government is failing. Open your eyes to the problems in our country.

Cracker 11/5/2009 10:26:48 AM
It is untrue that the the previous government or whites ruled this country for 350 or 300 years. The lie demonstrates propaganda and a lack of history knowledge.

Whatever@Zizo 11/5/2009 10:26:54 AM
Zizo, please don't waste space on this forum, if you cast your mind back earlier this week, you think 80% and 30% = 100%, so please give your space to someone has a clue.

Juan - PLEASE UNDERSTAND 11/5/2009 10:28:08 AM
It IS an age old African tradition for the 'kings' to get all the luxuries and best houses and cars, etc while their 'subjects' live in poverty, without food or clothing, etc.. This is EXACTLY what these masses voted for and itis EXACTLY what they got. We just have to pay our tax and accept this. I DONT understand this. But then again, I am to stupid to understand how throwing chicken bones into the air will cure a disease either.

BUSTA 11/5/2009 10:28:36 AM
@ZIZO: BWA HA HA HA - What country are you living in?!!! I can take a walk down to any township and all of the stuff that you say is there is not there - I know this because as an architectural student, we often head into townships and other areas requiring development. You obviously work for the ANC because you sound like they do at election time, you're a fake and it's pretty easy to see through your crud.

Samsam & Poloyatonki 11/5/2009 10:28:54 AM
Is there any information you can provide to support your arguements that it will take 300+ years to allieviate poverty?

witseun 11/5/2009 10:28:58 AM
"...bring this country back to its former glory". What former are you referring to Viv? The problems our country face have been around for a 100 hundred years now?! You have been blinded by the anti-ANC and SA-the-next-Zim propaganda. We had self-serving politicians back then in your so-called "glory days" and we have them now. We had uneducated masses back then and still have them now. Its only your perception of the problems that has changed. Do yourself a big favour and try to realise that its all the same all over the world. We live in a developing country and we have to deal with developing country problems, just like Brazil, India and Russia have to. If its not your cup of tea, go to Aus or Canada. But please, stop this Zim comparison. It really is ridiculous.

@Poloyatonki 11/5/2009 10:30:01 AM
Have you ever asked yourself why you support a government that does not do its job?

NiCcI 11/5/2009 10:30:09 AM
@ZIZO - By the way, if your government is so great, they can take care of the illegal immigrants in the Methodist Church! Don't ask our help if the government is so great and, according to you, aren't failing at anything!

Sinudeity @Halfwise 11/5/2009 10:30:21 AM
Just walked into the office? Its almost been 300 days. Almost been a year. What has been done? What has been lost?

Sinudeity @Poloyatonki 11/5/2009 10:32:23 AM
Have you asked yourself, why we STILL have poor people today? According to stats, there are more poor people in SA today, then back in apartheid (Taking into consideration population growth).

@ poliodonkey , Zizo and samsam 11/5/2009 10:35:26 AM
You three must the the most stupid nut cases I have ever seen. Its morons like you that will take this country down. You will deserve every suffering coming your way. While your anc mastars will live the high life. Just like mugabe.You wont beleive anyone so you will see.The day wil come when you wil starve to death and you will stail blame apartheid and vote anc. Eish I cant baleev this african way. Glock

Baas Koos 11/5/2009 10:36:34 AM
@ Zizo.... ja... everything was given... schools... universities... hospitals…. But then why still plunder and burn them??? Tell me why????

ands@Poloyatonki 11/5/2009 10:36:46 AM
Ethiopia is the only country not to have colonial influence.They are one of the worst of all African countries for poverty.So your argument of apartheid causing poverty is quite frankly a joke.The prime cause of poverty is overbreeding, something that seems prevelant in All African countries.

David Johnson 11/5/2009 10:38:07 AM
A few years ago it was against the law for me to walk in the area that I now own a home in, I take my little children to places I was banned from when I was their age, I now have a career that I was denied access to while working at a white-owned company, despite having two universities degrees & years experience. I can make plans for the future of my family, especially my little children, with the confidence that our dreams are attainable in this life time, in this country, because we are treated as equals by this government. I am respected at work, in my community, but most importantly, by my family, my wife & my little children. I obey the laws of the land & value the freedom I now enjoy because of the sacrifices of the masses. Long live the ANC, long live, let freedom reign!

Tsotsi@Kgosi ya leboa 11/5/2009 10:39:58 AM
They were not in power for 300 years?! You've been brainwashed. Not even 3 quarters of a centuary - More like 50 years. And see what they've accomplished.

SimonP 11/5/2009 10:41:54 AM
Voting for a party that puts itself above the law is a recipe for disaster. It has been done in so may other African countries and people still cant recognise SA is doing the exact same thing. Why copy countries that have failed?

Nelly 11/5/2009 10:45:24 AM
Viv please move on.This is a banana republic and things can only get worse...but hey -keep voting for the ANC...

SimonP@Zizo 11/5/2009 10:53:28 AM
"Intelligent people voted for the ANC, I will vote for them until Jesus comes back." once again you prove you are so indoctrinated you can not see.

GeePMB 11/5/2009 10:53:51 AM
In Zim the poor STILL vote Zanu-PF years after independance. It's called indoctrination! (Brain-washing)

Sambok 11/5/2009 10:55:33 AM
@Poloyatonki 11/5/2009 10:12:23 AM
I have worked in 26 African countries and saw poverty in all of them. I didn't know that Apartheid spread that far....
@Kgosi ya leboa 11/5/2009 10:05:19 AM
"the previous regime that was in power for more than 300 years": 1962 - 1995 does not equate to 300 years. In fact, 15 years into Apartheid our South African Rand was stronger than the UK Pound.
Put that in your malala pipe and smoke it.

Juan @ ANC suppota's 11/5/2009 10:55:35 AM
Please explain to me how your president and his minister buddies expensive BMW's have benefitted YOU. Do those cars feed your children? Do those cars provide you with shelter and electricity? MORONS!

Trish 11/5/2009 10:56:44 AM
How can things improve when there is such RADICALISM and RACISM around. Humans have always fought over land - at first for basic needs nowadays for greed. Rock paintings tell stories of how a race used to live before they were driven out by those from central Africa and ones who came via ships.

Sinudeity 11/5/2009 10:59:35 AM
Its becoming so bad (corruption, and wastage of tax monies), that the ANC will spend millions to celebrate making speeches, or tabling documentation. The people want bread? Let them eat cake and name changed street signs.

Clintonv @ Zizo 11/5/2009 11:01:01 AM
What planet you from? You have been away from South Africa too long. One thing you failed to mention, is how the ANC waste funds and expect the working class (not your R4000pm or less) to fund this country. These are only about 5 million TAX payers (PAYE). Over the last year I paid about R150000 in PAYE, 14% vat on my car (R60,000). VAT on my water, electricity, Rates, Bank charges, food, SABC, just to name a few and they EXPECT more. Your lazy comrades prefer to steal and expect free housing, electricity, water...But when YOUR possessions get stolen, you complain...We just accept it and move on. Think (We see in your case, its almost impossible) before you open your RACIST trap!!!

Tumelo 11/5/2009 11:05:29 AM
You people just cant stop complaining, even going to an extent of spewing unfactual statements. 15 Years ago, a quality of life for 9% of the population was hyper-superior at the expense of the rest (91%). Now the play field is leveled and many of those that were excluded's lives are improved, you complain. I suggest we make it difficult for people to buy Schedule 4-6 medication, and all the whiners will die a natural death.

2020 11/5/2009 11:09:50 AM
I am starting to think that the poor want to stay poor as they consistently act in ways that lead to disaster.

Throwing money at the problem also doesn't bring any sort of relief to the poor either; it merely enables them to continue acting the way they do for a longer period of time while dragging everyone else down with them.

Johan Britz @ Poloyatonki 11/5/2009 11:12:29 AM
Apartheid to blame for poverty? Maybe a little bit yes. Do you know where I think the majority of poverty comes from? Every single black couple in the townships having 5 and more kids they can't support. So here you have 5 starving kids who one day, hopefully marry, but probably not, creating 5 (or more) additional beggars knocking on my window asking for a handout. Was that mentality my fault, or apartheid's fault? Nope.

When I stop at a Stop street, and there is a black person begging, they ALWAYS come to the car with the white people in, they NEVER go beg at the fat "mama" with her BEE deal BMW because they know they'll get nothing.

Why is that? Could it be that the "set" black people couldn't care less about the "masses"? Hau, at one time I can't believe!

JC 11/5/2009 11:13:27 AM
Didn't you know? The poor have been promised everything for free since they could open their eyes. They firmly believe they are entitled to something for nothing - free housing, water, electricity, health, education. It will just fall from the sky because of the miracle that is Zuma. How do you make someone work who believes he does not have to, and is owed everything for free?

Dyl@Zizo 11/5/2009 11:13:55 AM
How can you make a statement like "Intelligent people voted for the ANC, I will vote for them until Jesus comes back."??? that's just crazy... you clearly cant be intelligent if you would just follow the ANC blindly. I support the DA but would never make a statement like that.

norman 11/5/2009 11:14:14 AM
We need Mugabe to come and sort out the masses,just like he did in Matabele land with his red brigade.Then the will stop crying like babies-you get what you fools voted for!

@Tumelo 11/5/2009 11:14:21 AM
Please quote thess "unfactual statements" you refer to. Are they from Zizo by any chance?

Spartan 11/5/2009 11:14:31 AM
Black people who comment on these pages are beneficiaries of the ANC elitist (failed) BEE policies, of course they are going to vote for the ANC till the cows come home, they are comfortable, nice job, fancy car(s), live in nice suburbs, they dont really care or understand that in 20 years time, they will be running away from their own dictator govt. unless of course they are part of it.

@Tumelo 11/5/2009 11:15:50 AM
we whine - you burn down universities and tyres and throw rocks. i suggest we make it difficult for you to get anti retrovirals - what then?

samsam@JUAN 11/5/2009 11:16:44 AM
You are not ashamed of your stupidity, those cars ensured that BMW is retained in the country compared to GM, did you think how many employees in BM,if there was no market what would happen, you fool I love you

@Zizo 11/5/2009 11:17:23 AM
I have news for you, Jesus came back in 1914 already and started ruiling as king amidst his enemies, like the corrupt governments of this world wich will soon be wiped away.

ChapStick@Zizo@Tumelo 11/5/2009 11:18:19 AM
You two deserve each other.

Johan Britz @ Halfwise 11/5/2009 11:19:46 AM
Ok, how long does he need to settle? Can you maybe give us a date please? Zuma's time is also running out on those 500 000 jobs he was going to create by the end of the year. Seems like he's going to have to employ a helluva lot of people to wash his cars.

TIA 11/5/2009 11:22:04 AM
Why help yourself when you are promised everything for free? Why help yourself when you can expect bail outs from the evil west? Why demand an accountable government when you can sit on your arse and do nothing? Why bother at all when you you want to be down trodden? TIA and its here to stay.

nigel 11/5/2009 11:24:11 AM
Look at Zimbabwe & you will have your answer. The ANC is not very different from ZanuPF, the masses of Zimbabwe are not different from those in SA, even when its too late & there is no food or water, even then do nothing, just look next door, its happening right now, the Govt is a dictatorship that has raped the country of its wealth, the masses are poorer than poor & country has collapsed & the masses do nothing, why do you expect the masses here to be any different?

geanann 11/5/2009 11:25:56 AM
@Tumelo
15 yers ago the average South African had a life expectancy of 65, today it is down to 51.
Today the wealth gap is larger than 15 years ago...thanks to ANC and unions
http://letterdash.com/g.annandale/closing-the-wealth-gap

Andrew Pienaar 11/5/2009 11:30:15 AM
@Tumelo, and all the victims and sufferers of aids will dissappear too.

Samsam 11/5/2009 11:32:31 AM
Oh right the reason the ministers spend millions on cars is to ensure BMW stay afloat.
Are you a stand up comedian or just thick?

kolobe 11/5/2009 11:37:40 AM
former glory??you must be crazy.the only "former" about this country is apartheid and you glorify it.the "former" glory is when you and your people received services.now everyone is eligible for service.difference between now and then is people moved to the cities and its causing problems.you need more social schooling

wayne 11/5/2009 11:39:49 AM
Africa's general pattern is repeating itself in SA - education a mess, crime out of control, corruption rife, power hungry politicians feathering their own nests, people promoted to jobs that are not competent to do. Question : "Is this a common cultural thing ? i.e. as a normal citizen, you support your tribal leader no matter what he does ?

Blame Apartheid@Kgosi ya Leboa 11/5/2009 11:39:59 AM
Well done in achieving a doctarate, pity its not in common sense. You openly accept a corrupt and uneducated president who "makes the right noises" but in reality does nothing. You claim the masses, that for some you believe I despise, understand accountablity, why then do they accept convicted criminals as MPS, why do they accept money going missing from municipalities, why do they accept mis-carriage of justice (Shaik), why do they accept empty promises and why do they never question their beloved ANC?

Johan 11/5/2009 11:42:35 AM
How can people vote for the ANC? The same party that see the majority of their supporters as 2nd rate citizens. Yes I said 2nd rate. If the ANC felt and believe so strongly in the ability of their supporters why do they need laws to get them into a job or a sports team? Are they not good enough to achieve this on own merits? They are running the country and companies into the ground just to enrich a few people.

troy 11/5/2009 11:42:55 AM
i also want to put a blue light in my car.

samsa@@@@@@@@ 11/5/2009 11:46:43 AM
"stupid nut" I guess its you, this country was like Zim pre94, did you worry of SA GDP pre94 compared to post94, blahblah what a stupid

Author (Viv) at Zizo, Tumelo and Samsam 11/5/2009 11:50:30 AM
To all you sheep - I hope that you have all read the article just published on how SA is spending R45 MILLION on the Miss World pageant. I would like to know if you think our government is spending this money wisely? Try explaining your government out of this complete and utter mismanagement of tax payers money??

Carlo 11/5/2009 11:50:35 AM
Read "Animal Farm" by George Orwell based on the reign of Stalin. You will see the similarities between the book in South Africa and the way our future will be. Boxer the horse represented the masses that will follow the leaders to their death, he couldn't read...

realist 11/5/2009 11:51:04 AM
Dear Viv, what will happen in this country is that the middleclass will eventually disappear. Entrepreneurs will be the first to go and you will find that there is only two main groups left. The masses that will breed uncontrolably with bigger demands on the fiscal purse which will run dry and the rich that will be politically connected and feeding of the minerals of this country and who does not give a flying fig about the poor. That is the story of Africa.

Jacques 11/5/2009 11:56:19 AM
I can not believe some of the brain dead comments I read on this thread. If you are fortunate enough to have benifited after '94 good for you - you are in the minority - I suppose it is every man for himself and damn those that still suffer. This type of thinking is not thinking at all.

SimonP@kgosi 11/5/2009 11:56:58 AM
If you are so learned how is it you think the previous regime was in power for 300 years? Is it because you have been told this and accepted it as a fact without doing any research?

Answers please 11/5/2009 11:58:12 AM
Yet again we see baseless statements from pro ANC muppets that when questioned NEVER answer.

Michael 11/5/2009 11:58:27 AM
We all know that the majority of the people in SA are total morons. Even education will not change that. SA will keep on detiroarating, which is unfortunate. Just give it some more time.

Spartan 11/5/2009 11:58:49 AM
@Zizo, Tumelo & other Elitist BEE beneficiaries, dont be naive, we are not trying be be a$$holes or whine, we just want a sustainable country where the Govt. functions, the economy works, crime is not out of control & our children can get jobs & have a future, that's all, not asking for more.

Golum@Zizo 11/5/2009 12:00:32 PM
No other planet will accept Zizo... Zizo, wake up dude! I'm trying, but I fail to understand your reasoning

Johnny Motsamai 11/5/2009 12:06:36 PM
Dear Viv, I just wanna know if you're black or white? Then I can answer you...

@Zizo 11/5/2009 12:15:23 PM
And this country will stay the disaster it is until Jesus comes.......

garyh 11/5/2009 12:20:54 PM
'we whine - you burn down universities and tyres and throw rocks. i suggest we make it difficult for you to get anti retrovirals - what then?' Very well put - TUMELO, please read it again!

wtf?? 11/5/2009 12:23:17 PM
@Johnny Motsamai; what difference does it make? you racists?

@Johnny Motsamai 11/5/2009 12:27:34 PM
Why would you need to know his race? You have different answers for different races?

BLACKsoWHAT! 11/5/2009 12:31:11 PM
I suppose you are speaking on behalf of the DA, vote for a white party that'll save the day. Hate to break it down to you this way, but from here on in, till god knows when...its better the devil you know because the one known before was atrocious.

@2020 11/5/2009 12:36:04 PM
Talking about throwing money at a problem... look at AIDS. The government has been throwing money at it since 1994 and people STILL do not listen and are still promiscuous and have unprotected sex! And don't forget.... AIDS and HIV is also something "created" by the whites to distroy the blacks!!!

Viv @ Nelly 11/5/2009 12:36:51 PM
Um....what would make you think I voted for the ANC?

Golum 11/5/2009 12:37:08 PM
Tumelo, please define quality of life from your perspective and explain how the playing field is leveled.

Darryl 11/5/2009 12:43:37 PM
"before they stand up and fight?"

Are you seriously advocating war here or have you been dropped on your head?

How about "before they start educating themselves?" or "before they invest in their own communities?"

How long, Viv, do you think that you would survive in this "fight" you propose the unwashed masses embark on?

Leon 11/5/2009 12:51:57 PM
Ziso -and if you were in Zim, no doubt you would still vote for Bob...

Ds 11/5/2009 12:51:57 PM
Whats the difference between the past regime and current regime? The division in society is still there on just taken another form in that society is based on a class system - peasants (poor), middle class and upper (ruling) class. Please people take those silly green, yellow and black goggles off and see things for what they ARE!

Life is life 11/5/2009 12:53:41 PM
You will all do yourselfs a huge favour if you open your eyes and see life for what it is. It really doesn't matter what anyone says. It simply is the way this world is put together. A world full of oppinionated twats that spends all its time and energy on trying to convince each other how to think and do. There is no single human being that who says something in favour of other. Its all about defending your own interest. We are all alike. Thare is squat you can do about it. But you can try life with it, how ever difficult it may seem. Live and let be!

Viv @ Johnny 11/5/2009 12:55:25 PM
What does it matter what colour my skin is? This fixation with colour is what dividing us. Cant you answer the questions as a South African?

AJ 11/5/2009 12:58:54 PM
Firstly all you 'educated' people commenting here, 'Education' does not equal knowledge or wisdom, Education basically prepares you to do A job and mostly go hand-in-hand with indoctranation. If you just believe what you are told, without doing research and checking the facts, you are but a mindless robot following your programming. Its like agent Smith in the matrix anology says: Once we started thinking for you, it became OUR civilization.' If someone else is doing your thinking for you(ie. you just swallow and believe what your told because its someone with 'authority' saying it) then my friend, you are utterly and hopelessly enslaved.

Viv @ Darryl 11/5/2009 1:07:12 PM
Darryl is is a figure of speech. Stand up and fight for their rights to basic services, for education, fight for investment into their communities. Duh! Not actual war silly. I think you fell out of the stupid tree and hit every branch on the way down bud.

chillepeppa 11/5/2009 1:19:24 PM
Difference between the self serving politicians of the "glory days" and the entitled ones of today is the 1st ones were evil up front. You KNEW where you stood with them and what the consequences would be if you stepped out of line. The politicians of today... well they say one thing and do something different. It's a game of "raai, raai riepa" with them.

Joeman 11/5/2009 1:21:01 PM
Let's make it simple: Keep on voting your DA and we, the blacks will keep on voting the ANC. There should no one trying to convince another to vote for what what party. Cope,IFP and UDM will soon close shop and their supporters will definetely vote for the ANC. Your DA will keep on barking for the loose bones.

AJ 11/5/2009 1:25:30 PM
O ye, and freedoms origin is knowledge, no amount of toi-toi or terrorism will ever get anybody freedom, it will only result in the replacement of rulers with new rulers.

Johan Britz @ Joeman 11/5/2009 2:06:16 PM
"Your DA will keep on barking for the loose bones". WTF does that mean? Please? Every now and then, more often than not, you black okes fall out of tree hitting every stupid branch on the way down, saying stuff that completely doesn't make any sense. Was that even English? I can't even give you another example because I find it hard to get my brain into that "idle" vibe to think something similar up. Did you finish school? And I don't mean 35% pass rate.

POPULATION FACT 11/5/2009 2:33:57 PM
I have a solution to reduce poverty
1. You can only have Maximum of two Children
2. Yo must pay tax as long as you are working temp or permanent
3. You can stay on RDP house only if you are not working and when you get a job you must be removed
3. Have a boarder conrol reduce illegal immigrant
4.Privatize all government business (eskom//SAA)
5.10 % of company profit should go to social responsibilty
6. All unniversity graduate must do community service at township and rural area for six month (compulsory as other people do not know what poor is all about i can issure you that there is also balck people who never experience poor life style at township.
7. Only those who pay tax can vote at provincial election

graham@joeman 11/5/2009 2:43:29 PM
and you keep on voting your anc, you and your ilk will be barking for loose crumbs, and we will be gone,the da supporters wont financially support you forever

BLACKsoWHAT!@graham 11/5/2009 3:22:27 PM
You'll be gone, gone where Canada, Oz, NZ? i doubt it...hahahaha you are going nowhere man cause you can't afford to, the assumption that people like you leaving SA will be disaster for SA is BS. Take a drive to orania or whatever it is.

Joh @ Kgosi ya leboa 11/5/2009 3:23:05 PM
I'm impressed with your comment. I might not agree with everything, but an answer without a hint of racism and no mud slinging. I didn't read the rest of the comments as there will be some ugly stuff as usual. But in my opinion is this a fine example of how a debate should be conducted. Thank you.

raptor 11/5/2009 6:40:17 PM
Bitch bitch whine whine... Stop complaining and do something about it... BURN, PILLAGE and PLUNDER, it is a lot more fun than signing useless petitions... hahahaha

Mike 11/5/2009 11:33:33 PM
Sorry Viv, you have two choices. Grin and bear it, it's the African way. Or leave. The ANC are corrupt, and absolute power corrupts even more. A case of Monkey see, Monkey do........

@Koochie 11/6/2009 1:17:38 AM
You have no Idea what you are talking about mate!

Try-working 11/6/2009 12:05:29 PM
Instead of the poor standing-up and fighting for themselves, maybe they should stand up and try working for a change.

China 11/9/2009 5:02:03 PM
There is no limit, if that's what you're waiting for then do yourself a favour and give up already. Propaganda > Logic
It's really that simple. SA is no different.
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