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Concerned Citizen

South Africa
News24 User

Watching the Hawks

by Concerned Citizen
2009-07-07 12:01

Dear Editor,

Don't they know that "it all boils down to leadership"? This is a basic rule that all leaders are suppose to know.

We can change the system, we can create new ones, but unless we change, nothing will.

The start of the new police leg "Hawk" came as a shock because I immediately wondered why the Scorpions had to be disbanded.

My understanding was that they were unhappy with the fact that there were two units, police and scorpions, but now there will be two again. They might be under one name, but again two departments.

What will they do if the members of the Hawk unit starts to follow certain leads that lead them to members of the police unit, or to the leadership of the country, government officials, will they too be labelled?

What we need is free justice, justice for all.

Reading through the article commenting on the first day of the new unit, I was wondering if they would consider the following: Whenever a person of authority (government worker) is found guilty of any crime or wrong doing, they need to face double the consequences than that of an ordinary citizen.

They are supposed to be leaders and an example to the country.

Concerned Citizen

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Juan 7/7/2009 12:05:53 PM
Canning the Scorpions and making up a new unit cost US the tax paying public MILLIONS of rands in admin, legslation, logo design etc etc.. for basically the SAME THING! This money could have been used to build schools, provide elecricity and running water to poor areas..help out the poor, etc.. But NO, 'the poor masses' seem to be ENJOYING cold and hunger, as long as THEIR anc government get to spend MILLIONS on these useless restructuring etc.

D.T.M. 7/7/2009 12:12:09 PM
The same will happen to them, as what happened to Zuma. Nothing!!!!!!

Deon 7/7/2009 12:13:03 PM
HAWK = Scorpions without the sting! They just made sure this time that they won't get investigated if and when corrupt. Disbanding of the Scorpions was just to prove a point. The Scorpions were the best and trained by the FBI etc, when they did a good job....too good a job they got disbanded!! TIA!

SC 7/7/2009 12:17:47 PM
They should have been called The Puppets... cause someone else is always pulling the strings...

Juan 7/7/2009 12:21:42 PM
Will 'the hawks' also be disbanded when they investigate corrupt anc politicians?

Glock 22 c 7/7/2009 12:23:08 PM
Its because they did a "shuffle" on the management of the scorpions and they now will refrain from investigating ANC Elites. Only reason nothing ells

Halfwise 7/7/2009 12:28:49 PM
Scorpions failed terrible man, this is our new advanced crime fighting organization… wheather you like it or not,,,, it was approved by Msholozi himself. Mbeki approved the failed scorpions; his leadership was a failure as well… VIVA Hawks

Bonny 7/7/2009 12:31:43 PM
@ author, "What will they do if the members of the Hawk unit starts to follow certain leads that lead them to members of the police unit, or to the leadership of the country, government officials, will they too be labelled?" Can't see that being an issue with the Hawks as the boss is fully ANC..watch out for the witch hunt in Cape Town though..

Poloyatonki 7/7/2009 12:40:05 PM
Well we all know that scorpion was the creation of the snake Mbeki which was useless, so its gonna be difficult for our country to move forward and bringing along things that failed us in the past…….Scorpion was useless that’s all I can say!!!

Adrian 7/7/2009 12:40:23 PM
@author- i'm sure you know the story. The minister of police Nathi Mthethwa will tell which ever member finds any evidence against any government official, that they must keep quiet or be fired, or worse face militant action. This unit will easily be manipulated because it was "formed" by the government(ANC). Any ANC member under investigation will not face any consequenses because "comrades" are exempt from prosecution. Fraud and corruption will increase dramatically, watch this space. The puppets in the new unit will bow before the puppetmaster(Showerkop).

MM 7/7/2009 12:41:41 PM
Haha.... Yes, it will either be swept under the already dusty carpet or they will be dissolved and disbanded like the scorpions...

IandI 7/7/2009 12:43:11 PM
These Hawks will probably be as effective as dodos!Their boss will report to the SAPS commissioner who will force them to "work in a collective" when the path leads to corrupt party bosses or even to the ultimate boss of all bosses.A dodo by any other name. Travel gate MPs, arms deal beneficiaries are rolling with laughter as we speak.Bring b ack to real Scorpions.

N Nqini 7/7/2009 12:49:15 PM
Can you imagine the cost of administration that will and or is involved in putting up this unit? Money that could have gone to the needy...

RUDOLF 7/7/2009 12:51:06 PM
Another new broom and ano0ther attempt at cleaning the slate. Until you step on some tender toes. The the Hawks will be disbanded and the new lot will be called, Chickens or whatever. LOaw and order is not a favourite topic of those currently in power. It goes against the grain.

Mzi 7/7/2009 12:52:28 PM
moan, moan and whine. what's new with your kind?

fiza 7/7/2009 12:53:45 PM
I dont see any point in that,as it is still crime fighting unit just like scopion and SAPS.Department of justice(the criminal guard) will continue with linient sentencing regardless of the nature of crime or right of the criminal will still be protected than of the victim.eg price fixing companies still recieves light punishment.

DAL 7/7/2009 12:56:49 PM
The Hawks will only really prove themselves when they start arresting high-level ANC members who are guilty of corruption, and as we know, there isn't exactly a shortage of those. The Scorpions had a very high success rate, and it would seem that the only reason to disband them and launch the Hawks was for the ANC to have more political control. ANC leadership will certainly deny this, but the proof of the pudding will be in the eating. Let us, the public, see what happens. Justice must be for all, with no-one exempted.

Adrian 7/7/2009 12:58:05 PM
@Poloyadonkey. VIva this viva that. Dont you have any other words in your vocab, instead of spewing the same shit everyday. Even a two year old knows more english words than you bitch @ss nigga.

Cape Town Kid 7/7/2009 12:58:46 PM
The stupidity and ignorance of some of the writers on this forum is a real concern. Had this person done his/her research properly, the gist of this article would have been very different. When will we have assessments that are honest and objective. We all need to learn from each other but this stagnant and sterile knowledge is disempowering. This type of opportunism really weakens the discourse.Please ppl, if you are going to write about something at least have the courage to be honest, try and be objective and try and enrich us with fresh new ideas.This lack of critical thinking is not good for anyone!

Mark V @Mzi 7/7/2009 12:59:49 PM
Continuous blind propaganda. Same question to you.

Gerry 7/7/2009 1:00:14 PM
Well we all know that scorpion was the creation of the snake Mbeki which was useless, so its gonna be difficult for our country to move forward and bringing along things that failed us in the past…….Scorpion was useless that’s all I can say!!!
Each time I see Poloyatonki's comments I cant' help but his thoughts indicate that he is leaving up to his name Polo ya Tonki ,He thinks exactly like one Big Polo ya tonki

Alicia 7/7/2009 1:04:02 PM
Questions, questions! Why disband one unit and a few weeks later put a new one into place? Makes no sense whatsoever. And if in the end 80% of the now defunct Scorpions join the Hawks??? Will they be allowed to carry on whatever cases they were working on? Will they be hamstrung again like the Scorpions were. Will the truth...even the arms debacle aparently, now explode upon us, or will everyone who is "anyone" rich, governmental, V.I.P's, rich crooks, buddies, once again stop the legal process in it's tracks. Do the Hawks have to toe a line, or are the FREE to do what has to be done? One can only wonder.... But, the truth will set so many of us free, and unfortunately so many will cedars will fall. We shall see!

fizz 7/7/2009 1:04:27 PM
Poloyatonki and Halfwise - you guys are idiots. The Scorpions had a far higher success rate than the SAPS. That's fact. But Halfwise says; 'Scorpions failed terrible man' and Polo says 'Scorpion was useless.' You guys can't even write or spell properly, and you actually seem to think your opinions are valid? You both are typical of precisely why Africa is in the mess it is today.

samsam 7/7/2009 1:07:04 PM
My question to COPE members, do you still need the scorpions,even if they were used by big man and small men. It is sad that so many peoples image were tarnished by scorpions,eg McMaharaj,Phosa,Tokyo,Zuma,Cyril, who were suspect of overthrowing the govt, yet you still see Mvume campaigning to bring back scorpions. What was a reason behind to call media when investigating someone. If I was political blind I would support COPE who were behind this nonsense, what does the Const says, was that a respect for human rights



Anapple 7/7/2009 1:07:07 PM
@Mzi, what you moaning and whining about now, sounds like the "pot calling the kettle black!!!" Ha!Ha!

BF 7/7/2009 1:07:43 PM
@Mzi and co. what's wrong with YOUR is you got those blinkers on! try taking them off!!!!

Mark V@CTK 7/7/2009 1:11:47 PM
Olease enlighten us in the near future with an insightfull, well researched, informative and unbiassed article.

Sinudeity 7/7/2009 1:12:54 PM
Lets see, 10 people who say, the Scorpions was disbanded, because they were investigating CORRUPT ANC OFFICIALS, and the usual 3 (Wives of JZ - Half/Mzi and Polo), who say the Scorpions was useless. 10:3 - Sorry guys, public opinion.

fuzzy 7/7/2009 1:12:59 PM
Mzi, polydonkey and halftwit, arent you concerned about the fact that the only crime independent crime fighting unit has been disbandsed and a new one formed by the cabel of the aNC leaders? Does their lack of independence not scare you. You are, I presume, after all tax payers. You love to spout off about Mbeki and the Scorpions vs showerkop. If they were so under Mbekis control why then did they prosecute favourite son Selebi? Yes - we are whining, thats becuase we care.

Frank @ Mzi 7/7/2009 1:13:05 PM
Corruption, convenient amnesia, blatant ignorance and ridiculous denials - WHAT IS NEW WITH YOUR KIND???

@Cape Town Kid 7/7/2009 1:15:13 PM
INDEED CTK - You need more 'critical thinking'. "The stupidity and ignorance of some of the writers on this forum is a real concern" - Thats what I think to myself EVERY SINGLE TIME I read you and polo/halfwise etc. comments.

Adrian 7/7/2009 1:17:23 PM
@the dimwits(halfwise,cape town kid, poloyadonkey,mzi etc). thanks for the laugh boys. Its a pleasure reading the crap you morons write. Tell me, did any of you dummies finish school. Thanks again for the laugh dummies!!! lmfao :)

Juan @ MZI, Cape Town Kid and poliodonkey 7/7/2009 1:17:54 PM
I could quote you BIG arrests and conviction rates by the scorpions and provide you with statistics, but ALL I will get from you is that typical DOFF thousand yard stare. Or I could raise a fist, shout 'viva' and 'mshimi wam!' and your eyes will light up and it'll look like I actually said something meaningful. PEOPLE LIKE YOU are what's wrong with SA today!!

lekabisto 7/7/2009 1:38:59 PM
Well we all know that the new police force "HAWKS" falls under the government and wont dare go anywhere near the ANC political officials! I could just hear them now "Comrade msholozi get rid of this scorpions before they destroy us all and replace them with ones that will only work for us and wont even dare thinkg bout investigating any of our comrades"

LOL 7/7/2009 1:39:18 PM
LOL Mzi doesnt even have to say anything worth commenting on and everybody starts jumping on his a*s!!!

Gerhard 7/7/2009 1:39:43 PM
I suspect this HAWK is really a little bitty tweety pie...cute and completely harmless, just the way we like them said Zuma with a smile.

Alien Dude @ctk 7/7/2009 1:39:49 PM
"The stupidity and ignorance of some of the writers on this forum is a real concern".....speak for yourself you idiot.

Mr Samething 7/7/2009 1:43:49 PM
OK so all those GTI's will have the old scorpions logo scrapped and the hawk logo applied...change the manuals to reflect the name change, uniforms, etc etc...sounds to me like the only that did change was the evidence against Zuma disappeared!!!!For that we pay millions!!

KOBUS 7/7/2009 1:46:17 PM
If they investigate high-placed government officials they are counter-revolutionary, agents of apartheid and fake, silly little girls. Man, I could do Floyd Shivambu's job!

Erin 7/7/2009 1:48:34 PM
I sometimes wonder if Halfwise and Poloyatonki aren't Floyd Shivambu and Julius Malema. Their comments on various articles on News24 seem to have the same air of stupidity as our favourite ANCYL comic relief duo.

Mzi 7/7/2009 1:50:27 PM
Do I need to be on your side to prove my intelligence? I am with the new government and their implementation all the way, i trust the new leaders than any other snake oppositions that are only in politics for self enrichment. hawks will be the most succesful crime bursting unit. all you little racist should start accepting reality, and reality is south africa is moving into a new era where black people will be celebrated in taking this country to the next level. juan my friend, not only your kind can live in beach houses anymore accept and stop whining about the blue lights.

Anon 7/7/2009 2:00:00 PM
I think they should be called the "SNAILS".

Cynical@Mzi 7/7/2009 2:04:39 PM
"moan, moan and whine. what's new with your kind?"

Well I'll tell you what's wrong with YOUR kind = living in the dark because your heads are stuck up your collective backsides. Now get back to your job of frying hamburgers.

Willem 7/7/2009 2:06:24 PM
The fact that the Scorpins were disbnaded shortly BEFORE the elections and now the "scared pigeons" relace the Scorpins AFTER the elections, is by itself most insightful. Legally, the law is the law, if the Scorpions couldn't investigate murder/theft/ANC corruption, why would the "scared pigeons" be allowed to? The difference between the two units is most important: The Scorpions were seperate, not part of any Government/ANC structure.However, the "scared pigeons" are PART OF THE SAPS and therefore ANSWER TO THE MINISTER!(Who happens, coincidentally, to be a Communist.)I smell a cover-up, starting with thre R500,000.00 that got stolen by SACP-executives. Read the Police Act:"The Director of SAPS and every member there-of is answearable to Parliament." That's why the Scorpions were disbanded and this new lot put under strict control:"Answer to the ANC about whom you are investigating." Why is it that members of the SACP who were charged with theft/coniving to overthrow the Government/treason against the Constitution by the Scorpions, were never made public? (I have a family member in the Scorpions, Blade was in deep trouble but it was kept quiet.)The "scared pigeons" have to answer to Parliament, because "all corruption leads to ANC."

I 7/7/2009 2:06:31 PM
@Juan - well said. However, I do think that Mzi, "poliodonkey" etc are just making all these remarks time after time to get a reaction. I refuse to believe that there can be 4 - 5 regulars like them that all have the combined IQ of 5, but are still able to switch on a computer and apparently log on to news24. They are still idiots, but all about the reaction they get.

fraud 7/7/2009 2:10:06 PM
I had no problems with the compentence of the scorpions. My only problem was their selective prosecutions. Obviously the people who did the ground work for the scorpions were highly skilled, it's unfortunate that their bosses allowed themselves to be puppets of the former prez. Obviously this sad truth (political manipulation) nullifies everything they did because there are now question marks on the real reason why they were formed.

Tumelo 7/7/2009 2:12:35 PM
This debate is a year late (18 months when you take into consideration Polokwane).This goes to show how many whiners cant get to grip with the program.This is scary,people wake up!On a different subject; has anyone sighted Wacko's ghost already?

SimonP 7/7/2009 2:19:43 PM
If as some misguided fools believe, the Scorpions were useless, how is it stats prove they were the most successful crime fighting unit. Strange how the ones calling them useless are blind ANC followers.

SimonP 7/7/2009 2:22:54 PM
@CTK "have the courage to be honest, try and be objective" every single post by you is regurgitated denialist ANC rhetoric. Honest and objective are words a denialist, deluded fool should not be telling others to use.

SimonP 7/7/2009 2:25:23 PM
@Mzi, when will you learn, disagreeing with your beloved ANC is not whining. Get a dictionary and look up: racist, whining, democracy, indoctrination and idiot.

garyh 7/7/2009 2:41:32 PM
Jeez, halwit and polidonkey, you two are seriously retarded, even more so than I initially thought. The Scorpions were useless you say, How come then the experts saw the Scorpions as our only effective law enforcer in SA, and it was lauded globally. Most with a brain, black & white, believes that they were disbanded as they were nailing the big wigs in goverment. But I suppose we do not need them, as there is no crime problem in SA, and there is no corruption in Gov, its all western lies to discredit your fukcing showerhead, please see Juans comments @ 1:17:54, he speaks on behalf of all with a brain, which I agree, likely excludes you. I always thought that Juan was a bit harsh on you BOYS, but after reading your extremely doff responses of late, I am inclined to agree with him. Jeez, you guys are a waste of black skin and an embarrassment to your race! you and your ILK are the epitomy of what is wrong with AFRICA, I say again, lift your heads, straighten your back, pickup your knuckles from the ground and evolve, please! GaryH

shirley 7/7/2009 3:05:59 PM
The Hawks were formed in order to cover up for the successful Scorpions and now we have an apparency of a fighting crime unit which will come with all the excuses and rhetoric under the sun - answerable only to the corrupt elite - and dont we know who those are!!

samsam @EVERYBODY 7/7/2009 3:06:51 PM
Listen to news radio news, it is reported that COPE has crashed/ divided and finished, how can they do this before 2011

Grim 7/7/2009 3:10:36 PM
The scorpion were disbanded so that the ANC could get rid of all the case files on the arms deal, now that that has been done they can do things their way with out criminal files against them. Too smart

The Original Peekay 7/7/2009 3:21:40 PM
Good topic! And one we must hold the ANC and Jacob Zuma accountable for, and we must be given reasons why the Scorpians was disbanded and why introduce Hawk based on the principal that two units was too much. Why on earth were the Scoprpians disbanded? Only because they had too much dirt on the imbeciles of this countries beloved Jacob "shower-head" Zuma. So what is going to happen now? Are the Hawks going to just ignore the corruption and concentrate on saving kitty's out of tree-tops? So what is the point of having them.

I have always maintained and will always maintain that jacob Zuma is a liar. He has lied to get the votes of all the imbeciles of this country, and he has lied ever since, he has been lieing for years now with regards to the corruption trial, he probably lied about the rape case. He lied about how many terms he'll serve, he lied about why the Scorpians has to be disbanded. The sole purpose of squashing the Scorpians was as they were too much of a threat to Zuma. They had too much dirt on him and they could have hammered the fatal nail in his coffin so to say... Zuma is trouble, plain and simple, and he has some serious egg on his face with the introduction of Hawk, and he has some explaining to do.

KAC 7/7/2009 3:35:19 PM
@ Fuzzy. Your statement is the statement of the year and my new motto for the 3 halfwits of a brain cell (mzi, poly something and halfwit), the statement “Yes - we are whining, that's because we care”.

Peekay @ Samsam 7/7/2009 3:42:23 PM
Please give evidence that COPE has crashed and fallen?? The only thing I can find is that Lynda Odendaal has resigned... Please explain how one person resigning has now suddenly become the great fall of cope?

Diane 7/7/2009 3:54:14 PM
Exactly, wolves dressed in sheeps clothing. It's all about who's who in our ANC Zoo

@samsam: 7/7/2009 3:58:54 PM
Listen Sir: Linda Odendaal has resigned. That does not mean the end of COPE.The problem with ANC members is INTELLECT, or rather"the lack there-of.How one deputy president resigning equals the death of a party, is not clear.

SimonP 7/7/2009 4:40:41 PM
@Mzi, no you dont have to stand by anyones side to prove your intelligence. By continuing to post your indoctrinated rubbish here you prove your complete lack of intelligence.

Glock 22 c 7/7/2009 4:43:17 PM
@SAMSAM , Yup you are correct one person resigns and now its teh end of Cope. You ANC supporters are realy realy stupid.You must all run on goat brains as I have never seen anyone that thinks like you do. That why I say Goats because I have seen sheep taht can think for themselves but not anc supporters HAHAHAH

Paul Grant 7/7/2009 10:10:08 PM
Switch to lower gear, it's all downhill from here.

These HAWKS have been created to spy and dig up dirt on the Western Cape (DA)

HAWKS = Heavy ANC Wired Keepsake Soldiers

Rolls Royce 7/8/2009 7:54:10 AM
Just wondering,did showerkop ever go for an HIV test after his romantic liason with a comrades daughter...he would be the first president to have AIDS

GeorGe 7/8/2009 8:15:22 AM
Polywanka - state facts - do just say something and not back it up! Tell us why Scorpions are useless. The hawks are just the Scporpions with another name. Tell us why the Scorpions were useless - was it because they were too close to the truth? Come with facts knucklehead.

Anon 7/8/2009 8:23:41 AM
@ Mzi 1:50:27 PM - "i trust the new leaders than any other snake oppositions that are only in politics for self enrichment." - My dear friend you have so accurately described so many ANC MP's and stortkop.

AA 7/8/2009 8:41:04 AM
@author: It's like the govt now again decided to use the army to patrol the borders, after the same morons said it was so pre-94 and got the police to do the work. Oh gosh, the pre-94 govt actually knew what they were doing. Don't expect logic from people that came from the bush war. This is the same, disband then make a new one and get people like Sello/Halfwise/Polydonkey to think it was the ANC who had this "great" idea.

YahooSerious 7/8/2009 12:14:50 PM
The Hawks have made their 1st arrest today. Foiled a burgulary before it even happened. Is this what tax paying citizens are paying for even though we have a police force in place that should handle these lower profile cases. My cat is stuck in a tree - does anyone have the Hawk's number?

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