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Does Mbeki deserve 100%?

2008-09-29 11:09

Dear Editor,

According to a report on News24, Thabo Mbeki will enjoy the full payments, salary and benefits that he had as President, for the rest of his life... with annual increases.

Love him or hate him, there's no denying that the man was part of a cabinet that helped South Africa to enjoy the longest period of economic prosperity since World War II. That is no small feat considering the Apartheid debt they've had to deal with.

I do not begrudge anyone a comfortable retirement, but considering that millions of people in South Africa live in misery due to poverty, unemployment, crime, corruption and poor service delivery, the extent of Mbeki's golden handshake seems obscene.

Surely this will set an unhealthy precedent? When the next President is elected and eventually stands down, will he/she not expect the same retirement deal as Mbeki - or better? What about the President after that?

Let's take this further: Mbeki, at 60-something years of age, is a relatively young man. The next President might be around the same age, give or take a few years. Naturally, I do not wish illness or death upon anyone, so let's assume that Mbeki will be alive and well by the time our next President steps down and yet another person takes his/her place.

My question is this: given the sheer scale of problems that must be tackled nationwide, along with the costs involved, can South African taxpayers afford to support two or even three ex-Presidents, plus a sitting President, with all the payments, salaries, benefits and annual increases of the scale that Mbeki will enjoy from now on?

If I'm not mistaken, American ex-presidents do not receive such lavish retirement deals, so why is a third world country indulging in this? Even if this is a one-off deal just for Mbeki - a form of compensation - it is nevertheless an exorbitant arrangement.

Saffa

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Oom_Kosie 9/29/2008 11:21:16 AM
As far as I know all other presidents of SA have got this deal. They get bodyguards for life as well. The precedent has already been set.

Mark V 9/29/2008 11:22:59 AM
I hear the gravy train speeding ahead strongly.

Chris-T 9/29/2008 11:23:42 AM
As far as I know all retred Presidents of SA get full benefits till they die and I don't see a problem in that. As a former head of state, it's unlikely that one can get a job elsewhere and one is in constant need of security. It is a fair arrangement for all retired presidents. Did you have to throw in America in this? Can't we think independently for once? How much do you know about their arrangements, can you tell us?

Paul 9/29/2008 11:23:50 AM
Good, good article. This golden hanshake is another example of how totally extreme the new regime in the post 1994 South Africa has become. Personal wealth is the measuring tool, and realistic expectation of logic fly out the window.No really democratic society would allow their leaders to steal taxpayers money at this level.TM is without a job.His golden handshake should reflect market-related averages.Who in government signed the deal....who???

jb 9/29/2008 11:26:04 AM
This money can help build schools, upgrade hospitals, help the poor people, but no, lets vote ANC so they can waste our money.

Brian 9/29/2008 11:26:07 AM
At first I wasn't totally against the idea but you make a damn good point... 2 - 3 ex-presidents + the sitting president is a fairly large sum of money. And no doubt, once there is a precedent, all the ex-presidents will take advantage of it...

Dries 9/29/2008 11:27:22 AM
No, why should he too be rewarded for failing?

Cassuis 9/29/2008 11:28:06 AM
Valid point Saffa. But who cares, and does your opinion actually count for anything? No. So stop composing pointless letters and get back to work.

ANC freedom fighter 9/29/2008 11:28:08 AM
Most GM's at large companies such as Old Mutual retire with multi-million packages far in excess of Thabo's. Not a word of dissent from the white minority. Most of these white executives (some with only matric certificate) were appointed in the Apartheid era. And we all know what is happening to Old Mutual's performance post London listing.

Les-Maada 9/29/2008 11:30:47 AM
Such a compensation would'nt hurt the country's economy nor create a hole in the taxpayers pockets.In fact, no one is gonna feel any difference in that regard.By the way Saffa, i thought the American EX-Presidents were also entitled to such benefits or is it just a lack of info from my side..?I think Mbeki's package is well deserved if you ask me!Just that South Africans never ceazes to complain.

MaLeFaCtOr 9/29/2008 11:33:00 AM
Will that be the case when hands presidency to JZ next year?

Nico Lategan 9/29/2008 11:35:16 AM
It is a way to keep him on the sideline so that he would not consider to open his own party before next year's election.If that happen it would split the ANC right into two and they will loose their two third mayority. How interesting will that be?!

Paul 9/29/2008 11:35:30 AM
Imagine for a moment that the CEO of any privately owned company gets axed, and he claims the same financial package after he was fired.The CFO and Board of Directors/decision makers would laugh in his face, and if he did manage such an elaborate exit, the people who gave him the package would be in some form of legal trouble, make no mistake.If TM is as intelligent as claimed,and he cares for the country as he claims, he would deny himself this exit.Greed is a funny thing....

Vick 9/29/2008 11:36:13 AM
complaints depts, IF we want to quell TM's sending off package, we may as well look at prev presidents who have bankrupted SA to the point where we have to have policies like AA/BEE to address the problems they've created. What have those presidents done to deserve the sendoffs? lets be fair we might not agree with TM's (anc's) way of doign things, bottom line is TM inspite of his weaknesses delivered us to a stable country, yes SA has challenges still to overcome.

Jonny 9/29/2008 11:37:55 AM
Nobody in the real world goes on pension, with annual cost-of-living increases, at his exit salary after only 10 years' service. Mbeki's golden parachute is utterly obscene. He should retire like the rest of us, with 2/3 his current wage and no extra company perks.

Ethan 9/29/2008 11:38:32 AM
why not. Since the other former presidents are receiving the same or similar benefits. I think the question you should be asking is do former presidents deserve 100% benefits.

Jonny 9/29/2008 11:38:43 AM
Nobody in the real world goes on pension, with annual cost-of-living increases, at his exit salary after only 10 years' service. Mbeki's golden parachute is utterly obscene. He should retire like the rest of us, with 2/3 his current wage and no extra company perks.

Confucious 9/29/2008 11:40:02 AM
"Millions of people live in misery due to poverty, unemployement, poor service delivery, etc." All of a sudden there is no money left to maintain and sustain roads, power, etc. (with billions required). I may be off the topic here, but how do you match this with economic prosperity? Rather a case of more money collected and even more wasted if you ask me.....

Bisto 9/29/2008 11:40:49 AM
These benefits do not only apply to Mbeki. I heard from an ANC MP that this applies to all MPs stepping down after the next election. Haven't they stolen enough of the taxpayer's money already?

BALA BOY 9/29/2008 11:40:58 AM
Presidents in the previous regime enjoyed 10x more than that of the current regime. They have just continued thereon. PW had gigantic interests elsewhere paid for by taxpayers. Ministers as well scoop a bundle for their useless efforts. Look at MANTO. Even if we did not have a minister of health prior to her moving it would have made no effect on the dept.

Dave Robbins 9/29/2008 11:41:28 AM
The 2 surviving State Presidents, FW De Klerk and Nelson Mandela, received this when they left office, so why should it be any different with Thabo Mbeki? I can't see what the fuss is about, Saffa.

Jorene 9/29/2008 11:41:30 AM
Ex President Thabo Mbeki is deserving of this pacakage, after all he has worked extremely hard for our economy and Africa for many years. He was the most hardworking of all Previous Presidents. After all the NEC asked him to resign.

JB 9/29/2008 11:42:08 AM
your whole ANC cabinet, bought their senior certifictes. On taxpayers money. They got there because they worked for it, not like you black people, sit around and do nothing...as always. Soon u will fight for money and food....not freedom.

Mark T 9/29/2008 11:42:54 AM
It seems all high ranking government officials, pre and post 1994, made sure they were well looked after. It will not change.

Fred 9/29/2008 11:43:00 AM
Will the new president just sworn in last week also enjoy these benefits when he steps down after the up coming elections in 2009. If not bad for a few months in the hot seat.

Cat 9/29/2008 11:43:36 AM
Oh could you get over yourself? Firstly, the president's retirement fund will come from the taxpayers' money. Old Mutual and those similar companies are private sector businesses. Get off your soapbox. You are obviously clueless.

Met Uysh! 9/29/2008 11:43:52 AM
I would also quit my job quickly if my current employers promise to pay me my salary for the rest of my life if I quit. Easy decision!

Mark T 9/29/2008 11:45:13 AM
It seems all high ranking government officials, pre and post 1994, made sure they were well looked after. It will not change.

M 9/29/2008 11:46:24 AM
that's not the issue here. All ex-presidents of SA got/get the same deal, pre- or post-95. Maybe people commenting here should first check their facts.

Principal 9/29/2008 11:46:47 AM
You both have it wrong.A retired(NOT FIRED)president does have some financial benefits until he dies, but it is NOT and NEVER have been an exact duplicate of his package in office.If an outgoing president cannot show he saved or invested his taxfree income when he was Head of State, with all the financial advice he could summon at will.....then shame on him.

tm 9/29/2008 11:47:20 AM
Please don't comment on issues you do not have an understanding of .... Old Mutual's problems have nothing to do with pre or post Apartheid related matters but that they got could up in the US / UK sub prime issues....

Bongoro 9/29/2008 11:47:22 AM
CEOs, GMs, CFOs in corporate white south africa pay themselves exit packages 20 times in excess of what Mbeki will ever receive. If PW Botha and his cronies got it, then we should give Mandela, Mbeki and Khalema double!

curious... 9/29/2008 11:48:27 AM
does anyone have an idea what does TM earns??? Someone told me over the weekend that our ex president earned less than R300K per annum - tax free, straight into his pocket since everything else was paid for. How true is this???

MajorPain 9/29/2008 11:49:39 AM
Wasn't TM one of the ones that said that there is absolutely nothing wrong with our state hospitals? In fact, that we have some of the best state-run health systems in the world. Let him go to his local clinic. As for pension...let him see what it feels like every time Tito opens his gob so that he can see that he will never be able to retire because he will never be able to survive.

Sipho 9/29/2008 11:50:49 AM
All former state presidents of South Africa are entitled to those benefits till they die. We can trace it back to PW Botha, De klerk, and Mandela. So please do your homework and get all the facts before you publish. It only shows that stupidity is infinite.

general 9/29/2008 11:50:58 AM
Come on guys, this is a common practice. Look at Mandela and De Klerk and presidents before them, they all got the same treatment. Why making a a moutain out of nothing.

lekkalik 9/29/2008 11:51:41 AM
The man is entitled to his pension. The author must be bored to take time to write this nothing of significance piece. Why not ask / answer a more important and pertinent question such as whether the taxpayers can and should be funding the legal fees of politicians and civil servants.Finish en klaar

arshad 9/29/2008 11:51:56 AM
Reading the related article on News24 infuriated the hell out of me and i awaited a user article but not with as much poise that you've written yours.As a south African citizen i honestly feel so hard done by at the fact that our government feels that we have the luxury to splash out like this, and yet,as the article suggests, we have such a serious situation regarding poverty and the like.When if at all will the ANC think about anybody else but themselves?

kgauzen 9/29/2008 11:52:06 AM
Who cares if whether he gets it or not?Oh,yes the poor community,how can i forget.But how much is Zuma still getting from the goverment?I mean his legal fees cost us more than a million a month.So why should we worry about Mbeki,who perhaps done wonders during his tuner as the president.Bulelani Ngcuka still get benefit from goverment,Jacky Selebi still get the same.Oh,me and u get nothing from commenting on them.

He Who Knows 9/29/2008 11:52:32 AM
every time someone claims that Mbeki and the ANC were responsible for the best economic prosperity since whenever! Ja, no, well, fine! :)

Ethan 9/29/2008 11:52:35 AM
Mbeki is not the first person to receive these benefits. How come I never heard any complaints when PW Botha and De Klerk were given the same benefits. The exit of PW Botha was exactly the same as Mbeki's.

MajorPain 9/29/2008 11:53:19 AM
Wasn't TM one of the ones that said that there is absolutely nothing wrong with our state hospitals? In fact, that we have some of the best state-run health systems in the world. Let him go to his local clinic. As for pension...let him see what it feels like every time Tito opens his gob so that he can see that he will never be able to retire because he will never be able to survive.

Uthmaan 9/29/2008 11:54:59 AM
I read a couple of years ago that the CEO of EDCON earned ~R115 million for the year. How much did he contribute to SA and Africa?, e.g. in terms of conflict resolution etc SA presidents earn just over a million PA, Thabo will have to live another 100 years to earn what that guy earned in a year. There are other CEOs also earning salaries close to that e.g. Nedbank, Checkers etc. Given that he gave up his life 24x7 for the last couple of years to do this job I would call it very reasonable

Mlungisi 9/29/2008 11:55:31 AM
Off course he deserves it.

Crispins 9/29/2008 11:55:32 AM
Jeez Saffa, the guy was President for two terms, he had the highest office in the country, do you just expect him to walk away? With nothing?? Grow up man! Where were you when the CEO of SAA (Coleman Andrews)got R232 million for three years work! Have some respect for the man!

mike 9/29/2008 11:56:12 AM
Geez guys this really isn't such a big deal in the larger scheme of things. Compared to top CEO's TM gets peanuts, so what if they contniue paying him what he earned, its really not gonna make a difference to any of us. After all he did only earn 1,2 mill a year (excl all the perks obv). Compare that to the millions SAFA are wastng on the "coach." He gets that a month! now there is something to complain about.

Godfrey 9/29/2008 11:56:51 AM
Sometime back people were talking about the R13m 'Mbeki wall' as if the wall belongs to Mbeki.Now you are complaining about Mbeki's retirement salary as if this salary package is specifically for him.No one complains about past presidents.This is not a once off deal for Mbeki, but a package for any president.

KS 9/29/2008 11:57:03 AM
Yes, the money could be used for another purpose - but TM has served this country as president for his term...and whether or not his being president is directly attributable to the growth our economy has seen shouldnt matter! The man has his flaws, but so does Pres. Bush!!! He deserves his salary - SARS collected R560 BILLION rand in taxes...TM's salary won't dent that!

Mark T 9/29/2008 11:57:09 AM
You are a racist to put it mildly. You cannot say anything constructive, but use this to attack the whites. Maybe you should accept South Africans are of all races. Maybe embrace that idea. As for the article-All politicians, pre and post 1994 have lined their pockets, and will continue to do so, no matter who is in charge.

Phumba 9/29/2008 11:57:17 AM
How else should an outgoing president earn an income after leaving office, even one who was removed. Should he rather sell his services to a foreign company who would love to pay him much more for the use of his political connections and all the state secrets in his head.

Uthmaan 9/29/2008 11:58:49 AM
I read a couple of years ago that the CEO of EDCON earned ~R115 million for the year. How much did he contribute to SA and Africa?, e.g. in terms of conflict resolution etc SA presidents earn just over a million PA, Thabo will have to live another 100 years to earn what that guy earned in a year. There are other CEOs also earning salaries close that e.g. Nedbank, Checkers etc. Given that he gave up his life 24x7 for the last couple of years to do this job I would call it very reasonable.

yeah right 9/29/2008 11:59:27 AM
lets also take away the pension FW gets.lets also ask the estate of PW to pay back the pension that he got, same as all the other past presidents and other ministers.

Dube 9/29/2008 11:59:46 AM
Wonderful, we did not go through the struggle just to be poor!

Sphu 9/29/2008 12:00:03 PM
Why shouldn't he get it. South Africa is the only country in the world that never recognises the mistakes a person has done, and forgets the good things done. He more than deserves it! He definetely should have received more. After the way he was treated by the ANC, we wil see where things go, because we are not stupid as a pupil, we can see when politicians play with our votes, which is what the ANC has done when it comes to MBEKI! many people voted for the ANC, knowing MBEKI was for president!

vfr 9/29/2008 12:01:26 PM
just leave the man alone stop trying to create an issue out of nutting...tslking about building school...this man is a former President for heaven's sake...or please employ him if you dont wanr him to get his salary..maybe finally he is going to spend his money and have time with his familly

Javas 9/29/2008 12:01:38 PM
What precedent are you talking about? We need to think people...if a President knew that he had to face a retirement without such benefits, what incentive will he have to give up power or not to abuse resources while he is still in power? As far as I am concerned, Mbeki deserves 200%! Botha lived comfortably after a pathetic presidency of apartheid, do you want Mandelas, Mbekis to struggle? Load of nonsense letter this one!

Gay 9/29/2008 12:02:31 PM
it is actually worst than that bru. It is a worldwide scenario. American/British are even worse than SA. Look at Mccain. This palooka would be suited as a Klan leader not a US president. You can spot a racist from a mile. Guys like Alec Erwin are ar3e scrapers who are looking to self enrich and fuc* the rest. The same with Pahad and the rest of the gang.

White Guy - Freedom of Intelligent Thinkers 9/29/2008 12:02:52 PM
Before you open this can of worms, get your facts in order.The white executives worked for 20 and 30 years, then received elaborate retirement packages for services rendered, Not because they were white.Don't bring race into this!It is an idiotic form of argument in this case.

Daniel 9/29/2008 12:07:49 PM
the ANC has tabled a bill for all Ministers to receive 100% of thier salary when they retire - even if they have only served 4 years. And as the majority party - this is one bill that will be voted in easily - our tax, thier entitlement

smokey-smurf 9/29/2008 12:08:46 PM
This happens in the business world every day. Now, the guy leading the country plays a much bigger role in everyone's life than the average CEO of some big corp. Although I'm not a big fan of politicians I think that if you get to the highest level of public service you must have made some pretty big sacrifices in your life. I see no problem with the country making a little sacrifice for such a person. Now compare this guy to CEOs who have a much higher turnover rate.

johnnoh 9/29/2008 12:09:38 PM
Does anybody have the details of the full package? This guy has dedicated his working years to the country and done a pretty good job. What should he do now? Join job seekers? Give him his package. If he was in the commercial sector he would have got a whole lot more and he was in charge of the country after all.

Billy of Arabia 9/29/2008 12:09:41 PM
The president should get what ever the current deal is - he is... sorry was the president. As noted above, does the new president also get this. As for the period of economic prosperity.. 40% unemployment? Something is askew in the gauge of this prosperity. When it comes to crime, unemployment and the failure of health and education, Pres, Mbeki was a total failure. Quiet diplomacy - an excuse for doing nothing! Old Bobby Mgabe is still giving the world the finger - must be a family thing.

Kenny 9/29/2008 12:10:45 PM
Why do all the whites sing foul???They never said anything when their Apartheid Kingpin Botha received a salary AND protection at Die Anker till the day he died.TM deserve to get a salary and protection as he was head of state and stop comparing it to a CEO of a company.It is not the same.

Bee Mollagee 9/29/2008 12:12:06 PM
Of cource he does, we live in a Democratic Country, end of story!

bekkie1 9/29/2008 12:12:28 PM
with greased palms, why could he just not get his pension lumpsum and leave him to invest in his own future with that. Okay so be nice and give him a platinum medical aid for him and his wife, for the rest of his life. He is nothing special, he is just a man after all like me and everyone else? I look at my own affairs why can't he, or maybe he can't, can he? Why the guards he can have ADT like everyone else that he pays for himself!

disgrunted taxpayer 9/29/2008 12:14:05 PM
Its a way to shut TM up and hope he goes away - "we know we did wrong in axing you but please just leave quietly". And as Brian says - what about the next and the next - in 50 years time we'll be paying for at least 10 ex-pres's! AFF - Old Mutual's packages don't come out of MY TAXMONEY!

MK 9/29/2008 12:17:09 PM
Why are you concerntrating only on TM all the other ex presidents are getting the same moes...

Mike H 9/29/2008 12:19:35 PM
Mbeki has pobably already taken enough to last him several lifetimes so why give him more.Through his incompetence millions was stolen through arms deal, electricity mess up etc. Why reward him for this?

Magnanimous 9/29/2008 12:21:40 PM
...give Thabo a break, he is entitled to his benefits. How much public service time has anybody in this forum given to their country? "Zero" would be a fair guess. If Tokyo Sexwale ever came looking for post retirement benefits from the State, he would be a clear candidate to get nothing but a foot up his a*se (having milked the gravy train as extensively as he and certain other "comrades" have on the back of Thabo's efforts for the country at large).

David 9/29/2008 12:21:45 PM
Firstly as president of the country you dont get paid enough IMO. Directors in big business get much more and i feel that as head of the country you should get paid alot. For one this might stop presidents being so easily corrupted and busy setting themselves up for retirement. Thabo and any president deserve everything they get. I just wish they would do something tangible for the country.

Sentinel 9/29/2008 12:23:30 PM
Years ago the old CP party made a big issue about their pensions and all the NP corruption and high salaries they allocate themselves as compared to the pre 1975 NP government heads.

Jerome 9/29/2008 12:24:29 PM
in Democratic countries. You making a issue of nothing. Even retired judges get these perks after retirement and most Presidents across the world, so chill out.

Linds 9/29/2008 12:24:46 PM
Presidents, like judges, never lose their tittles and never lose their income. It's guaranteed for life. The state must pay for their upkeep and security. How embarrassing it would be for any country to have a former president die a pauper!!!

Big Bad Bob 9/29/2008 12:25:25 PM
If a President is impeached and found guilty THEN s/he loses benefits. Mbeki resigned and so retains all benefits. A President will have surrendered any business career s/he had and all the benefits that go with that. You haven't actually quoted any figures in support of your judgement. IIRC the President earns substantially less than the CEOs of many JSE listed companies. This package is neither illegal nor unusual.

bhunu 9/29/2008 12:25:57 PM
s89(a)-(c) of the constitution provides for instances when the president can be removed. if he was removed for any of those offences he would have forfeited his pension. Mbeki was removed by the party for something different not those in the section alluded to above. The man deserve his pension like all other former presidents pre and post 94. Do you want him to come and clean your yard otherwise?

Bridget 9/29/2008 12:26:05 PM
No one should receive 100% of their earnings for the rest of their life after they spent their time in office not paying tax anyway. Perhaps they should have invested in a pension fund? For the record I don't believe that Mandela, FW or PW should receive this either! YES, they should get a package that allows them to live fairly comfortably for the "public service" that they did, but this is a little excessive.

Big Bad Bob 9/29/2008 12:28:11 PM
The ANC succeeded a government they regarded as illegitimate. One option they had was to deny previous ministers and heads of state benefits as they served in said illegitimate regime. There was even debate on refusing to pay certain debts incurred by said regime in the pursuit of applying a racist ideology. They didn't do that. They opted for business as usual, knowing that to do otherwise would have serious detrimental effects for the economy going forwards.

SmthJzzFan 9/29/2008 12:32:25 PM
Saffa, please do your research before you write about stuff that's obviously above your head. It is normal practice all over the world for ex-presidents to be looked after by their countries. Go and ask De Klerk - he is still getting benefits from the government.

Greg 9/29/2008 12:33:18 PM
He was our President and for that we have to thank him. It is an honour and a very difficult position Is is apart of SA history, all the best to Thabo Mbeki, happy spending. No problem with his retirement salary. why should it matter? only the short-sighted, narrow minded individual would question his package. he is entitled to it.

whitey 9/29/2008 12:33:48 PM
I'm with my black brothers on this one. Seems a bit like 'n knee-jerk reaction on the side of those who oppose. Won't call you racist though. ;-) You guys really need to think a bit harder before you start arguing every time the government does something. Not everything is bad.

KUMALO 9/29/2008 12:36:00 PM
when they retire to those Idiots crying fowl. Google what Ronald Reagan, Thatcher, Major got after retiring and you will see thats its fair.

Ethan 9/29/2008 12:36:05 PM
Commets like yours make me want to vote for the useless, corrupt ANC. Grow up. You are bitter. You have unresolved issues. Deal with them before it is too late or pack your bags and go to Australia.

Thobile Ndungane 9/29/2008 12:36:46 PM
He deserves every cent and please let it go.He has suffered enough and money is not everything.There are apartheid leaders who killed and maimed our people and they are still being paid today by the government and I complement our Parliament for looking after the leaders who have retired.

KS 9/29/2008 12:37:22 PM
Can anyone shed light on that?!?! That would upset me...I don't mind Thabo getting his share...but for the MP's it should be performance based!!! Trevor deserves 200% in my mind...he has done spectacularly over the past 14 years...but our previous minister of health...well, she can have the dirt off my shoes!!!

Thobile Ndungane 9/29/2008 12:38:34 PM
He deserves every cent and please let it go.He has suffered enough and money is not everything.There are apartheid leaders who killed and maimed our people and they are still being paid today by the government and I complement our Parliament for looking after the leaders who have retired.

Sadike 9/29/2008 12:40:19 PM
As far as I know, all the democratic countries do that for all their former presidents. These articles are slowly but surely turning into platforms for people to sure their unfounded conclusions and pessimism. Can we please discus something better

Benzo 9/29/2008 12:41:00 PM
Sad but true:they're all in the game just for the personal financiaal gain. First Mbeki profited from the corrupt arms deal (bribes from the French and German contractors), then his association with Selebe and Kebble further lined his pockets, now he gets rewarded for bringing SA into further disrepute. This is no different from what a Mugabe or a Pityana does: fleece and ruin your institutions/countries, and get handsomely rewarded for it. Deep in the heart of darkness....

Nick 9/29/2008 12:42:17 PM
EVERYONE WHO GETS FIRED FROM GOVERMENT IS ON SOME BACK HANDER. WHY NOT THE REST, LETS SEE WHAT HAPPENS WHEN THE EXPENSES GET MORE THAN THE INCOME.

Thobile Ndungane 9/29/2008 12:42:48 PM
He deserves every cent and please let it go.He has suffered enough and money is not everything.There are apartheid leaders who killed and maimed our people and they are still being paid today by the government and I complement our Parliament for looking after the leaders who have retired.

Mphula KP Napo 9/29/2008 12:43:33 PM
I dont think this this piece is worth debating, because this was happening over the years

Karen 9/29/2008 12:44:07 PM
Yes, this is the normal package for ex-presidents, so whether the president deserves it or not, he gets his free-ride for the rest of his life. Hopefully bringing this to everybodies attention will make people think a bit more about their next vote. Don't think you can try somebody for a while and if you don't like him, throw him out and try somebody else, if the ANC keeps doing this we'll have more than 3 or 4 ex-presidents alive and well and living off the tax-payers money.

Thobile Ndungane 9/29/2008 12:44:13 PM
He deserves every cent and please let it go.He has suffered enough and money is not everything.There are apartheid leaders who killed and maimed our people and they are still being paid today by the government and I complement our Parliament for looking after the leaders who have retired.

Girl - Freedom of intelligent thinkers 9/29/2008 12:44:56 PM
You have your freedom - now what you fighting for? Future, not the past ....... stop living in it. You know not what you speak. Either way Mbeki gets his package - good for him...

Heino 9/29/2008 12:49:06 PM
Hey Bhunu, that's a cool idea: Thabo Sixpence Mbeki sweeping my yard. Your esaggeration is absurd, but carries a grain of truth. There's something betweeen robbing a nation even after you've been removed from office, and sweeping a backyard. (In the latter case, however, I'd watch out to see that my broom is not filched as well). In SA, you never know. This president masquerading as pseudo bogus intellectual is capable of anything.

Caswell 9/29/2008 12:50:16 PM
Xhosa nostra

Neo 9/29/2008 12:51:56 PM
Yes he deserves it! stupid argument

WAM 9/29/2008 12:52:24 PM
Tiger Brands were fined R99 million for price fixing. Their CEO, Nick Dennis resigned and earned R65 million in share options.

Big Bad Bob 9/29/2008 12:52:29 PM
Gets a package of around 450000 pounds PA (to be adjusted over time) PLUS 100% of what he earned for being an MP PLUS Car, police chauffer, Secret Service protection. For life.

Mark N 9/29/2008 12:54:52 PM
Arms deal should be enough

Sandile Ngco 9/29/2008 12:54:54 PM
Thabo deserve 100% and a free six months trip around the world.

manci 9/29/2008 12:55:21 PM
It's standard practice for heads of state to receive these benefits. You must remember that these men take these positions knowing full well that under legistlation they can only serve or be employed if you like for two terms. And don't tell me they make enough money when they are president to support themselves for the rest of their lives - that's rubbish. Presidents make less than most CEOs of major companies and by that I mean they make less per annum than CEOs make per month. Grow up man!

Oom_Kosie 9/29/2008 12:57:27 PM
Thanks, Principal - I believe you are right. Think about the issue in another way. Packages like these may actually reduce the moral hazard for politicians to engage in corruption. If they know that the moment their term expired, they would not get any more income, they would have a much greater incentive to enrich themselves through corruption while in office. This generous retirement package may therefore be the lesser of two evils.

Mlu 9/29/2008 12:58:09 PM
All previous Predidents in South Africa are still earning a President's salary with perks. The article is just confusing the general public. PW Botha was still earning a president's salary before his death. FW and NR still are earning President's salaries.

Brendan 9/29/2008 1:02:19 PM
As CEO of the country he was vastly underpaid anyway. Let it be - he deserves his retirement.

L van Heerden 9/29/2008 1:05:13 PM
I think before we start debating issues with many sides, it is imperative that we seek out facts and understand them before we make a fool of ourselves. President Mbeki is not the only retired President getting all these perks. This should be enough enticement for presidents to retire, instead of holding on for dear life.

Point Blank 9/29/2008 1:07:19 PM
Why give just one person grief, why don't you condemn the black guy who was so racist?? Maybe it's because you are one? Why do you allow black people to make racist comments and say nothing but have everything to say about a white guy merely saying exactely the same thing but the other way round?? You go to Zimbabwe my friend we staying right here, finish and klaar.

Ryno 9/29/2008 1:08:09 PM
Readers justify Mbeki's exorbitant salary by comparing PW, FW and others. False comparison. PW was a real patriot, who benefited his country, rid it of terrorists, and earnd international respect. Mbeki and his crew are inept clowns in nice suits, who benefit only from the misplaced wave of PC (i.e. everyone overseas KNOWS what they realy are, but is too polite to say it). Mbeki is not a patriot-wouldn't get him to sweep my yard.

Thembalabantubonke 9/29/2008 1:08:09 PM
The man served 9 years of his life earning a pittance compared to other CEOs. Who says this is a golden handshake? Park of his income was contribution to the pension fund that guaranteed his income until he died adjusted for inflation. He paid for it, as it was part of his package while still in office. Do we really have to debate such frivolities.

L 9/29/2008 1:10:50 PM
I presume in your world, you can accuse someone without facts. Odd that you have not stated any facts that support your racist and dangerous accusations. People like you are better off back where they belong, in ignorance.

Tsepo 9/29/2008 1:11:32 PM
There were calls to open the enquiry of the Chris Hani assination, we need answer please Mbkeki. No he should not be given this package.

Len 9/29/2008 1:16:38 PM
You should chuckle each time you hear it because it is true. Consider that the state was almost bankrupt by 1994

The Truth 9/29/2008 1:17:12 PM
The UN or AU should pay him a pension rather,since he spent most of his 9 years in office overseas while ignoring issues here at home.

Blikkies 9/29/2008 1:17:33 PM
Of course not, but he will get it none the less! He has more than likely done a deal with the new chiefs who want in- get out now and we will give you some cash.

morena 9/29/2008 1:21:45 PM
clearly you don't understand politics, President should be taken care off even after they retired and why you complaining about Mbeki only how about Mandela, worst of all how about De Clerk

Big Bad Bob 9/29/2008 1:22:23 PM
Who says who is and who is not a "patriot". What's the definition? How does one prove patriotism. Of course it's purely subjective. But there are some things that can be established with a fair degree of certainty. Like the longest sustained period of economic growth in this country's history. Mbeki and his "crew" (sic) of "clowns" (sic) presided over that, whilst reducing income tax. If you can afford to pay him to sweep your yard, it's because of him and his cabinet.

LvH 9/29/2008 1:23:13 PM
If you measure success in real world terms, perhaps you would recognise that PW Botha failed in his attempt yo "rid" South Africa of "terrorists" because they run the country. The very same "terrorists" went to his funeral and showed remarkable restraint in not "sweeping" the floor with this pathetic of human beings. So, he failed.

Lauren 9/29/2008 1:23:44 PM
TM held the highest office in the land for two years. Just like every other exiting SA president, he deserves the same. Were the other presidents completely faultless? No! Have some respect, even if you do not agree with everything he did. Funny how we all think we can automatically do better. It's not all that easy guys.

Thembalabantubonke 9/29/2008 1:24:48 PM
If a president was to conduct an inquiry in every idiotic request he receives, he will spend more time discussing the terms of such inquiries. But then again, I suspect yours does not really contribute to the debate (if there was any)

Benzo 9/29/2008 1:25:36 PM
L, what sort of world do YOU live in? Hey man, do you know what crime, corruption, kleptocracy and racism mean? Have you ever heard of Jacki Selebe, Brett Kebble, the Arms Deal, Mbeki's kickbacks? Clearly you don't read newspapers. Get informed, man: do I need to prove that the sky is blue, or grass green? Or Mbeki corrupt? Or you an idiot?

Benzo 9/29/2008 1:26:18 PM
L, what sort of world do YOU live in? Hey man, do you know what crime, corruption, kleptocracy and racism mean? Have you ever heard of Jacki Selebe, Brett Kebble, the Arms Deal, Mbeki's kickbacks? Clearly you don't read newspapers. Get informed, man: do I need to prove that the sky is blue, or grass green? Or Mbeki corrupt? Or you an idiot?

Sjame 9/29/2008 1:26:38 PM
O my word, i feel sorry for your mom and dad..and your children one day..being a racist won't get you anywhere in SA. what you don't seem to understand is we whites will not sit back at watch "clueless" people attack us...get a life & a brain...

morena 9/29/2008 1:27:10 PM
hell not only old mutual, lot of companies in SA have a lot of unqualified directors, excutives,ect but because they are white its ok for blacks they cry out all sorts of things

tm 9/29/2008 1:27:23 PM
Check your facts and the news today about tiger brands.... they have taken the share options away from all 3 quilty parties....

Benzo 9/29/2008 1:28:22 PM
What does the 'L' stand for? I can think of several possibilities: Lonely, Looney, Larsonist, Latrine... You want facts: Are you alive and living in the 'new' SA? You may be a card-carrying ANC member, but do you feel inflation, and ask why we tAXPAYERS (IF YOU DO INDEED PAY TAXES) should foot the bill for one wo ruined our country?

Rob 9/29/2008 1:30:51 PM
Pension is one thing, but when you retire from anywhere else you dont get paid till the day you die. Why should old Thabo have it any different? He's not royalty, just a man, same as everyone else. The reason South Africa is in the financial ditch is because of the over-paying of politicians and the squandering of funds that could be used to house and feed the poor, build up and maintain the infrastructure (which is falling fast.) Stop treating politicains like chiefs, this is the 21st century

L 9/29/2008 1:33:23 PM
Again, you show such remarkable ignorance in that you provide so little in the form of facts. It is easy to make accusations, but harder to prove them. It would be easier to prove that you are an idiot, as I can use your own postings to prove it. As you know, simply mentioning names of individuals accused of corruption does not mean everyone mentioned is corrupt. I would have hoped that you would have understood this, but I suspect that might be a river too wide for you to cross.

Owen 9/29/2008 1:33:59 PM
Im sure Mr Mbeki can now devote more time to writing that book, or doing consultancy work like Bill Clinton is doing, he will certainly earn much more than the package everyone is talking about here. http://www.news24.com/News24/World/News/0,,2-10-1462_2300801,00.html

BALA BOY 9/29/2008 1:40:19 PM
you know the people in this country only want to talk money money money, very lazy to do the work only want to talk about how much. All of you on this column are pathethic and useless, go and get a life. Talk about how the work can be done and not remuneration all the time. People you are all disgraceful and it resemble sthe country with baboons like you all in it. Pigs.

Big Bad Bob 9/29/2008 1:41:21 PM
Since there are complaints about "unqualified" directors, would somebody please outline the formal qualifications that directors require. Or, alternatively, concede that that argument never had any substance and move on.

bicky stum 9/29/2008 1:42:17 PM
Suppose you were TM, would you have suggested a lesser payment? 100% for TM 100% for TM 100% for TM 100% for TM

KS 9/29/2008 1:44:46 PM
So many racist people on this site...its actually pathetic! Why not take that 'racism energy' that gets put into degrading other people into 'intelligencism' (yes thats a made up word) and be against useless unintelligent viruses who are in positions power (be it for whatever reason they got there), of all races, who are plundering our country! No.1 position of Captain Unintelligent = Malema! No.2 = Manto Tshabalala-Msimang! There is a whole team out thre!

Nana 9/29/2008 1:47:28 PM
Whats the fuss about all this, he has not committed crime that he cannot get his pecks, if so why dont you argue about the previous presidents ,this Tabo Mbeki issue is boring now, anything else to write about ????

Big Bad Bob 9/29/2008 1:47:44 PM
As usual the discussion has been reduced to an insult-fest by people who think that name calling is the same as having a well constructed argument.

Terence 9/29/2008 1:48:07 PM
You should chuckle each time you hear it because it is true. Consider that the state was almost bankrupt by 1994 - Len dont be thick like a brick now. We all know SA had one of the strongest economies in the world pre 94, hell i used to by 1 US dollar for R2.00. all this rubish only came after 94. And morena offcourse de clerk deserves all that money he is the one that freed you people he is the one you should all be thanking because you would all still be on robin island had it not been for him.

Ayanda Ntsho 9/29/2008 1:51:25 PM
Mr Editor, can you be so kind and let this guy know that Mr Mbeki is not the first to get the benefits that he will be getting and it not something that is unique to South Africa. Otherwise we run the risk of people of the same mind as the person who wrote the letter miscommunicating information to the unknowing public. Limited information is dangerous.

colin 9/29/2008 1:52:26 PM
If Mbekis bonus is a problem then lets claim back the bonuses of PW Botha Verword Kruger and all other useless heads of states we had before Mbeki - TM have offered his life to this country the least we can do is to respect the man.

Lilly 9/29/2008 1:57:19 PM
It is ludicrous !! And you want to know why the country does not have enough housing, electricity disruptions are the order of the day, healthcare and education is substandard and there is no decent public transport system? It's because politicians, MP's and presidents, fat cats, fill their own pockets with taxpayers money instead of investing the money for the benefit of the country and its citizens - Is everyone to blind to recognise this or does no one care?

Heinie 9/29/2008 1:57:31 PM
They could rather help the poor and hungry

Abrey 9/29/2008 1:58:57 PM
This precedent has been set long ago. He's just falling inline. How much impact will it have if he must only get 75%? Please leave the Americans where they belong.Why was this senseless article published? Gosh!!!!!

The Truth 9/29/2008 1:59:28 PM
I thought they were running the country (into the ground maybe) thanks to a negotiated settlement brought about by "yes" vote in a whites only referendum,and not due to the fact that any side won a war.

Yams Juju 9/29/2008 2:03:40 PM
He deserve better than that maybe 400 000 percent be cause he is the greatest president South Africa has ever had. No president will ever surplus his greatness here in Mzantsi. He deserves more than a hundred million per annum.

ayanda ntsho 9/29/2008 2:03:59 PM
Mr Editor, please educate me, would refusing to publish the letter from Saffa constitute on your part infringing on his freedom of speech? How far does "freedom" of speech goes? Does freedom of speech (and any other freedom for that matter) not placing a responsibility on the part of the person exercising the freedom to amongst other things, be accurate and correct on the information, otherwise i hold you personally responsible for this, unless of course it means that you make a 'buck' out of...

Zumaki (with respect to Lood and Beeld) 9/29/2008 2:05:56 PM
It's not the same as private companies' payouts to CEOs, etc, given that the ex-President is funded by taxpayers' money. However, in the bigger scheme of things, I REALLY don't care one iota about this! Have a comfortable, peaceful retirement, TB!

GKM 9/29/2008 2:06:41 PM
Surely the debate is not whether Mbeki deserves it but "what are we the taxpayers willing to pay retired presidents", going back to precedents set by Groot Krokodil and his elk. I know white men doing well in private practice from education provided to them by the military still also recieving army pensions for service pre 1994. What do we the taxpayers think is right?

KS 9/29/2008 2:09:34 PM
"unqualified directors" - you are too right...argument has no substance! If directors of major (private) companies are raising concerns about qualification...then what are the qualifications for the presidency and MP positions?

Thembalabantubonke 9/29/2008 2:13:52 PM
1980s ? 1% growth * Early 1990s ? SA was technically bankrupt ? defined as when national debt is more than 3% of GDP ? in 1994, it was 9%. * During the Mandela years, we had 2% economic growth * For the last seven years ? 5%! * Next year ? 4% - despite world wide recession, oil prices, electricity crisis. * JSE ? 2001 ? 8000 points and everyone was pleased; 2007 ? 30 000 points (although it has lost some growth now) * Platinum ? up R5000/ounce since January * Here?s a thought ? with cuts of electricity, less platinum comes out of ground but what?s left is not going anywhere and while it stays in the ground, the price goes up!

Sean 9/29/2008 2:13:53 PM
struggle hero,economic boom etc-call it what you will.Mbeki was still working for you.Your taxes employed him.Your benefits are linked to peformance-if you dont perform you dip out.Mbeki did sweet FA during his tenure-why reward incompetence?

RESIGNED 9/29/2008 2:14:45 PM
But he RESIGNED, he didn't come to the end of his term, or retired of old age, he RESIGNED because he was recalled (Fired). Now nowhere in the world can anybody claim any kind of benefits for being FIRED or Resigning from a position. I also want to be a Gov't Employee...

Gavin 9/29/2008 2:19:32 PM
Just be glad he's gone, and now the healing process can begin.

Nicx 9/29/2008 2:19:59 PM
Thabo Mbeki is certainly entitled to his new package, the precedent was set a long time ago and according to international practice it is also so, however as to whether has deserves his package the answer is a resounding NO. Another issue worth pondering is whether Pres. Motlanthe will be offered the same sort of compensation when his term comes to an end in six months time. Personally I hope he is well compensated..but then I also hope he stays.

HC 9/29/2008 2:21:42 PM
Well done Pres Mbeki you deserve your retirement, not sure everybody on this forum would like to work 7 days a week, 18 hours a day. Ethan, please let go of those of us who prefer to go to Australia or elsewhere instead of being killed by some IDIOT for a cellphone.

Simple Gordon 9/29/2008 2:21:49 PM
Can someone update me on what happened to the person that used to call him/herself Kolobe ? Where is this person lately ? Can it be that he or she is busy realigning his/her loyality ?

Ethan 9/29/2008 2:23:07 PM
So you are also like him. Same message to you.I quote JB "not like you black people, sit around and do nothing...as always. Soon u will fight for money and food." This is very insulting. And then you have the nerve to tell me not to vote for ANC. Like I said, comments like these make me wanna vote for ANC even though I am not happy with the current leadership.

The Truth 9/29/2008 2:24:17 PM
None really.The NP used terror and fear to achive and hold on to power and were illegitimate because they were not elected by the majority of South Africa.The ANC achieved power through terror and are illegitimate as they base their mass support on the illiterate millions whom they promise the moon to every five years and give them a garden variety rock instead.They also seem to maintain their power through fear (wit gevaar/DA rule),just as the Nats did with their "swart gevaar",no difference .

L 9/29/2008 2:25:49 PM
President Mbeki was the President of South Africa and not the president of the mental insitution you inhabit. Perhaps you should ask for your change with the head of your institution or Oranje. Otherwise, people like you do not contribute anything to debate, other than your racist innuendo and claims not supported by facts. Get a life after, Benzine!!

L 9/29/2008 2:27:38 PM
Always happen when people insist on accusing others without ever so much providing facts. The Sunday times published a story accusing President Mbeki of taking a bribe for the ANc and Zuma (wow, accepting R30m to dole it out to others). They promised a follow up, but nothing so far. We might have to wait forever

See colour? 9/29/2008 2:46:09 PM
There is a lot of bitterness in most people. How can you assume that a person making a comment is white or black and then attack them on that basis. be at piece with yourselves and resolve your inner issues. Piet Pompies van Rooyen white Khumalo.

Enock 9/29/2008 2:54:42 PM
It can also be that he is busy doing what he gets paid for. Unlike me and you using employers time to write to news24.

Alex 9/29/2008 3:09:30 PM
Most ordinary South Africans will have to contribute to a pension fund for 50 years in order to earn 100% of their last salary before retirement as a pension. Why political leaders get anytihng more than this is beyond me. Also, Mr Mbeki wiped more than R300 billion in value off the JSE with his ill timed comments about the resignation of Trevor Manuel, this will have an effect on pensions of ordinary people as well as many pension funds invest in these shares. Does he deserve his pension????

morena 9/29/2008 3:19:10 PM
had it not been for De Klerk negotiating with the ANC you will sure be dead by now, de klerk had no choice he knew we were about to pounce on you, there would have been a massacare in SA

ada 9/29/2008 3:19:24 PM
De Klerk is the one who "FREED US"??It's that type of mentality that makes makes me wish all "your type of people" get fed up and leave the country, as they always threaten.Trust me, we'll surive. AD.

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