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shaunswindon
 
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Israel and a different opinion

18 July 2014, 07:16

Good day to everyone who decides to read this. Recently I became aware that there was a certain sect of orthodox Jewish people who felt that the state of Israel was not justified. I found this quite shocking to hear at first as I was brought up in a house-hold which supported the state of Israel because they supported and still traded with South Africa during the Apartheid sanction period from 1963 to eventually end only later in 1993.

"25 years ago, on September 16, 1987, South Africa’s ambassador in Israel was summoned to the Foreign Ministry’s office in Jerusalem, and informed of the Israeli cabinet’s decision to level sanctions on his nation’s apartheid regime. Until then, Israel was the only Western nation that upheld diplomatic ties with South Africa".

So I wrote to them and said this:

"Good evening, I was brought up as a Goyim but later in Life, after settling near the largest Jewish community in South Africa, that my great grandmother on my Mother’s side of the family was Jewish. According to the Zionists that makes me Jewish?

Regardless this was not the reason for me writing. I wanted to request where it says in the Torah exactly that Jewish people should by his command live amongst the nations of the World as penance after the destruction of Solomon's temple.

I would appreciate your assistance in this matter.

Many blessings to you my brothers of the light”.

They replied with this:

"The prohibition on rebellion against the nations and creating our own state is found in the Talmud, Kesubos 111a. There the Rabbis derived from a verse in Song of Songs 2:7 that when G-d sent the Jewish People into exile, He make them take 3 oaths: not to go up to the Holy Land as a wall, not to rebel and fight wars against the nations, and not to force the end of exile. Having a government in Eretz Yisroel is a violation of the oath not to force the end of exile, since sovereignty inherently contradicts the concept of exile. Furthermore, the State was established through mass immigration (a violation of “that they should not go up as a wall”) and wars (a violation of “not to rebel against the nations of the world”).  

The explanation of these sources is as follows. In our religious beliefs it is clear that we were exiled from the Land of Israel two thousand years ago, by G-d’s hand, and He warned us with an oath that we should not return from the Exile, and not go up to the Holy Land en masse. We Jews believe in G-d with the fullest trust, like a small child trusts his mother. Even in the most difficult situations, when he grasps his mother’s hand he is calm and assured. So are we with G-d, completely trusting in whatever situation. To go up from the Exile by our own means and physical strength means, by definition, that we have lost our trust in the Creator; this is a denial that G-d sent us into exile, and this is a rebellion against G-d – Who commanded us to remain in exile until the coming of the Messiah. Believing Jews cannot do such a thing.  

This would be so even if the Zionists would have established their State on an empty tract of land, without previous inhabitants; even then it would be forbidden by our Torah. How much more so when they did so at the expense of the previous inhabitants – driving them out of their home and murdering them, their wives and their children. This is certainly against the Jewish belief, which teaches that we should be merciful. The tragedy of the Zionist State is very great; we fervently await its prompt and peaceful collapse. 

Look at our website, where you will find a wealth of material on the subject. Note especially *removed due to N24 rules* as well as

*removed due to N24 rules* regarding the clearly voiced Torah-Law about Zionism, and see

See also *removed due to N24 rules* which, despite its being set out as more of an internal, Jewish site, will also be helpful to you. 

Here are more sources in the written Torah: Deut. 4:27 states that G-d will scatter the Jews among all the nations. Since this scattering was an act of G-d, Who knows what is best for us, we are not to come back to the land until He tells us to do so. Deut. 28:64 also speaks of this scattering, as well as Lev. 26:33. In Lev. 26:34 and 43 the Torah says that the land must rest during exile, so clearly we may not end exile early without a command from G-d. In Lev. 26:44 it says that when we are in the land of our enemies G-d protects us from destruction, implying that if we are in the Holy Land during exile we have no such promise.

There are many verses in the Bible that say clearly that G-d, through His emissary, the messiah, will be the one Who redeems the Jewish people from exile and gathers them in. See Deuteronomy 30:3, Isaiah 27:12, 40:9, 41:14, 43:5-6, 52:12, 54:7, 56:8, Jeremiah 16:15, 23:3, 30:10, 31:9, 33:7, Ezekiel 11:17, 20:34, 28:25, 34:13, 37:21, 36:24. Hosea 1:7, Micah 2:12, Zachariah 4:6, 8:7, Psalms 53:7, 106:47.

On the verse in Deut. 30 the Abarbanel, one of the most important Scriptural commentators, says: "We see from here that Hashem Himself will return our captives, and it will not be like the beginning of the Second Temple era, when the Jews returned to their land by the permission of Cyrus, king of Persia."

In regard your Jewish identity, if you are Jewish by your Mother’s side, you are fully Jewish by the Jewish low, this is not a Zionist idea, but this is the Jewish low.

Thank you

Rabbi E. Beck".

So the reason for me posting this is so that everyone can see that there are different opinions to both sides of the story. Lesson is keep an open mind and don’t let others influence your opinions. Please believe me when I say religion is not the answer to the Human species future. This is the final hurdle we all face as a species before our next step into the realms of the “aware” and “civilized”.

For a second though imagine there is a super natural being known as G-d. By this information from one of the most ancient of Holy Books we need to see how the “prophecy” has come true. This line making that point, “it says that when we are in the land of our enemies G-d protects us from destruction, implying that if we are in the Holy Land during exile we have no such promise”.

Knowledge would be to “read news reports from both sides of the divide”

Wisdom would be to, “get to know your enemy before you murder them”.

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