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BEE all to end all
27/06/2008 11:05
Any form of discrimination, even to "redress" the "wrongs" of the past, are abhorrent. These open ended BEE/AA policies are responsible for the loss of a great number of potential skills as currently disadvantaged youngsters are forced to emigrate to find worthwhile employment. Werner, you will now be tagged as a "racist" for these sentiments. My question to those crying foul, where is the better life for all? - Jim |
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BEE
27/06/2008 11:05
BEE is not meant to uplift those who suffered under apartheid but rather to enrich the black minority in power. And it curretly meets this goal. - c4 |
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Good to see the Chinese included
27/06/2008 11:06
I am happy to see the Chinese included in BEE as with Chinas power they could provide money for local Chinese to do BEE deals and gain a foothold here in SA. Good news for China. - John |
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a complete joke
27/06/2008 11:06
I think by now even the most blinkered ANC supporters must have realised that these policies are not about uplifting the previosuly disadvantaged. They are about skin colour pure and simple- regardless of wealth or social standing. They are trying to portray an image to the rest of the world of a transformed society. Unfortunately the rest of the world are not as stupid or as incompetent as our government and they see through the farce. One only has to look at out unemployment and poverty stats to see this. Malaysia have had similar policies in effect to try and give the wealth of the country back to the ethnic malays. This has failed miserably and just led to corruption and cronyism amongst elected officials. Which sounds vaguley familiar. - patrick bateman |
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Suburb
27/06/2008 11:07
I agree with everything you say but the Chinese have their own agenda and it's about time people realised they intend this country as a suburb of Beijing. The only reason they want the BEE advantages is to immerse themselves quickly into powerful positions from where they can exert control. - Snake |
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ANC racism forever
27/06/2008 11:07
The whole self-concept of the ANC is based on liberation struggle with the added idea that it was black people fighting for their ownership of this country. The premise no longer stands after '94 but still is used as a political narrative, however invalid and outdated. The focus has somewhat shifted to a 'fight against poverty' but with their current self-serving racial policies they are ironically back to apartheid mode. We are not moving forward as a nation because of that. - Petrus |
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Thought provoking
27/06/2008 11:14
Is it not time to abolish BEE and it's other facades? Many people said it would not work and mostly they were correct. Blacks should now work together for a better life instead of trying to legislate this better life to the detriment of the country at large. This is no differant to what was done under Apartheit.
But maybe us blacks don't want the responsibility of building a better future for ourselves. It is time to change the way in which we conduct ourselves, or do we not have the capacity? - Antelope |
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Hands off BEE cake
27/06/2008 11:33
BEE is here to stay for the next century. BEE should be exclusively reserved for blacks who were and are presently excluded from the mainstream of our economy. Unfortunately the Chinese wants to hijack the BEE deals such as Sasol shares at the expense of the blacks because of greed. Whites benefited out of apartheid for more than 400 years and they should simply be excluded from BEE transactions. - Calvin Mkhize |
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Ever seen a disadvantaged Chinese ..?
27/06/2008 11:34
Chinese people have never felt let alone be affected by the wrath of apartheid.For the courts to rule in their favour is a visible sign of how our country is heading for the sewers.I intend no discrimination here nor support the Labour Mins statement but i fully agree with him.The chinese had & still has a bigger slice in our economy & i fail to understand why the hell their plea came to be considered when they were still advantaged from the onset.Welcome to China Town(s). - Les-Maada |
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To Calvin
27/06/2008 11:47
It's exactly this way of thinking that is sinking this country. What about the greedy few blacks who benefit from these deals. Go ask black people in the street if they have had any benefit from BEE. Maybe you are one of the few blacks benefiting - hence why you dont want to share the BEE cake. - c4 |
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Beware the new colonialists
27/06/2008 11:48
China is conquering, Africa, one Country at a time, Almost all Copper, in The Congo, is China owned, and massive amount's of raw materials through out Africa, are china owned, due to desperate trade exchanges.ITS HAPPENING Beware the new Colonialists - Patriot |
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ANC not racism forever
27/06/2008 11:49
It is only few years we have BEE introduced in or country and yet people are complaining. We blacks want to get to the same status our white counterparts got. We want to be able to send our children to overseas to look for jobs and better qaulity education. How can we send them if they cannot even speak English? How can we afford the model C school if we do not get BEE, because the white people increased schools fees in their former school so that blacks can not afford them? - Masese |
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Calvin
27/06/2008 11:50
As you put it,whites should be excluded from all bee deals,on the other hand you preach equility,but you say whites must be excluded,damn dude but you are a hypocrit,can some one please tell me why after 14 years and after basically all rights were taken away from whote people,do whe still do better financially than black people?And don't start crying apartheid,cause apartheid has nothing to do with it,I never benefitted from apartheid,neither did my parents,I was prepared to WORK!!!!!!!!! - proud to be white |
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Move on
27/06/2008 11:51
The ANC government are still fighting apartheid. If only they could see that Apartheid was abolished in 1994, South Africa would be a better place, both socially & economically. We need to live for now & for the future. The past has to be forgotten & not continually used as an excuse for the failure of the current government. The failure is blatantly obvious. - Malcolm X |
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BEE not needed in RSA.
27/06/2008 11:54
There are enough skilled professional in RSA to do what is required & more. Unfortunately there is a focus on providing for previously disadvantaged people, mostly black, and now Chinese also. The previously competent but advantaged professionals were retrenched / replaced / retired / etc... to make way for BEE without an effective transition / transfer / migration of competancies. The result we see is a direct result of this. To fix it, the bottom line is a change in ATTITUDE. - Matrix |
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Stop this racism
27/06/2008 12:00
I really wish Calvin and his cronies would stop this every one who is not black is bad witch hunt. BEE and AA has not worked, it has enriched a small elite, it has destroyed the civil service, it has bedeviled service delivery and has made us look like idiots in the eyes of the international community. - Pangea |
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how to answer
27/06/2008 12:02
There is truly no negative comment a white person can make about BEE without being labeled racist. And no black person can make a positive comment about it without sounding vengeful. BEE is an important (though unfortunate (for me)) social tool, and while I dont always agree with the implementation it is really needed. As for the chinese, I wish them prosperity as long as they aren't helped at cost of the really disadvantaged community. my 2 cents. - Andrew |
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how to answer
27/06/2008 12:04
There is truly no negative comment a white person can make about BEE without being labeled racist. And no black person can make a positive comment about it without sounding vengeful. BEE is an important (though unfortunate (for me)) social tool, and while I dont always agree with the implementation it is really needed. As for the chinese, I wish them prosperity as long as they aren't helped at cost of the really disadvantaged community. my 2 cents. - Andrew |
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bee and SA
27/06/2008 12:04
Bee is meant to bring those with an inferior education up to par with whites.Blacks who went to modelc's/private are a minority .yet afrikaners always focus on this.Currently: show me a white school that provides a worse education than the average state black school..?I find it funny that afrikaners want a non racial society-but when they emigrate to uk/aus..live in areas where other white saffers live..And on dating sites.they are only prepared to date whiteys:-)
BE HONEST!! - zen |
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Cut the crap
27/06/2008 12:09
Great article, Wernardt! Racist regimes will never prosper, and it's high time the underlying (and obvious) racism in BEE is shamed. The problems we face are poverty and education - NOT unemployed black people. BEE is costing our economy billions through loss of skills and the failures of incompetence, and everyone loses. I'd much rather see those billions ploughed into poverty alleviation and free, 1st-class education. 14 years into our democracy now, the previously disadvantaged would have - Pro-common sense |
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Wernardt
27/06/2008 12:11
People should at least make reseach of their topics before posting their drivel...firstly only south african born citizens can benefit from BEE, not the ones that have been given citizenship like the migrant Chinese. no african(Zimbabwean, Nigerian etc)can benefit from BEE unless they were born in south Africa.BEE has nothing to so with racial discrimination but economic discrimination..thats the reason white female benefit from BEE. BEE mean to empower those that were discriminated economically.our arguments was that the Chinese were only discriminated against racially but definitely not economically, for instance they studied in the model c schools and traded freely in the past, so what justifies their PDI status.thats the argument? - Kolobe |
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Black Education
27/06/2008 12:14
Education is the answer to fighting poverty. The problem is that Black teachers are too lazy and never bothered. Why do you want the White people to educate you. Are you not clever enough to do this yourselves? So what are you saying? That without the White people, you won't be able to educate yourselves, then why do you hate the White people so much? - Hansie |
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Editor is obviously also biased. Comment re fundamantals.
27/06/2008 12:18
I poste a comment regarding fundamental & editor did not include it in this column. Lets see if they publish this 1. Agreed with article & statement made that BEE does NOT benefit anyone. To be successful there MUST be a transition of skills & change of attitude. BEE devides not unite. Theory does NOT make Competency. Blacks studied, Whites HAD. Never the 2 shall share. Zim an example of how it can & does go wrong. - Matrix |
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Time line
27/06/2008 12:18
This is why a time line, with a clear ending point should be drafted for AA. All people want to be treated as equal and thus there will be no peaceful integration unless AA ends soon. People born after a certain year should be free as all. BEE should still be carried out to certain extents to bring a balance, but by fully implementing AA against people based on ethnic race will always be a troubled child rebelling against the demolishers of full freedom for all. - ElectroMan |
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Shame Zen !!!
27/06/2008 12:23
Cannot get a partner from your own cultural community? By the way, I am emmigrating so I presume U R pointing at me too. It is bcause of people like you & Calvin & others AND Mostly crime. What you are promoting is also criminal. Shame, other communities / cultural groups also probably do not understand you!!! - Matrix |
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bee and chinese
27/06/2008 12:23
Bee has failed is not doing what is was suppose to do, and only a few are really benefitting big money from it. And for the Chinese also to be under that now it is RIDICULOUS! Who and what will be next in line. Becuase of that we will see half of China coming to our beautiful country! - jj |
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Natural Integration Processes
27/06/2008 12:25
The integration processes, socially more so than economically will benifit by abolishing the AA strategies. There can still be companies and a department in government that strive for BEE, but other than that it will only lead on the discriminationing, anti-sociallistic ways. We are not living under apartheid anymore and people will take hand more and more in natural ways, but by forcing something which effects a person in his own life will never be a positive approach. - ElectroMan |
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No problem with BEE and AA ideology
27/06/2008 12:30
As I have stated in my blog numerous times, I have no problem with BEE an AA ideals, but the systems need serious revision. I am a member of the young, white, educated community and admitted before that I have benefited from apartheid and therefore have a debt to pay. The current systems, however, make it impossible for me to repay that debt through my taxes or jobs that I may create for others. If things go on like this, this country will lose my skills and those of many others like me. - SpytiK |
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BEE compunding "new SA" racism?
27/06/2008 12:51
As a liberal white 30-something male I have had to learn that "PDI" is a state of being - it has nothing to do with the extent of one?s liberal views. It IS necessary to go back and right the wrongs of history. This constant need to label ourselves in terms of "race" is just as arbitrary and possibly as destructive as it was in the apartheid era. Racial classification for BEE purposes perpetuates racism as we are forced to declare and confront ourselves as different almost every day. It is "discriminating" by definition. We should rather base our views of "PDI" on an economic (not a racial) scale. - Liberal Boy |
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Stop talking about something you don't know
27/06/2008 13:15
BEE has made more white BEE millionnaires than it has black ones. Black foreigners are excluded from BEE in not naturalised b4 1994.
Yes, it is true that BEE is not working, but not for the reasons stated above. In fact, even those who are supporting it also use wrong reasons to do so. I should know, I work in the field. - Tabudi |
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To zen
27/06/2008 13:22
It is called freedom of association when one decides to date only in a particular culture group. It has more to do with ensuring sharing cultural beliefs and background with potential life partners than with color. The concept of freedom of association is fortunately underwritten by our constitution. - flip |
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Kolobe and others
27/06/2008 13:22
BEE has nothing to do with giving people access to proper education. That is something which must be addressed by improving quality in (so called) township schools. BEE has had two major consequences: Giving people shares at discount prices in large corporations , and AA positions in companies reserved for PDIs. I have seen the reporting of major companies on Employment Equity and the only thing they indicate on those scorecards is race. Black or white, coloured or indian. - Wernardt |
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Stop being ignorant
27/06/2008 13:24
Please stop being ignorant.
This BEE deal, is not for China, but rather for South African citizens of chinese decent.
There is a difference.
I am of Chinese decent, and we were treated like 2nd class citizens back in the day.
Just because you have never seen a disadvantaged chinese doesn't justify your story. So many claim to have never seen a disadvantaged black person back in the day. Thats what apartheid was all about. All the "non" racist white folk, never knew...... Please get your facts - CD boy |
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