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Xenophobia Q&A
21/05/2008 07:58 - (SA)
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| Professor Hussein Solomon lectures in the Department of Political Sciences at the University of Pretoria and is also Director of the Centre for International Political Studies. He also sits on the International Steering Committee of the Toda Institute for Global Peace and Policy Research in Hawaii and serves as a member of the Executive Committee of Global Action to Prevent War. |
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Cape Town - Xenophobic violence in Gauteng has claimed the lives of at least 23 people and displaced thousands more.
Officials are struggling to understand what has prompted the violence, with Gauteng Safety and Security MEC Firoz Cachalia saying the attacks were not just "spontaneous acts of xenophobic hatred".
"We must call a spade a spade... these are criminal acts," Cachalia said.
Opposition parties have called on President Thabo Mbeki to deploy the army and set up refugee camps to help curb the violence.
To shed more light on what's behind the xenophobic violence in Gauteng, News24 chatted to Professor Hussein Solomon, Director of the Centre for International Political Studies and serves as a member of the International Steering Committee of the Toda Institute for Global Peace and Policy Research as well as the Executive Committee of Global Action to Prevent War.
News24: What's behind the xenophobic violence we are seeing?
Hussein Solomon: Frankly frustration. Economic woes are increasing with increase fuel and food prices, high unemployment levels and poor service delivery as well as high crime rates. In this situation where some foreigners are involved in crime, all become useful scapegoats.
News24: It seems like it's sprung up suddenly, but how prevalent has xenophobia been in South Africa in recent months?
Hussein Solomon: Xenophobia has not just suddenly sprung up - various studies by Idasa, Human Sciences Research Council, University of the Western Cape and Institute for Security Studies has been warning of the rising tide of xenophobia since the early 1990s at least.
Government however has not responded to this. Moreover, there have been incidents reported in the local press for years on xenophobic attacks from Khayalitsha in the Western Cape to Durban in KwaZulu Natal and to Gauteng.
News24: So foreigners are being used as scapegoats for the worsening economic conditions we're experiencing currently?
Hussein Solomon: Yes, some foreigners are involved in crime but not the majority - all however have become scapegoats. But I think it is also important to acknowledge that it is now spreading not just to foreigners but to other South African ethnic groups like Shangaans being targeted by Zulus etc.
News24: Is there a third force at work?
Hussein Solomon: When government messes up it is much easier to say something called a third force. No, I do not believe that there is some malicious outside entity deviously ratcheting up feelings of hatred in cities and towns across the country.
News24: How could government have prevented the problem from getting to this level?
Hussein Solomon: First it is not just government. The media has a role to play in moving away from negative stereotyping of immigrants. Religious leaders can play a role in reconciliation.
But government has a role to play in not just educating citizens of the various international legal obligations they have but enacting domestic legislation strengthening the legal system in terms of hate crimes against foreigners, to come up with a more coherent migration policy, to work more closely with structures like the United Nations High Commission on Refugees and the International Organisation for Migration and stopping the corruption inside the Department of Home Affairs.
News24: And how can government effectively address it now and prevent further escalation?
Hussein Solomon: Right now the issue of curfews in certain areas need to be implemented as a matter of urgency to prevent further escalation.
News24: Apart from law enforcement, what other short-term measure should be implemented to prevent escalation of the violence?
Hussein Solomon: Community forums need to be established which include local government officials, the police and members of civil society as a matter of urgency to tackle this matter and these need to function even after violence subsides.
News24: Should the army be brought in to curb the violence? Is their symbolism to bringing in the army the government would rather avoid?
Hussein Solomon: Personally I believe that the army should be brought in, violence is spreading at an alarming rate. The military can be used to place a cordon around an area whilst the police actually go into the area doing house to house searches for weapons and the like.
News24: How much of an impact has Jacob Zuma's anti-immigrant sentiments had in stirring up xenophobia?
Hussein Solomon: I think it is important not to personalise this but I do believe that if senior politicians give the wrong signals, then xenophobic violence will simply intensify.
News24: Gauteng safety and security MEC Firoz Cachalia has said they could not have predicted this violence. Is this to be believed?
Hussein Solomon: No - as I mentioned above - government just was not listening - same with the Eskom debacle.
News24: Do other African countries also experience this?
Hussein Solomon: Yes, in the Ivory Coast for instance there was a large number of foreigners and it was not a problem for decades until a major economic downturn, then they were attacked and the like.
News24: Is this likely to spread across South Africa?
Hussein Solomon: This is already occurring - it is spreading.
News24: Will this violence negatively affect South Africa and its image abroad?
Hussein Solomon: Absolutely - not just image but also South Africa as a safe destination for investment.
News24: How bad is South Africa's illegal immigrant problem? We keep hearing differing figures, but how bad is it really?
Because you are talking about something illegal, you are talking about something undocumented and therefore difficult to quantify. The best figures I have heard put the figure at between 2.5 million and 4.1 million illegal immigrants in South Africa.
Professor Solomon, thank you for talking to News24.
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Current Violence
21/05/2008 08:49
Well i studied SA for 3 years and the major problem is good competitive education. Post 94 the well connected bunch of people became more and more rich, The BEE is only helping the well conected guys. The international investors are forced to have some BEE partner which kills there enthi of building local skills. I mean why should they build skills when just taking few bunch of well connected blacks can solve the legal requirement.
The result is frustration and rich getting richer. - Kapil |
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xenophobic
21/05/2008 08:54
south africans have come to far to be going through such a waste. And what is the president doing about it or maybe someone from the parlement had something to do about it. - don |
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Xenophobia
21/05/2008 09:01
We long to be with our families in our home countries..It is not fun to be here but circumstances beyond our own control force us to be here .. please bear with us when we need you the most.. ...We will go back as soon as there is political and economic stability in our country.. - Dzombotiti |
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Good Prof!
21/05/2008 09:02
For telling it exactly like it is! - truth |
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Xenophobic
21/05/2008 09:10
One of the questions asked by is news24 is whether anti-immigrant sentiments by MR Zuma has had any impact on the current Xenophic violence
Now my question is, has Mr Zuma echoed any sentiments which are anti-foreigners. I honestly do not recall. SHu-man - Shu-man |
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This is not xenophobia
21/05/2008 09:25
This is just frustration, we all know who are behind this, unemployed and ill educated, criminals and certain tribes which I won?t mention. We can not therefore just call it xenophobia; we need to look at various factors on what really influenced all these. I personally feel that this is due to high unemployment levels and poor service delivery, and hatred from certain tribes. We also know that only certain tribes are behind this, we should remember that not only the foreigners are attacked, even other South Africans tribes, so I would like to correct that this is not xenophobia. This might lead us to civil war- otherwise the government should immediately intervene and certain tribes need an urgent education!!! We do not need to beat, chase, and kill other human being, whether is an illegal or legal immigrant, other tribes that should not happen. The other problem is that other tribe undermines the other ones they value themselves important. Shame!! - Maanda |
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This is not xenophobia
21/05/2008 09:25
This is just frustration, we all know who are behind this, unemployed and ill educated, criminals and certain tribes which I won?t mention. We can not therefore just call it xenophobia; we need to look at various factors on what really influenced all these. I personally feel that this is due to high unemployment levels and poor service delivery, and hatred from certain tribes. We also know that only certain tribes are behind this, we should remember that not only the foreigners are attacked, even other South Africans tribes, so I would like to correct that this is not xenophobia. This might lead us to civil war- otherwise the government should immediately intervene and certain tribes need an urgent education!!! We do not need to beat, chase, and kill other human being, whether is an illegal or legal immigrant, other tribes that should not happen. The other problem is that other tribe undermines the other ones they value themselves important. Shame!! - Maanda |
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sorry, my foreign friends, but...
21/05/2008 09:28
lets not beat about the bush. Things are not going to get better in your home country. As long as you are here in SA, the people left in your country will continue to maintain the status quo. All you have is the hope that things will get better in places like Zimbabwe, and sadly, hope is not enough to get rid of dictators... - konstabel |
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xenophobia
21/05/2008 09:30
we should stop looking out for some one to blame our probems on.and start looking in to find anwsers to our problems.its one thing to sit and complain about the state we are in.its far to easy to blame others.but its up to use as a whole to try make a Deference. - Dean vanHuyssteen |
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Give aliens time to vacate
21/05/2008 10:02
As the attacking has started and still spreading across many areas in South Africa,We must give them chance or time to pack their staff and leave our country instead of abusing,killing,vandalizing and stealing especially burning their properties,they are human like us.They now see that it is risky to stay in South Africa how are they going to leave while we still burning their transport,clothes,documents(passport e.t.c).Please South Africans.
Bethuel - Bethuel |
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Well done Prof
21/05/2008 10:12
Well done Prof... I am saddened by the lack of solutions. Politici are "appalled" and "condemns" the attacks but still more innocent people are getting killed by the day! It worries me that the attacks are well organized and maybe suggests a group or organization?
South Africa must pull through this one, we have overcame so much hurdles in the past.... - Sad |
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Champions of Procrastination
21/05/2008 10:14
The professor has just confirmed what we already know... that the ANC are champion procrastinators (Illegals, Eskom, et al). If Bob can't see what he has done to Zim and TM holds hands with Bob and must surely share a mindset, what hope does this country have? Now, TM is in Tanzania, while the townships burn once more. - Sean |
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anti-immigrant sentiments
21/05/2008 10:14
I also suprised just like Shu-man as to when did Zuma echo anti-immigrant sentiments. I honestly do NOT recall. Again the issue about Zulus being after Shangaans is problematic. I have a problem when influntial people make such comments because that breeds steriotypes in our society. - Njabulo |
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Memorial to our lost Rainbow nation attetude
21/05/2008 10:17
Remember just a few years ago we were the rainbow nation ,The Future of this country was bright full of hope and promis ,yes it was the light at the end of the long dark tunnel of apartheid,but im afraid that light was a giant freight train ,and its comming our way ,i guess xenophobia starts with the foreners,then the boers,the rest of the remaining whites,colourds then the remaining non blacks,with great regret and sadness our beloved SA is now lost,now we well see the true evel of the blackman. - Freddy |
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South Africans lazy and un educated
21/05/2008 10:20
We employ foreigners to do menial but necessary work - why, because they are honest, hard working and educated. Locals on the other hand are slovenly, dishonest and incompetent. Locals seem to feel entitled to (and have been led to expect) all the good things in life without putting in an honest days work. The illegals, who have nothing are prepared to work, that is why they get ahead and the locals do not. An unfortunate genralisation... - Craig |
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Violence and no law
21/05/2008 10:21
More action should be taken to prevent illegal immigrants coming to our country, as they are a contributing factor for why crime are occurring in SA. With what is happening, the South African government is not concerned, as long is they have more money to put in their pockets and help the corruption of bringing in the illegal immigrants to sell of drugs, take the legal SA people's jobs and make money of committing crimes. - Rene |
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Well said
21/05/2008 10:22
This is what happens when civil servants don't do their jobs, sit on their behinds all day and accept bribes of R10 to let illegal immigrants over the border. Discipline is what is required. How can students burn down schools when they are unhappy! It is ludicrous! Bring back discipline to small things and start doing your jobs... - Deon |
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@ Dzombotiti
21/05/2008 10:34
I feel and understand your issues, and I am completely against these brutal attacks. I understand why your people have come here, and I wish SA was in a position to protect you. However at the moment South Africa has a complex set of problems, that can?t even guarantee the safety and survival of it?s own people. When you add another 3 or 4 million people to this, you are asking for trouble. A balloon can only expand to its capacity, if you add too much to it, its going to blow. I wish there was a way that everyone could live together, and I wish that the people of this country were not in the position that we are, but as our president?s example is not helping the cause. He is out saving the rest of Africa, but forgets about his own people. How can you then expect that he?s going to listen to the plight of neighboring countries. - Johann |
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Let there be peace
21/05/2008 10:39
Im Tsonga speaking that means im also targeted as caming from mozambique. south african killing their own brothers and sisters how we goner live peacefully in our own land.We are going back to the old Aparthied era where othe enthnic group were targeted as their came from the north and are dark in skin colour.Please the goverment must act now before is to late.Like when thier said about Ruwanda, the Tusti and Hutus killing each other let it not happens in our motherland. - Ambrose |
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Government needs to take its head out of the sand
21/05/2008 10:40
Government needs to take its head out of the sand and realise that the people in SA are not all wonderful, peaceful and humane. We have a new generation out there who's parents do not discipline them as they are too busy trying to put bread on the table. They have no money no decent homes and no jobs to go to so run around the streets causing chaos, stealing, killing etc. There is no freedom in this country - the promises made and our constitution mean nothing if there is no rule of law. - concerned citizen |
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Important Points to end Xenophobia.
21/05/2008 10:50
(1) Police should stop accepting bribes from illegal immigrants, (2) foreign affairs must stop dishing ID document like take-aways, (3) municipalities must stop house for bribe activities, (3) trading spot must be reserved for S.A citizens before being awarded to immigrants, (4) criminal elements must be prosecuted and police must be competent in handling criminal cases, without communities resorting to kangaroo courts (We all know that the brunt of these macabre beatings also affect South Africans involved in crime due to frustration in the way police handle criminal cases), (5) Business forums need to be established that foster employment for South Africans (Charity begins at home), (6) Our communities through community forums must practice zero tolerance to hate crimes, encourage integration, discourage the divisive elements. (7) Government departments with a huge responsibility to serve S.A citizens like Housing, Public works, Social development, Labour, Health, Education must deliver to the poor according to their mandate (That mandate is outlined in our constitution, our constitution must not be a point of reference but a point of action), (8) Government need to educate and listen to the cries of poor South Africans, communication needs not only be top-down but bottom-up through Imbizos and all other methods of communication at our disposal. Finally, as citizens of South Africa we can?t find solace through destruction, we need better ways to manage our frustrations, again the frustration we see may be the result of lack in point (1), (2), (3), (4) , (5), (6), (7) and (8). - Luzuko |
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Xenophobic
21/05/2008 10:52
Our government not listening, first they have to stop the corruption inside the Department of Home Affairs and Housing and know most of the foreigner's they owning RDP Houses - Maria |
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xenophobia
21/05/2008 10:52
this is not going to end soon and it is bringing a danger of south africans been shunned in other african countries just imagine the reception bafana bafana are goin to get when they get to nigeria - lala |
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Xenophobic
21/05/2008 11:06
It is a sad situation, yes we are influxed by foreigners e.g anglolans, nigers, moza's, and the rest. The nigerians are the drug dealers, and credit card fraudsters , they boast and do all worse crimes in our country and nothing is done. As for the angolans they are buying property here like hot cakes, we that are working all our lives are not able to even buy a RDP appartment. Were is the control of foriegn currency or is the state get a share. Honestly our govt is made of Dummies. They must GO. - Comrade JJ |
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Worried about figures
21/05/2008 11:10
I am just concerned about:
1. The ignorance about the positive impact of most foreigners: many multinational companies have been brought to South Africa by foreigners and employ in many cases South African citizens.
2. the figures used (2.5 to 4.1 million illegal immigrants). This frankly looks exaggerated. An illegal immigrant cannot work, study or go for treatment to hospitals. The majority of foreigners do work, study. The situation is already bad, why adding it to it false figures? - Alain |
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Mandela - why no comments
21/05/2008 11:19
If Mandela- who is married to mozambiquan graca said something would this madness end - gerry |
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How in heavens name...
21/05/2008 11:22
It really frustrates me when we have so-called intellectuals who are so out of touch,their comments are actually hilarious.Talk about contradictory statements.Now, if we had all the answers to this problem,I'm sure we would have solved a global problem.Also,this violence is being orchestrated by the usual suspects,its just sad that the poor,have constantly been used for other people's agendas. The truth will unfold and once again it will prove how wrongs these "intellectuals" were! - Cape Town Kid |
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xenophobia
21/05/2008 11:25
I agree by & large with the comments. My only reserve is the use of the military. As an ex Citizen Force & Commando member, the military is trained to kill, not keep the peace. That cannot be politically acceptable (Army in the townships a la 1970's & 80's); I think that the answer lies in two areas; deliver the goods as promised, & find the culprits. This is not xwnophobia, but sheer criminal intent. - peter horne |
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Xenophobia
21/05/2008 11:34
The violence that is happening in our country towards our foreign nationals is bad.These people are here for a reason.They are not here on their own will.They fled their countries because of their countries' political situation and they seek refuge to their fellow South Africans.This also happened to us in our apartheid years.It's, however,true that some of these foreign nationals are involved in some criminal activities,but not all of them.Let's give them a chance and let them stay. - Mandla Manqele |
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Xenophobia
21/05/2008 11:41
More than ten years into a democracy that people died for and this is where we find ourselves? This is not who we are and this is not what we stand for - This barbaric behaviour needs to be stopped immediately! The police needs to be allowed to take drastic measures in curbing the violence against people who have fled their countries for a better life - shame on all of you who form part of this violence - all it takes is for decent folk in the community to stand up and say ENOUGH! - Liz |
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thabos fault
21/05/2008 11:58
The blood of these people are in Thabos hands,they have ONCE AGAIN failed the country.Fair enough the actual violence was/is being perpetrated by animals with no moral conscience, but it all boils down to the govt.Never in my life have I seen a supposedly advanced(technology wise) govt with so little or no foresight. What did those idiots think was going to happen by allowing millions of illegal?s into the country?A couple 100 can slip through the system but millions??But alas, another committee, another struggle song, another day of denial regarding Zimbabwe, another day of false promises and empty slogans. - nWo |
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Zuma sayings
21/05/2008 12:12
Zuma says a lot of things without thinking,which caused violence and controversy e.g.
1) Let us revisit the death penalty 2) In my tribal area I would slap a "moffie" 3) Mini skirts are unsightly(sarong).He is alo friends with fraudster Schabir Shaik ; drunk driver Tony Yengeni ;and a certain general who got a 4X4 fraudently etc. LACK OF JUDGEMENT OR WHAT ? Who will lead us to the promised land ? - GBOB |
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