News24

Fired miners promise to fight to the death

2012-10-06 22:34

Johannesburg - A leader for striking miners at Anglo American Platinum mines on Saturday said they would make it difficult for the company to hire new miners after the company fired 12 000 striking workers this week.

Evans Ramokga threatened that Amplats would only hire new employees "over our dead bodies".

"Nobody will come and operate these mines. If there any people we feel must go, it is them, not us," he said, referring to the bosses of Amplats, a subsidiary of the London-listed Anglo Platinum.

The world's top producer of platinum said it fired the workers for failing to attend disciplinary hearings in the aftermath of an unlawful strike that brought its Rustenburg operations to a halt.

And Mpumi Sithole, a spokesperson for Amplats, said on Saturday that the decision to fire the workers is final.

Low work attendance levels

More 20 000 mineworkers at Amplats have been staging a wildcat strike since September 12, demanding R12 500 in take-home pay. Amplats managers said from the start that the strike is unlawful.

On Friday, hours after renewed confrontations between armed police and striking miners on a hill near Amplats' Rustenburg mines, the company moved to dismiss the workers via SMS or e-mail messages.

"Despite the company's repeated calls for employees to return to work, we have continued to experience attendance levels of less than 20%," Amplats said in a statement on Friday.

"Currently four of the company's mining operations in the Rustenburg area have insufficient staff to operate and only essential services are being carried out at those mines."

The labour unrest plaguing South Africa's mining sector started in August when workers at Lonmin's Marikana platinum mine staged a wildcat strike that led to violence which left about 46 dead, including a police shooting that killed 34 miners.

That and other violence during the Marikana mine strikes is now the subject of an official inquiry even as unrest spreads, leading to renewed fears of violence.

No end in sight

A union representative in Marikana inquiry was shot and killed on Friday night at his house, the National Union of Mineworkers said on Saturday.

The victim could have been targeted because he was "a key witness" in the inquiry, according to Num spokesperson Lesiba Seshoka.

He said the victim assisted the commission this week when it visited the hill where the miners were killed.

There seems to be no end in sight to the labour unrest, which has spread to coal and iron ore mines as well as to the road freight sector.

Some 20 000 truckers demanding a 22% pay raise are currently staging a strike that threatens the supply of gas and groceries. Negotiations between striking truckers and the Road Freight Association broke down on Thursday.

Zuma criticised

The labour unrest has damaged South Africa's reputation as an investment destination.

South Africa produces 75% of the world's platinum and is the No. 4 chrome producer and the fifth-biggest gold producer.

President Jacob Zuma, the target of criticism by mineworkers who see him as aloof to their concerns, said on Thursday that the violence witnessed in the mining sector was proof that "a climate of constructive social dialogue" needs to be created in the country.

"We should not seek to portray ourselves as a nation that is perpetually fighting," Zuma told the Chamber of Commerce and Industry.

Comments
  • hudayfah.newman - 2012-10-06 22:43

    Mootie anyone?

      Bluecrest - 2012-10-06 23:15

      @Isfreak - agreed! Free delivery of popcorn to the presidency for the show? I'll sponsor; sure nobody will pitch to watch the show.

      Bluecrest - 2012-10-06 23:15

      @Isfreak - agreed! Free delivery of popcorn to the presidency for the show? I'll sponsor; sure nobody will pitch to watch the show.

      Jacob Zooma - 2012-10-06 23:17

      Yes please, moretea for me.

      Jacob Zooma - 2012-10-06 23:17

      Yes please, moretea for me.

      christelle.james.7 - 2012-10-07 02:55

      Over their dead bodies they say........then let it be!

      christelle.james.7 - 2012-10-07 02:55

      Over their dead bodies they say........then let it be!

      emmi.grated.7 - 2012-10-07 03:44

      Australia tuning in for the lulz... Popcorn in the Microwave. Investec also reporting a ton of incoming international transfers from SA to Australia as of Friday. I guess 9 bucks to the dollar is as far as most are willing to throw away. Thanks for the boost in our economy and we can't wait till you all get here ;D

      emmi.grated.7 - 2012-10-07 03:44

      Australia tuning in for the lulz... Popcorn in the Microwave. Investec also reporting a ton of incoming international transfers from SA to Australia as of Friday. I guess 9 bucks to the dollar is as far as most are willing to throw away. Thanks for the boost in our economy and we can't wait till you all get here ;D

      mc.segal.5 - 2012-10-07 07:02

      Still think that they should take their protest to Nkandla...Union should provide busses and KFC and they should squat there until this government comes up with a plan. They are supposed to be in charge...so fix it

      mc.segal.5 - 2012-10-07 07:02

      Still think that they should take their protest to Nkandla...Union should provide busses and KFC and they should squat there until this government comes up with a plan. They are supposed to be in charge...so fix it

      GrootWitHaai - 2012-10-07 09:31

      The SAPS firing squad can arrange a meeting with their Maker I am sure.

      GrootWitHaai - 2012-10-07 09:31

      The SAPS firing squad can arrange a meeting with their Maker I am sure.

      Vince.York - 2012-10-07 09:38

      Best MUTI in SA for the anc & unions will be at the 'Versailles' of Nkandla:- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sM-169xrYpQ

      Vince.York - 2012-10-07 09:38

      Best MUTI in SA for the anc & unions will be at the 'Versailles' of Nkandla:- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sM-169xrYpQ

      heathway.master - 2012-10-07 11:07

      Anglo and every other mine in the country, must take a very firm stand, and not re-hire even one of the miners they have fired. This striking scum need to be taught a very big lesson. Let them make any threats they want. We have police and the army for law enforcement. If all 12000 have to be arrested and imprisoned, this is exactly what must happen. They have damaged our economy really big time with their show of anarchy. If any company softens due to union pressure, it will be a very sad day for the future of industry in this country. The strikers disobeyed all the labour laws, and the mines had every legal right to fire them all.

      heathway.master - 2012-10-07 11:07

      Anglo and every other mine in the country, must take a very firm stand, and not re-hire even one of the miners they have fired. This striking scum need to be taught a very big lesson. Let them make any threats they want. We have police and the army for law enforcement. If all 12000 have to be arrested and imprisoned, this is exactly what must happen. They have damaged our economy really big time with their show of anarchy. If any company softens due to union pressure, it will be a very sad day for the future of industry in this country. The strikers disobeyed all the labour laws, and the mines had every legal right to fire them all.

      kim.buren - 2012-10-07 11:18

      Where is that rabbit now?

      kim.buren - 2012-10-07 11:18

      Where is that rabbit now?

      Billy - 2012-10-07 14:31

      ja mootie dit doonie.

      Billy - 2012-10-07 14:31

      ja mootie dit doonie.

      mattewis.kat - 2012-10-08 07:12

      The government as well as Lonmin have set the president for this behavior! You only have to go to the job advertising websites/agencies to see how this will lead the final destruction of the economy, with many literate and responsible positions paying no more than a mere half of the extorted Lonmin salaries! Get out the popcorn indeed!

      mattewis.kat - 2012-10-08 07:12

      The government as well as Lonmin have set the president for this behavior! You only have to go to the job advertising websites/agencies to see how this will lead the final destruction of the economy, with many literate and responsible positions paying no more than a mere half of the extorted Lonmin salaries! Get out the popcorn indeed!

  • Rabbler.Rouser - 2012-10-06 22:53

    Time for Zuma to send in the troops. The damage these mine labour clowns will do to the South African economy is huge. Government has a vested interest in ensuring that the country remains investor friendly. Scaring investors away will result in massive job losses, a slump in tax revneue and negative growth. That is something the government definitely cannot afford.

      jeremy.forbes.1293 - 2012-10-06 23:30

      Absolutely, it is time for the state to show that it is in control, there is no alternative. Arrest the leaders of these groups and keep them imprisoned until matters cool down. Do not allow any violence whatsoever, it would be better to come down very hard on this dismissed workers than to leave matters as they are, no less than the future of this country is at stake.

      jeremy.forbes.1293 - 2012-10-06 23:30

      Absolutely, it is time for the state to show that it is in control, there is no alternative. Arrest the leaders of these groups and keep them imprisoned until matters cool down. Do not allow any violence whatsoever, it would be better to come down very hard on this dismissed workers than to leave matters as they are, no less than the future of this country is at stake.

      mc.segal.5 - 2012-10-07 06:30

      Trouble is the state is way out of the picture...Have no given a continental stuff because there is to much of a buffer between them and the workers. They should be bussing them down to Nkandla where the real problem lies...

      mc.segal.5 - 2012-10-07 06:30

      Trouble is the state is way out of the picture...Have no given a continental stuff because there is to much of a buffer between them and the workers. They should be bussing them down to Nkandla where the real problem lies...

      oscar.pretorius.52 - 2012-10-07 08:16

      The moment Lonmin gave into the demands of violent and unruly protestors they sent out a clear message to everyone that makes demands. Anglo needs to stick to their guns and not give into these barbarians since it has become clear that the government will do nothing about it.

      oscar.pretorius.52 - 2012-10-07 08:16

      The moment Lonmin gave into the demands of violent and unruly protestors they sent out a clear message to everyone that makes demands. Anglo needs to stick to their guns and not give into these barbarians since it has become clear that the government will do nothing about it.

      mark.haupt.31 - 2012-10-07 09:10

      Troops? Last thing to be done, once police can no longer enforce law & order. When you send in troops against your own citizenry you cross the line from democracy into dictatorship, not what we need to encourage.

      mark.haupt.31 - 2012-10-07 09:10

      Troops? Last thing to be done, once police can no longer enforce law & order. When you send in troops against your own citizenry you cross the line from democracy into dictatorship, not what we need to encourage.

      heathway.master - 2012-10-07 10:30

      When I first started working, the first thing my parents told me was not to wipe my behind with my job. They told me it was one of the most precious things a person could have. These strikers have wiped their behinds with their jobs, and the mine/transport firms should stand firm on firing and never ever hiring them again. Let them learn than everyone is responsible for their own actions, and they must sleep in the bed they have made for themselves. As for threatening violence, they are continuously violent so what is at all different. Let mine security shoot them between the eyes as they carry out their job of protecting property/transport vehicles. The whole of South Africa is now sick to death of the behaviour of these completely ungrateful and undeserving scum.

      heathway.master - 2012-10-07 10:30

      When I first started working, the first thing my parents told me was not to wipe my behind with my job. They told me it was one of the most precious things a person could have. These strikers have wiped their behinds with their jobs, and the mine/transport firms should stand firm on firing and never ever hiring them again. Let them learn than everyone is responsible for their own actions, and they must sleep in the bed they have made for themselves. As for threatening violence, they are continuously violent so what is at all different. Let mine security shoot them between the eyes as they carry out their job of protecting property/transport vehicles. The whole of South Africa is now sick to death of the behaviour of these completely ungrateful and undeserving scum.

      Rabbler.Rouser - 2012-10-07 12:08

      @heathwaymaster. Well said. Perhaps they will have impressive references on their CV's when these individuals look for their next job. Highly experienced in instigating wildcat strikes. Threatening violence if they don't get their way. Underground sit-in and protesting to 'force' management to comply. Reckless disregard for mine safety by demnonstrating underground. Making threats of violence with the intention of halting mine production until their demands are met. Julius Malema and the FYL will be impressed. Maybe he can give them a job in one of his nationalised conquests.

      Rabbler.Rouser - 2012-10-07 12:08

      @heathwaymaster. Well said. Perhaps they will have impressive references on their CV's when these individuals look for their next job. Highly experienced in instigating wildcat strikes. Threatening violence if they don't get their way. Underground sit-in and protesting to 'force' management to comply. Reckless disregard for mine safety by demnonstrating underground. Making threats of violence with the intention of halting mine production until their demands are met. Julius Malema and the FYL will be impressed. Maybe he can give them a job in one of his nationalised conquests.

      mart.botha - 2012-10-08 08:13

      Agreed, are the South African Government capable of keeping control of the situation and saying no to these people who have in fact reclassified themselves as criminals by their own actions....if so there is hope of regaining investor confidence and any sort of future. Failure by government to 'prescribe and police law and order' will be a death knell for this country. Keep in mind that so called 'investment' by China is not an investment per se but a 'purchase of rights, title and interest' in and to this country's assets. As much as it callous to say so, these miners have to realise that they are not 'rock scientists' and therefore are fairly easily replaced. If the employers are forced to fortify their sites and protect their new workers, a civil war will certainly ensue.

      mart.botha - 2012-10-08 08:13

      Agreed, are the South African Government capable of keeping control of the situation and saying no to these people who have in fact reclassified themselves as criminals by their own actions....if so there is hope of regaining investor confidence and any sort of future. Failure by government to 'prescribe and police law and order' will be a death knell for this country. Keep in mind that so called 'investment' by China is not an investment per se but a 'purchase of rights, title and interest' in and to this country's assets. As much as it callous to say so, these miners have to realise that they are not 'rock scientists' and therefore are fairly easily replaced. If the employers are forced to fortify their sites and protect their new workers, a civil war will certainly ensue.

      duncan.gill1 - 2012-10-08 22:01

      @markH you must surely realize that we are already there the dictator only wheres many faces and threatens to rule via violence,what difference is there between the dictatorship of the one and the dictatorship of many.Mob rule is dictatorship,maybe if you lived in South Africa you would see it more clearly!

  • James Cussen - 2012-10-06 22:56

    Any of them threaten anyone with violence - take them out, one by one. Sick of this savage attitude.

      charmaine.rowlands - 2012-10-07 01:31

      @kleo.whatever5.... you aren't even South African. Please keep your asinine comments to yourself. What you're advocating is yet MORE violence!!! Way to go

      charmaine.rowlands - 2012-10-07 01:31

      @kleo.whatever5.... you aren't even South African. Please keep your asinine comments to yourself. What you're advocating is yet MORE violence!!! Way to go

      lionel.defrontignac - 2012-10-07 02:36

      @Charmaine, with a name like that you can't be SAfrican

      lionel.defrontignac - 2012-10-07 02:36

      @Charmaine, with a name like that you can't be SAfrican

      matthew.patrick.925 - 2012-10-07 04:44

      @James, I hope you'll eventually notice the obvious irony in your statement. @kleo, methinks you misinterpretated James' comment as being directed at all underprivileged, poor and uneducated black people, since you introduced the issue of 'race' into this discussion by making an assumption as to his upbringing. That, in itself, is a tad racist. He was merely describing the acts of the destructive elements amongst the miners as savage. The witness was assisting in attaining justice but was killed because of his efforts. That seems pretty savage to me! @lionel, LOL!

      matthew.patrick.925 - 2012-10-07 04:44

      @James, I hope you'll eventually notice the obvious irony in your statement. @kleo, methinks you misinterpretated James' comment as being directed at all underprivileged, poor and uneducated black people, since you introduced the issue of 'race' into this discussion by making an assumption as to his upbringing. That, in itself, is a tad racist. He was merely describing the acts of the destructive elements amongst the miners as savage. The witness was assisting in attaining justice but was killed because of his efforts. That seems pretty savage to me! @lionel, LOL!

      wwrer.ww - 2012-10-07 06:51

      kleo.dabelsteinvuckovic.5 How many died in Yugoslavia within 2 years? 140,000. How many died during apartheid in South Africa over 46 years? 21,000. So stop your incitement, you're pathetic. And in WW2 you murdered 500,000. Your country was so divided, it had to be split into pieces. Croatia, Serbia, Republic of Macedonia, Montenegro, Slovenia, Bosnia and Herzegovina. How did that feel? Do you want to divide us? People like you should be banned from this website. Permanently.

      wwrer.ww - 2012-10-07 06:51

      kleo.dabelsteinvuckovic.5 How many died in Yugoslavia within 2 years? 140,000. How many died during apartheid in South Africa over 46 years? 21,000. So stop your incitement, you're pathetic. And in WW2 you murdered 500,000. Your country was so divided, it had to be split into pieces. Croatia, Serbia, Republic of Macedonia, Montenegro, Slovenia, Bosnia and Herzegovina. How did that feel? Do you want to divide us? People like you should be banned from this website. Permanently.

      simon.pearce.790 - 2012-10-07 07:29

      kleo..... why don't you f**k off and mind your own business!

      simon.pearce.790 - 2012-10-07 07:29

      kleo..... why don't you f**k off and mind your own business!

      keithpatkell - 2012-10-07 07:45

      @ kleo...I agree with WWRER.WW...and just a quick question...? Who the hell hit YOU with the UGLY STICK girl...? Eish....

      keithpatkell - 2012-10-07 07:45

      @ kleo...I agree with WWRER.WW...and just a quick question...? Who the hell hit YOU with the UGLY STICK girl...? Eish....

      tw2066 - 2012-10-07 08:10

      Kleo....not the brightest are you, the miners are wanting to fight to the death too..... So how is that different to James, who not striking, but being economically prejudiced by the strikers?

      tw2066 - 2012-10-07 08:10

      Kleo....not the brightest are you, the miners are wanting to fight to the death too..... So how is that different to James, who not striking, but being economically prejudiced by the strikers?

      george.outremer - 2012-10-07 08:17

      Reading the responses to people's posts, it always amazes me that people are very quick to don their judgement cap, jump on their high horse and get emotional because of their interpretation of the use by others of a single (or few) word/s. We live in a world where technology is at hand - if only people would take the time to look up the definition of a word before reacting. In this case the word: 'savage' can also mean someone who is cruel and violent. That the strikers have embarked on an illegal strike (and do I hear the echo of the words: 'We demand' which is so prevalent in SA?), and are now inciting violence because their 'demands' have not been met - makes the use of the word savage appropriate. Violence begets violence: you live by the sword, you will die by it (or be 'taken out' as James has put it). Now contrast all of this against Amplats' slogan: Respect, Trust, Care. If the image attached to this article is anything to go by, then clearly: the values of the company are not shared by the workers.

      george.outremer - 2012-10-07 08:17

      Reading the responses to people's posts, it always amazes me that people are very quick to don their judgement cap, jump on their high horse and get emotional because of their interpretation of the use by others of a single (or few) word/s. We live in a world where technology is at hand - if only people would take the time to look up the definition of a word before reacting. In this case the word: 'savage' can also mean someone who is cruel and violent. That the strikers have embarked on an illegal strike (and do I hear the echo of the words: 'We demand' which is so prevalent in SA?), and are now inciting violence because their 'demands' have not been met - makes the use of the word savage appropriate. Violence begets violence: you live by the sword, you will die by it (or be 'taken out' as James has put it). Now contrast all of this against Amplats' slogan: Respect, Trust, Care. If the image attached to this article is anything to go by, then clearly: the values of the company are not shared by the workers.

      jacqui.daanevanrensburg - 2012-10-07 12:30

      Kleo, who exactly are 'the ones like you'? I agreed with you about calling for people to be killed. That is immature and solve no purpose. But you lost me when you wanted to do exactly the same to people after 94. You think your white face and foreign name would have saved you?. Grow up. Silly woman.

      jacqui.daanevanrensburg - 2012-10-07 12:30

      Kleo, who exactly are 'the ones like you'? I agreed with you about calling for people to be killed. That is immature and solve no purpose. But you lost me when you wanted to do exactly the same to people after 94. You think your white face and foreign name would have saved you?. Grow up. Silly woman.

      attie.kruger - 2012-10-07 19:26

      All that I am going to say is,the truth hurts!!!now the proudly South Africans(and yes,I am one aswell) starts with swearing,putting people down that stand outside the line and looking in!no people.its not them that must grow up,its you!open up your eyes and look what is going on in your owan backyards!

      attie.kruger - 2012-10-07 19:26

      All that I am going to say is,the truth hurts!!!now the proudly South Africans(and yes,I am one aswell) starts with swearing,putting people down that stand outside the line and looking in!no people.its not them that must grow up,its you!open up your eyes and look what is going on in your owan backyards!

  • max.reynecke - 2012-10-06 22:56

    These strikers are making it easy for the mine management to do what they actually wanted to do for a long time and that is to close or to get rid of the mines without any responsibility towards the workers...mark my words.

      simon.pearce.790 - 2012-10-07 07:31

      kleo is trolling. Do Not Feed the Trolls.

      simon.pearce.790 - 2012-10-07 07:31

      kleo is trolling. Do Not Feed the Trolls.

      conrad.marshall - 2012-10-08 09:58

      @Max - i have it from people working in the mining industry - you are 100% correct. Anglo has been waiting for something like this to retrench an unproductive workforce and close down shafts. they are getting very attractive offers from the South American countries to open new mines there....

      conrad.marshall - 2012-10-08 09:58

      @Max - i have it from people working in the mining industry - you are 100% correct. Anglo has been waiting for something like this to retrench an unproductive workforce and close down shafts. they are getting very attractive offers from the South American countries to open new mines there....

  • mncedisi.frans - 2012-10-06 23:00

    Education is very important

      riaan.mostert.58 - 2012-10-06 23:13

      A brain transplant is the only solution.

      riaan.mostert.58 - 2012-10-06 23:13

      A brain transplant is the only solution.

      simon.pearce.790 - 2012-10-07 07:42

      "yes, the academical education of africans is the key - the humanitarian education of settlers another. " kleo. Firstly "acedemical" is not the correct spelling nor part of speech in the context of your post. "academic" would be correct. Furthermore, to whom are you referring as "settlers"? Humanitarian behavior is fine - but before you carry on preaching to a country who's social structure you know nothing about, please go and have a look at one of the many websites which reveal and illustrate the barbarian behavior of the indigenous population. Now, as I said earlier, f**k off and mind your own business.

      simon.pearce.790 - 2012-10-07 07:42

      "yes, the academical education of africans is the key - the humanitarian education of settlers another. " kleo. Firstly "acedemical" is not the correct spelling nor part of speech in the context of your post. "academic" would be correct. Furthermore, to whom are you referring as "settlers"? Humanitarian behavior is fine - but before you carry on preaching to a country who's social structure you know nothing about, please go and have a look at one of the many websites which reveal and illustrate the barbarian behavior of the indigenous population. Now, as I said earlier, f**k off and mind your own business.

      tw2066 - 2012-10-07 08:13

      Kleo you troll, or droll.

      tw2066 - 2012-10-07 08:13

      Kleo you troll, or droll.

      helio.paulo.7 - 2012-10-07 08:25

      So very true....if people were better educated then i think the picture would have been very different.

      helio.paulo.7 - 2012-10-07 08:25

      So very true....if people were better educated then i think the picture would have been very different.

  • mncedisi.frans - 2012-10-06 23:00

    Education is very important

      gieljam.gomtor - 2012-10-07 07:12

      Not really even a donkey knows when to pull or stop

      gieljam.gomtor - 2012-10-07 07:12

      Not really even a donkey knows when to pull or stop

  • djkutrage - 2012-10-06 23:24

    "It is better to die standing than to live on your knees asijiki

      blip.noodlum - 2012-10-06 23:32

      You can't drill standing up.

      blip.noodlum - 2012-10-06 23:32

      You can't drill standing up.

      emile.marais - 2012-10-07 14:22

      To hell with both the proletariat and the bourgeois. The only thing either group want is power. The blood lust is sickening from all of you.

      emile.marais - 2012-10-07 14:22

      To hell with both the proletariat and the bourgeois. The only thing either group want is power. The blood lust is sickening from all of you.

  • rowan.maulson - 2012-10-06 23:31

    No Zuma you knobjockey, we don't need a climate of constructive social dialogue ffs, we need a president and a government that tells these useless cretins that enough is enough, and puts them in their damn place.

      andrew.miles.98622733 - 2012-10-07 08:34

      Kleo, so tell us O mighty what these people want. Tell us how bad it is going. Tell me why are you in SA, for the democracy I guess so why come spew socialistic nonsense (clearly picked up from your tone) here, hypocrite springs to mind. SA was never a socialistic state and this model will never be successful here (we are to a certain extent socialistic, Eskom). The Chinese and some other eastern countries get away with this because they rule with an iron fist. You do not mock around in those countries. If that sort of system is applied here you will be the first to cry. The Chinese’s working class live in the same, if not worse, conditions than these miners. The Chinese earn less than half of what most of these guys earn, and don’t fool yourself kleo these miners earn with all benefits and if they pitch for work well over R10000. This 16% increase crap is only taking the mickey when CPI is well below that. Should mine be nationalized, super taxes be imposed the money will not flow to the workers, it will go into the national pool and then towards keeping SAA, Eskom, Telkom and rest afloat and the pockets of top elite in place. In every model you have elite. In a democracy you can work and reach that due to your own hard work. In Socialism you’ll only reach that when politically connected. Your comments do show a clear lack of knowledge on economics, even the trade unions are laughing at these ridiculous demands.

      andrew.miles.98622733 - 2012-10-07 08:34

      Kleo, so tell us O mighty what these people want. Tell us how bad it is going. Tell me why are you in SA, for the democracy I guess so why come spew socialistic nonsense (clearly picked up from your tone) here, hypocrite springs to mind. SA was never a socialistic state and this model will never be successful here (we are to a certain extent socialistic, Eskom). The Chinese and some other eastern countries get away with this because they rule with an iron fist. You do not mock around in those countries. If that sort of system is applied here you will be the first to cry. The Chinese’s working class live in the same, if not worse, conditions than these miners. The Chinese earn less than half of what most of these guys earn, and don’t fool yourself kleo these miners earn with all benefits and if they pitch for work well over R10000. This 16% increase crap is only taking the mickey when CPI is well below that. Should mine be nationalized, super taxes be imposed the money will not flow to the workers, it will go into the national pool and then towards keeping SAA, Eskom, Telkom and rest afloat and the pockets of top elite in place. In every model you have elite. In a democracy you can work and reach that due to your own hard work. In Socialism you’ll only reach that when politically connected. Your comments do show a clear lack of knowledge on economics, even the trade unions are laughing at these ridiculous demands.

  • tonyhooper69 - 2012-10-06 23:32

    Hmmmm. No investors, no Rands... Oh yes then no home and no car... Just saying... Not so clever strikers

  • byron.beedle - 2012-10-06 23:36

    Is it possible that malema a is behind all these problems. As he mentioned that he would make the mines ungovernable . It would also be to his advantage to show the government that he is force to be recognized with they should be careful about prosecuting him. His silence is deafening since his trial, his game plan now might be to work behind the scenes and create havoc?? Just asking??

      nico.dejongh.90 - 2012-10-07 00:19

      Ungovernable then take over is their aim, even to the suicidal level of Zim. Hope the road is not too bumpy.

      nico.dejongh.90 - 2012-10-07 00:19

      Ungovernable then take over is their aim, even to the suicidal level of Zim. Hope the road is not too bumpy.

  • popeye.sailor.1884 - 2012-10-06 23:49

    If death is what they want, give it to them !

  • drifter.sa - 2012-10-06 23:50

    Why is it that striking or protesting people are allowed to carry dangerous weapons. It creates false sense of security and bravado. Time the govt outlaws such, traditional or otherwise!

      mc.segal.5 - 2012-10-07 08:30

      Its In The Kulcher

      mc.segal.5 - 2012-10-07 08:30

      Its In The Kulcher

      hanlie.noeth - 2012-10-08 23:24

      drifter.sa agreed. Maybe we should adhere to our traditions as well. Okay soooo I'm called a boer because I'm white and Afrikaans. Its in a "boer's" culture to have a weapon, hunting and so forth. So next time I'm unhappy with the company I work for I'm grabbing a hunting rifle and swinging it around...if only I had a rifle, the mentality of a killer and no concerns with other human beings... Culture Smulture - it's weapons, because it is used to maim and kill. I always think of those who really are suffering because mommy or daddy decided to strike and there's no money ergo no food. It's such a sad state of affairs.

  • Harold Chisimba - 2012-10-06 23:55

    Who is now pathetically stupid loooooozaaa?

  • Sechaba30 - 2012-10-06 23:57

    I support workers 1000%

      Harold Chisimba - 2012-10-07 00:10

      yeep! Now give them job if they wil not also do the same .

      Harold Chisimba - 2012-10-07 00:10

      yeep! Now give them job if they wil not also do the same .

      Erna - 2012-10-07 00:12

      Of course you do. Just like them you don't see the bigger picture and realise how much damage all these strikes and violence is doing to the economy - with results that SA cannot afford.

      Erna - 2012-10-07 00:12

      Of course you do. Just like them you don't see the bigger picture and realise how much damage all these strikes and violence is doing to the economy - with results that SA cannot afford.

      whatda.fuqbro - 2012-10-07 01:03

      Sechaba, so what you're saying is that you support criminals and you'd love nothing more than to ruin the country? Well, I'll bet you also vote ANC!

      whatda.fuqbro - 2012-10-07 01:03

      Sechaba, so what you're saying is that you support criminals and you'd love nothing more than to ruin the country? Well, I'll bet you also vote ANC!

      merven.halo - 2012-10-08 09:46

      @whatda.fuqbro - The ANC bred this entitlement mentality, they will never change.

      merven.halo - 2012-10-08 09:46

      @whatda.fuqbro - The ANC bred this entitlement mentality, they will never change.

      indianajohn - 2012-10-08 23:17

      I also support workers. These people are not workers.

  • colin.taylor.9883 - 2012-10-07 00:16

    Don't make a promise you can't keep.... There are more than enough of us who are more than willing to help you make that promise come true....

  • OneChristovanZyl - 2012-10-07 00:17

    STOP!!!!! I have been watching these comments on News24 for the last few weeks and it is time to say: ENOUGH is ENOUGH! These comments are NOT helping and are ONLY making things WORSE. These conversations are fueling past grievances and producing current new ones. This situation has the potential to affect EACH and EVERY ONE of US: It is the stability of our country. It is the future of our children. It is the safety of each one of us. It is the cost of living. It is ALREADY affecting each and every one of our lives TODAY, and will already for the foreseeable future. (The FUEL price alone affects each one of us TODAY, which affects our FOOD prices. The list goes on!) It can only get worse if we continue on this “conversational” trend… ENOUGH! STOP: Blaming people is not helping ANYONE. Success helps EVERYONE! STOP: Making accusations is fueling a dangerously hot fire! STOP: Make helpful comments – CONTRIBUTE something which is HELPFUL. STOP: Fix this! STOP: Add VALUE! If we as a SOUTH AFRICAN NATION do not STOP right now, we will not be able to fix this – we will have to start over from scratch. This will affect you, your family and your children for generations to come! STOP! Please. STOP! STOP!!! “Start Teaching Our People”

      shirlee.grobler - 2012-10-07 07:31

      You are the lone voice of reason, sadly its all to late. The businesses that would have been created by the people who have fled SA, developing taxes and work opportunities have not been replaced by the masses, one does not require an education to start a business.Just the will to work. See the problem.The situation now is that instead of 3 people in a family of 15 bringing in a salary, there is one, in this case the miner. He is transferring his self inflicted pressure onto his employer, expecting the solution to come the 1 thing his large family has left, his job. Sadly in the end an agreement will be settled, an unafordable figure will be agreed upon followed shortly by mass retrenchments. The ones left with work will simply have to support the ones without work, solving nothing.The answer is to develop a business creation mentality, requiring vision and creativity. Its not possible to wave the magic wand of legislate and fast track thousands of years of economic evolution.

      shirlee.grobler - 2012-10-07 07:31

      You are the lone voice of reason, sadly its all to late. The businesses that would have been created by the people who have fled SA, developing taxes and work opportunities have not been replaced by the masses, one does not require an education to start a business.Just the will to work. See the problem.The situation now is that instead of 3 people in a family of 15 bringing in a salary, there is one, in this case the miner. He is transferring his self inflicted pressure onto his employer, expecting the solution to come the 1 thing his large family has left, his job. Sadly in the end an agreement will be settled, an unafordable figure will be agreed upon followed shortly by mass retrenchments. The ones left with work will simply have to support the ones without work, solving nothing.The answer is to develop a business creation mentality, requiring vision and creativity. Its not possible to wave the magic wand of legislate and fast track thousands of years of economic evolution.

  • BraTambo - 2012-10-07 00:30

    Anglo Platinum may still order that all operations at Amplats be curtailed until further notice, or be stopped and wound up and all assets to be extracted, to reimburse investors and shareholders, by reason that the mineral resourses cost from South Africa became non viable in relation Global markets. Resulting zero jobs at mines and incomes from mining, plus a knock-on anulment of related suppliers and manufactures and agriculture industries, as a plausable deduction of: Less takers, result less makers. South Africa's whole economy is less than 0,5% of the Global economy, if we over-price ourselves out of the Global market, we are doomed. People here whom think they can drop Anglo and then stupify the Chinese or Russians to take over mining at overpriced demands, have nil intellect.

      tasmee.hylkema - 2012-10-07 14:39

      Excellent analysis!

      tasmee.hylkema - 2012-10-07 14:39

      Excellent analysis!

  • yolanda.haripersad.1 - 2012-10-07 00:44

    Why didn't the miners, who haven't been paid for months by Zuma's son, didn't strike?? They had every reason to!! Why didn't those with secure jobs at a reputable company use internal avenues or the unions to address pay increases???

      whatda.fuqbro - 2012-10-07 01:12

      Tell me about it! I live close to Aurora Grootvlei and the effect the mine closure has had on the communities around here is devastating. The families I've had as customers are left in complete ruins. People who had worked for the mine for decades and are too old to find other work are suddenly forced to beg on the street corner in a desperate attempt to just keep the family fed. So many lives ruined while Zuma rolls around in luxury.

      whatda.fuqbro - 2012-10-07 01:12

      Tell me about it! I live close to Aurora Grootvlei and the effect the mine closure has had on the communities around here is devastating. The families I've had as customers are left in complete ruins. People who had worked for the mine for decades and are too old to find other work are suddenly forced to beg on the street corner in a desperate attempt to just keep the family fed. So many lives ruined while Zuma rolls around in luxury.

  • maxndaba - 2012-10-07 01:01

    "South Africa produces 75% of the world's platinum and is the No. 4 chrome producer and the fifth-biggest gold producer", but you cannot tell.

      matthew.patrick.925 - 2012-10-07 06:23

      An economy cannot be centred around one sector. You might want to think a bit about your comment.

      matthew.patrick.925 - 2012-10-07 06:23

      An economy cannot be centred around one sector. You might want to think a bit about your comment.

  • charmaine.rowlands - 2012-10-07 01:39

    the most entertaining part of this thread is "kleo.dabelsteinvuckovic.5 " Hasn't got a clue!! Anarchy is hardly the way to settle disputes. Wildcat strikes are illegal in our country. A call to return to work which was ignored is grounds for immediate dismissal! Threatening the lives of innocents is tantamount to a call to "war". Fabulous for the economy of a country that can barely keep its head above water due to corruption of biblical proportions!

      willem.pelser.9 - 2012-10-07 02:47

      @ kleo you do not come across as someone who has respect for the rule of law and clearly no understanding of what is happening at amplatts in march these same workers were on strike they got there increase now they have decided they want more so they decided to strike again and this time it a unlawful strike. Amplatts has followed the rule of law were as these miners did not . People who think its ok to kill there fellow workers or stop there fellow workers from work by means of threats that alone tells me that you not very bright . Kleo the reason our cost of living goes up every day is because of people asking for higher wages all this will do is cost the country jobs at lonmin alone there strike cost 1200 jobs,

      willem.pelser.9 - 2012-10-07 02:47

      @ kleo you do not come across as someone who has respect for the rule of law and clearly no understanding of what is happening at amplatts in march these same workers were on strike they got there increase now they have decided they want more so they decided to strike again and this time it a unlawful strike. Amplatts has followed the rule of law were as these miners did not . People who think its ok to kill there fellow workers or stop there fellow workers from work by means of threats that alone tells me that you not very bright . Kleo the reason our cost of living goes up every day is because of people asking for higher wages all this will do is cost the country jobs at lonmin alone there strike cost 1200 jobs,

      roy.wadhams.1 - 2012-10-07 07:38

      Put this kleo.thingamabob in front of these miners when they go on their destructive strike so that she gets the first bullet,TROLL

      roy.wadhams.1 - 2012-10-07 07:38

      Put this kleo.thingamabob in front of these miners when they go on their destructive strike so that she gets the first bullet,TROLL

  • ivan.goodman.77 - 2012-10-07 01:40

    Let's see who has the last laugh,fire 12000 and hire new workers where and when ? Come on who are they fooling. Mine management think that by firing workers they are going to stop the strikes from spreading to other mines too late,they did not think that the so called uneducated can stand together and not be threatened by the nine owners.

      vickers.vermeulen - 2012-10-07 10:08

      They are already mechanizing. These striking workers will find that machines that cost far less to maintain than their salaries are replacing them. If your job can be handled by a machine for less than what the company is paying you then you are beyond stupid to tempt them to do it.

      vickers.vermeulen - 2012-10-07 10:08

      They are already mechanizing. These striking workers will find that machines that cost far less to maintain than their salaries are replacing them. If your job can be handled by a machine for less than what the company is paying you then you are beyond stupid to tempt them to do it.

  • lionel.defrontignac - 2012-10-07 02:34

    Time to go into liquidation - sell the assets to the Chinese, and let them take over - they will bring their own workers, like they did in Zambia - bye bye NUM and COSATU

      Erna - 2012-10-07 04:56

      The Chinese will not take this behaviour and treat the workers even worse.

      Erna - 2012-10-07 04:56

      The Chinese will not take this behaviour and treat the workers even worse.

      ratsaka.eugene - 2012-10-07 06:25

      Bring their own slaves, that'll be better

      ratsaka.eugene - 2012-10-07 06:25

      Bring their own slaves, that'll be better

      matthew.patrick.925 - 2012-10-07 07:23

      Ratsaka, better for whom, the unemployed SA workers who lose their jobs to Chinese migrants?

      matthew.patrick.925 - 2012-10-07 07:23

      Ratsaka, better for whom, the unemployed SA workers who lose their jobs to Chinese migrants?

  • kennyhubbard - 2012-10-07 02:36

    Simple.....1 striker, 1 bullet. Send in the army/police and give them their wish.

      deon.jansevanrensburg.58 - 2012-10-07 09:03

      Better yet - one African one Aids virus.

      deon.jansevanrensburg.58 - 2012-10-07 09:03

      Better yet - one African one Aids virus.

      omphile.umphimodise - 2012-10-08 12:56

      Deon I feel sorry for that woman you married and better still, feel really sorry for your kids have to call something like you a dad. Yes, I said something. God forbid for one of your African (yes I regard you as African) children get AIDS.

      omphile.umphimodise - 2012-10-08 12:56

      Deon I feel sorry for that woman you married and better still, feel really sorry for your kids have to call something like you a dad. Yes, I said something. God forbid for one of your African (yes I regard you as African) children get AIDS.

  • arthur.grace - 2012-10-07 02:47

    Good for them! I'm also tired of these rich cats... It's not your land!

  • arthur.grace - 2012-10-07 03:10

    The blood, loss of lives, sweat, tears, dry bread, no medical, no hospitals, no sanitation, no privacy, no hot water, no light, 20 years of living like a rat, kids with a sore tummy, a tired but understanding mother, a filthy toilet, a dog you promised your first born, blankets burnt by a knocked over stove, the smell of no tomorrow?

      willem.pelser.9 - 2012-10-07 03:20

      Sounds like the future of this county for all of us black and white so so sad to see it go this way

      willem.pelser.9 - 2012-10-07 03:20

      Sounds like the future of this county for all of us black and white so so sad to see it go this way

      matthew.patrick.925 - 2012-10-07 05:07

      The big question is what are you going to do about it? Are you going to work to change your situation or choose to be stuck with it. It's all in your attitude!

      matthew.patrick.925 - 2012-10-07 05:07

      The big question is what are you going to do about it? Are you going to work to change your situation or choose to be stuck with it. It's all in your attitude!

  • mlulami.dike - 2012-10-07 04:12

    That's a gud spirit gys,you have to fight 2gether as a team a never turn back gys...eyamadoda ayipheli...Ningajiki neeeks!!!

  • ppisciotta - 2012-10-07 04:20

    Die

      omphile.umphimodise - 2012-10-08 12:57

      Feeling jealous that they already earn more than your pathetic arse?

      omphile.umphimodise - 2012-10-08 12:57

      Feeling jealous that they already earn more than your pathetic arse?

  • rebecca.pooe - 2012-10-07 05:18

    The capitalist should have sat down and negotiated a better salary and living conditions with the miners, Anglo owes South Africans that much, if they wont profit from improving the lifes of South Africans working in the mines while they live like kings in England than they can footsek out of this country, Africa has been to kind.

      douglas.reid.921 - 2012-10-07 06:07

      The unions are there on behalf of their worker members to negotiate wages. Clearly the unions have failed, hence the murdering of Num officials. If you demand three times your salary chances are you not going to get it. Anglo can shut these mines and they will still be in business, shareholders will suffer but they will just take their capital and expertise elsewhere. Ultimately south Africa will suffer. The workers are being manipulated at their expense and will suffer as a result. Pity the ignorant.

      douglas.reid.921 - 2012-10-07 06:07

      The unions are there on behalf of their worker members to negotiate wages. Clearly the unions have failed, hence the murdering of Num officials. If you demand three times your salary chances are you not going to get it. Anglo can shut these mines and they will still be in business, shareholders will suffer but they will just take their capital and expertise elsewhere. Ultimately south Africa will suffer. The workers are being manipulated at their expense and will suffer as a result. Pity the ignorant.

      khethu.ndlovu.3 - 2012-10-07 07:07

      Kleynhans, its rubbish you are vomiting here, utter s*#t, clean that running nose of yours before it oozes into your mouth, try living on a R4 000 a month.

      khethu.ndlovu.3 - 2012-10-07 07:07

      Kleynhans, its rubbish you are vomiting here, utter s*#t, clean that running nose of yours before it oozes into your mouth, try living on a R4 000 a month.

      Willie Olivier - 2012-10-07 07:14

      please rebecca,if you obviously have no clue how trade and commerce work! So please, keep your stupidity for yourself. You, and people like you are just making fools of yourself

      Willie Olivier - 2012-10-07 07:14

      please rebecca,if you obviously have no clue how trade and commerce work! So please, keep your stupidity for yourself. You, and people like you are just making fools of yourself

      rebecca.pooe - 2012-10-07 09:08

      2 days after 34 miners were shot a capitalist came and said miners must return to work on monday or else, the conditions the miners live under deserve great improvement, it is clear that africans and Asians are used by the whites as cheap labour,it is time for change

      rebecca.pooe - 2012-10-07 09:08

      2 days after 34 miners were shot a capitalist came and said miners must return to work on monday or else, the conditions the miners live under deserve great improvement, it is clear that africans and Asians are used by the whites as cheap labour,it is time for change

      klasgoran.olsson - 2012-10-07 13:38

      I am happy to read your communents. It shows that you use your brain and reflect.

      klasgoran.olsson - 2012-10-07 13:38

      I am happy to read your communents. It shows that you use your brain and reflect.

      hein.huyser - 2012-10-07 21:08

      rebecca et all; there are thousands of whites in WHITE TOWNSHIPS around Jhb and Pretoria that will gladly take any job for less money these miners are being paid. And most of them have some education. The only reason they can not apply for those jobs is because of racist legislation. Think about that for a while, and ask if these miners are not indoctrinated by individuals with their own agendas, creating unreasonable expectations. Someone must be honest with these miners and tell them that only uneducated people living in double storey R16m houses are people stealing from their own children, and we workers will always have less. No secrets here

      hein.huyser - 2012-10-07 21:08

      rebecca et all; there are thousands of whites in WHITE TOWNSHIPS around Jhb and Pretoria that will gladly take any job for less money these miners are being paid. And most of them have some education. The only reason they can not apply for those jobs is because of racist legislation. Think about that for a while, and ask if these miners are not indoctrinated by individuals with their own agendas, creating unreasonable expectations. Someone must be honest with these miners and tell them that only uneducated people living in double storey R16m houses are people stealing from their own children, and we workers will always have less. No secrets here

      mike.bester1 - 2012-10-08 08:13

      Khethu, at least it was 4000 a month ,now thay have a chance to live on nothing a month ,

      mike.bester1 - 2012-10-08 08:13

      Khethu, at least it was 4000 a month ,now thay have a chance to live on nothing a month ,

  • douglas.reid.921 - 2012-10-07 05:22

    We had to import indian and Chinese labor before, we can do it again. They will work happily for the current wages. We may need the army and yes some might get shot, pangas, spears and knobkirries are no match for assault rifles, they learnt that at Marikana but seem to need to learn it again. Demanding three times your wage and then threatening violence if you don't get your way? This is extortion and if this is what the unions are promoting they she making a big mistake.

  • Gerald Jordaan - 2012-10-07 05:26

    Typical..intimidation is used by stupid who don't want to work preventing those who want to work ! Without intimidation stupid can't function !! That's why stupid and poor go hand in hand !!!!

      khethu.ndlovu.3 - 2012-10-07 06:59

      What are you talking about?

      khethu.ndlovu.3 - 2012-10-07 06:59

      What are you talking about?

      matthew.patrick.925 - 2012-10-07 07:19

      I think he means that a person of relatively lower intelligence is more likely to resort to violence and aggression than use diplomatic and peaceful challenges. It's to do with the lower (primal) brain functions being dominant over high brain functions. SA does have the 4th lowest education / intelligence rating in the world which means that the masses will most often use violence in times of protest.

      matthew.patrick.925 - 2012-10-07 07:19

      I think he means that a person of relatively lower intelligence is more likely to resort to violence and aggression than use diplomatic and peaceful challenges. It's to do with the lower (primal) brain functions being dominant over high brain functions. SA does have the 4th lowest education / intelligence rating in the world which means that the masses will most often use violence in times of protest.

      matthew.patrick.925 - 2012-10-07 07:20

      That was meant to be channels and not challenges.

      matthew.patrick.925 - 2012-10-07 07:20

      That was meant to be channels and not challenges.

      khethu.ndlovu.3 - 2012-10-07 07:40

      @matthew, never mind thanks, you just best described that goofy jordan.

      khethu.ndlovu.3 - 2012-10-07 07:40

      @matthew, never mind thanks, you just best described that goofy jordan.

      deon.jansevanrensburg.58 - 2012-10-07 08:56

      You've just desribed the Bell Curve - guess who is on the left hand side of it?

      deon.jansevanrensburg.58 - 2012-10-07 08:56

      You've just desribed the Bell Curve - guess who is on the left hand side of it?

  • amelda.davies - 2012-10-07 05:40

    Silence! I'll kill you!

      ratsaka.eugene - 2012-10-07 05:43

      What happened to my feet

      ratsaka.eugene - 2012-10-07 05:43

      What happened to my feet

      douglas.reid.921 - 2012-10-07 05:56

      You're already dead, Achmed!!!

      douglas.reid.921 - 2012-10-07 05:56

      You're already dead, Achmed!!!

  • Francois Joubert - 2012-10-07 05:55

    Is it Anarchy i smell? Yes its SA flowing burning up!

  • thunder.clap.587 - 2012-10-07 06:00

    Why don't they jus close the operation.

  • Francois Joubert - 2012-10-07 06:19

    Our whole economy is flirting with Zim

  • punungwe - 2012-10-07 06:21

    I a group of people murder 11 people and not one of them is arrested and charged. I am not talking about stunt charges of charging everyone you can see, from days later, by association. By now the police should have found out critical details like who delivered the fatal blow, how and when and specifically charged those individuals publicly, not the people who were rounded up after police had shot miners. Right now the message being send by the police and government is that murder is an acceptable part of the dispute resolution process, and if you kill someone while taking part in a strike it will all be swept under the carpet.

      dingisoml - 2012-10-07 06:50

      If the current ANC leadership does not take drastic step to address this mess, they must kiss the stability in the ecconomy of this country good bye and I will never vote for them again.

      dingisoml - 2012-10-07 06:50

      If the current ANC leadership does not take drastic step to address this mess, they must kiss the stability in the ecconomy of this country good bye and I will never vote for them again.

      Brian Dorning - 2012-10-07 06:57

      very one sided.

      Brian Dorning - 2012-10-07 06:57

      very one sided.

      ongwenya1 - 2012-10-07 09:45

      Right now the country is running without the head. They are busy with more pressing issues, Mangaung and Inkandla palace.For nw those who want to pierce spears through each others' futures, are free to do so

      ongwenya1 - 2012-10-07 09:45

      Right now the country is running without the head. They are busy with more pressing issues, Mangaung and Inkandla palace.For nw those who want to pierce spears through each others' futures, are free to do so

  • roy.wadhams.1 - 2012-10-07 06:23

    SHOOT the bastards if they interfere in any process that the mine is contemplating. The country is losing millions and I cannot understand why the ANC does not call in the army etc because the less money the mines make the less the ANC and cadres can steal and enrich themselves.

      dingisoml - 2012-10-07 06:39

      How does 1 with brain cells your size even make it through the day buffles me.

      dingisoml - 2012-10-07 06:39

      How does 1 with brain cells your size even make it through the day buffles me.

      dingisoml - 2012-10-07 06:56

      How does 1 with brain cells your size even make it through the day buffles me.

      dingisoml - 2012-10-07 06:56

      How does 1 with brain cells your size even make it through the day buffles me.

      roy.wadhams.1 - 2012-10-07 07:19

      Takes brainless people like YOU who can accept what these BRAINLESS buffoons are doing to the country. Is this acceptable to people like you or do you sit in a grand house,living off the country and posting stupid remarks like this? This country has already been stuffed up since the ANC took over and now we sit with even BIGGER problems. AFRICA is STUFFED!

      roy.wadhams.1 - 2012-10-07 07:19

      Takes brainless people like YOU who can accept what these BRAINLESS buffoons are doing to the country. Is this acceptable to people like you or do you sit in a grand house,living off the country and posting stupid remarks like this? This country has already been stuffed up since the ANC took over and now we sit with even BIGGER problems. AFRICA is STUFFED!

  • Francois Joubert - 2012-10-07 06:34

    Our natural resources is the only reason 4 us being. If tht is halted, a domino affect happens an so apparently 1 strike leads 2 another,.

      mc.segal.5 - 2012-10-07 06:36

      Still think that the miners should take the fight to Nkandla. Then we will see government action.

      mc.segal.5 - 2012-10-07 06:36

      Still think that the miners should take the fight to Nkandla. Then we will see government action.

  • J.Stephen.Whiteley - 2012-10-07 06:42

    They won't hold out, they'll go back, if the mine will have them.

  • anita.grant.526 - 2012-10-07 06:43

    Good for amplats. How can workers prescribe to management and demand ridiculous wages? Some have limited training.

  • mc.segal.5 - 2012-10-07 06:45

    I am not a brain surgeon because I am not the right material for that job. I am in another trade/prfession to which I am suited. I therefore can do my job well. This guy mentioned needs to go. Please ANC give the job to somebody who can do it properly. If it must be a cadre I am sure that you Guys can find at least one competant one.Otherwise get out of the Kitchen.It's on Fire already.

  • wcarnot - 2012-10-07 06:46

    I hate stupid scare tactics being employed by Anglo to the situation. It goes without saying that this is the most ridiculous thing ever uttered by someone who has a brain."Fire 12000 people"

  • beverly.young3 - 2012-10-07 06:46

    I have questions: 1. If, I when I was in business, wanted to fire anyone, it was a HUGE undertaking. Nevermind if they stole, didnt come to work etc. CCMA and a hoard of officials ne. Employing anyone, was not unlike a marriage. You simply couldnt divorce them, without bank-breaking payouts, even if they were guilty. Look, even if a business goes bust, the owners are still responsile for the wages.... OKAY, so now the mines can fire and there are no consequences other than riots? Where are the gazillions of forms,the retrenchments packages, notice pay, holiday pay etc? 2. The closing of mines, the riots, is in my mind incorrectly reported in the media. The less of the minerals, the higher the price? Investors leaving us? never...those are scare tactics. 3. Lastly, trade unions almost broke England all those years ago..........how did they solve that?

      J.Stephen.Whiteley - 2012-10-07 07:24

      As to 3. Successive governments were far more pro-active than the one here, in trade union law reform, dialogue and in the deployment of police, and there were no deaths. Attitudes are very different here, and we have a long way to go, but the one attitude "You are lucky to have a job," is obsolete as from now.

      J.Stephen.Whiteley - 2012-10-07 07:24

      As to 3. Successive governments were far more pro-active than the one here, in trade union law reform, dialogue and in the deployment of police, and there were no deaths. Attitudes are very different here, and we have a long way to go, but the one attitude "You are lucky to have a job," is obsolete as from now.

      Adil Smit - 2012-10-07 07:33

      Interesting comments - especially the CCMA.

      Adil Smit - 2012-10-07 07:33

      Interesting comments - especially the CCMA.

      douglas.reid.921 - 2012-10-07 07:42

      So Steven you believe that having a job is a right? That's exactly the mentality that will sink this country. A friend of mine closed his factory when workers kept striking. He used to employ about 100 people. He's much happier now without the headache of workers and unions. Anglo can simply close that mine and say sorry to shareholders cause they were threatened, shareholders won't threaten, they might just move their capital elsewhere. Fact is if you are a unskilled or semiskilled worker you can't demand and won't get paid the equivalent of a skilled or experienced worker. Why can't they understand that, whose fault is it that they didn't get educated???

      douglas.reid.921 - 2012-10-07 07:42

      So Steven you believe that having a job is a right? That's exactly the mentality that will sink this country. A friend of mine closed his factory when workers kept striking. He used to employ about 100 people. He's much happier now without the headache of workers and unions. Anglo can simply close that mine and say sorry to shareholders cause they were threatened, shareholders won't threaten, they might just move their capital elsewhere. Fact is if you are a unskilled or semiskilled worker you can't demand and won't get paid the equivalent of a skilled or experienced worker. Why can't they understand that, whose fault is it that they didn't get educated???

      bruce.arnett.18 - 2012-10-07 08:22

      Margaret Thatcher broke the unions, we should do the same

      bruce.arnett.18 - 2012-10-07 08:22

      Margaret Thatcher broke the unions, we should do the same

      mc.segal.5 - 2012-10-07 08:34

      I think the unions will break themselves......

      mc.segal.5 - 2012-10-07 08:34

      I think the unions will break themselves......

      izak.burger.3 - 2012-10-07 10:29

      The countries with the most restrictive labour laws have the lowest employment rates. The harder it is to get rid of someone, the less likely people are to hire someone and pay them properly. The same is incidentally true of the rental market, the harder it is to get rid of a bad tenant, the higher the rent in that country. What is supposed to protect the worker/tenant also hurts him/her. The system always react in ways other than you might have intended, and in hindsight it always seems obvious that it should. If you level a tax on each cup of coffee, the cups will get bigger...

      izak.burger.3 - 2012-10-07 10:29

      The countries with the most restrictive labour laws have the lowest employment rates. The harder it is to get rid of someone, the less likely people are to hire someone and pay them properly. The same is incidentally true of the rental market, the harder it is to get rid of a bad tenant, the higher the rent in that country. What is supposed to protect the worker/tenant also hurts him/her. The system always react in ways other than you might have intended, and in hindsight it always seems obvious that it should. If you level a tax on each cup of coffee, the cups will get bigger...

      mc.segal.5 - 2012-10-07 17:56

      Exactly Beverly /Izak This is why I cant expand my business....weighing up the pros and cons. I would rather give quality service to fewer customers and keep them than have some unreliable idiot lose all of it.CCMA arguments and the like waste a lot of earning time. Rather keep my finger on the pulse....

      mc.segal.5 - 2012-10-07 17:56

      Exactly Beverly /Izak This is why I cant expand my business....weighing up the pros and cons. I would rather give quality service to fewer customers and keep them than have some unreliable idiot lose all of it.CCMA arguments and the like waste a lot of earning time. Rather keep my finger on the pulse....

  • Andre - 2012-10-07 06:46

    I hope the world can see what happens when their stooges try to run a once working country. This is called anarchy!

  • douglas.reid.921 - 2012-10-07 06:52

    We have a very expensive and unproductive labour force here compared to china for example. If we plan to make it more expensive then we will work our way out of global markets for our products. We have already seen this in the garment industry. Virtually all our clothes shoes etc are imported. Why? Cause we are not competitive. When mines become marginal or unprofitable they close. The unions are like a cancer killing the host that feeds them.

      Adil Smit - 2012-10-07 07:32

      China has a cheap labour force - that's true. Workers there do not have any rights. Have you been to China?

      Adil Smit - 2012-10-07 07:32

      China has a cheap labour force - that's true. Workers there do not have any rights. Have you been to China?

      deon.jansevanrensburg.58 - 2012-10-07 08:51

      And yet China has more USD millionaires per capita than anywhere else. And the idea that they have no rights is a fallacy and popular myth. They just don't have the right to do as they please when they please - order is maintained. And yes, I have been to China

      deon.jansevanrensburg.58 - 2012-10-07 08:51

      And yet China has more USD millionaires per capita than anywhere else. And the idea that they have no rights is a fallacy and popular myth. They just don't have the right to do as they please when they please - order is maintained. And yes, I have been to China

      whatda.fuqbro - 2012-10-07 09:30

      I agree on clamping down and maintaining law and order no matter what, and controlling how many offspring you have would work wonders for this country or any other African country to curb the reproduce-like-rabbits mentality that only makes poverty even worse. The main problem is that many people still get very low pay - too low. Luckily that's changing.

      whatda.fuqbro - 2012-10-07 09:30

      I agree on clamping down and maintaining law and order no matter what, and controlling how many offspring you have would work wonders for this country or any other African country to curb the reproduce-like-rabbits mentality that only makes poverty even worse. The main problem is that many people still get very low pay - too low. Luckily that's changing.

  • anita.grant.526 - 2012-10-07 06:53

    Forget the workers and mechanise the mine.

  • Bafana Joseph - 2012-10-07 07:01

    dis country will b the same as Zimbabwe because of Jacob Zuma's greedy government

      emile.marais - 2012-10-07 14:54

      3.4 million refugees, 95% unemployment and more then 60% of all fauna killed since 2000. Zimbabwe, a true Socialist dream come true.

      emile.marais - 2012-10-07 14:54

      3.4 million refugees, 95% unemployment and more then 60% of all fauna killed since 2000. Zimbabwe, a true Socialist dream come true.

  • matthew.patrick.925 - 2012-10-07 07:10

    Kleo, after reading your comments on this forum it seems you counter with baseless, subjective arguments without providing any facts or statistics. You also seem to make assumptions and generalisations based one-sided, small-minded views that lack any rationale. Your world must be a very frustrating, 2-dimensional place. Or you be a troll

      whatda.fuqbro - 2012-10-07 09:15

      Kleo's no troll - you just can't make up the kind of nonsense he posts. I still don't understand how he justifies violence or barbarianism, but you can't talk sense into a communist.

      whatda.fuqbro - 2012-10-07 09:15

      Kleo's no troll - you just can't make up the kind of nonsense he posts. I still don't understand how he justifies violence or barbarianism, but you can't talk sense into a communist.

  • Brian Dorning - 2012-10-07 07:15

    Looks like we will join the list of 'has-been' countries in Africa. Why are Africans generally speaking such idiots? Unions are promising miners things that cannot be delivered, its not sustainable!

      whatda.fuqbro - 2012-10-07 09:08

      Well their average IQ is estimated at around 60-65, and not long ago they were living in mud huts, running around in loin cloths and throwing sticks at each other. Come to think about it, not much has changed. It's like evolution suddenly stopped doing its job on this continent.

      whatda.fuqbro - 2012-10-07 09:08

      Well their average IQ is estimated at around 60-65, and not long ago they were living in mud huts, running around in loin cloths and throwing sticks at each other. Come to think about it, not much has changed. It's like evolution suddenly stopped doing its job on this continent.

  • robin.stobbs.9 - 2012-10-07 07:15

    Having a job is NOT a right - it's a privilege one must earn. Having a job doesn't mean you get paid for sitting on your bum (= toytoying) - having a job means you get remunerated for the WORK you do!

  • trevor.pietersen.3 - 2012-10-07 07:15

    Why Zoom Zuum so quiet???? what he doing???

      mc.segal.5 - 2012-10-07 07:20

      Zoom Zoom Is grabbing what he can while he still can.Doubt whether he can do anything else..

      mc.segal.5 - 2012-10-07 07:20

      Zoom Zoom Is grabbing what he can while he still can.Doubt whether he can do anything else..

      susan.pretorius.31 - 2012-10-08 11:02

      He is shifting funds to his overseas accounts...

      susan.pretorius.31 - 2012-10-08 11:02

      He is shifting funds to his overseas accounts...