Mandela approach versus Malema approach

2011-09-12 23:15

Johannesburg - Freedom Front Plus leader Pieter Mulder said on Monday that his party hoped a judgment by Judge Collin Lamont ruling that singing of the words "shoot the boer" amounted to hate speech would be the first step in getting the country "out of the swamp of hate speech and racism".

AfriForum Youth opened a civil case against Malema in the Equality Court after he sang the words "dubhula ibhunu", which translate to "shoot the boer", at a number of ANC Youth League gatherings last year.

"The contrast between the Mandela approach after 1994 and the Malema approach the past year, shouted out for an adjustment," said Mulder.

He said it was a "pity" the matter had had to be brought before a court.

"In this regard, the judge's decision is a serious charge against the African National Congress which allowed this case to get out of hand and develop so far before a correction was made from outside the ANC," Mulder said.

Earlier on Monday Judge Lamont said that "dubhula ibhunu" (shoot the boer) undermined the dignity of people and were discriminatory and harmful.

"No justification exists allowing the words to be sung... the words were in any event not sung on a justifiable occasion."

Lamont said it was not relevant whether the words were not exposed to some people of society.

"If it is exposed to a portion of society then it is relevant."

Deep divisions

Lamont's ruling triggered a raft of divided responses.

The ruling ANC came out in opposition to his judgment, saying  it was appalled by the decision.

ANC spokesperson Jackson Mthembu said the party viewed the judgment as an attempt to rewrite the South African history which is not desirable and unsustainable.

"This ruling flies against the need to accept our past and to preserve our heritage as an organisation and as a people.

"... we will explore every possibility to defend our history, our heritage and our traditions," he said.

Other organisations with links to the ANC towed the same line - that the ruling impinged on their traditions.

Cosatu said the decision was a "gross insult" to the country's past, and that Malema's singing of "dubhula ibhunu", like many other liberation songs, was never intended literally.

It was rather a symbol of the black majority's anger and frustration.

"The judgment that the song is 'discriminatory' and 'harmful' is a gross insult to our history as a country," the Congress of SA Trade Unions said in a statement.

It said the song was never directed at individual white South Africans, but rather at a class of land barons who "brutally exploited" black workers.

Collective memory

The National Union of Metalworkers of SA (Numsa) said songs played an important role in remembering the anti-apartheid struggle.

"We are firmly of the view that organs of class rule - the courts - should not be used to re-write our history of struggles and liberation against the repressive regime," said Numsa spokesperson Castro Ngobese.

"There are no blank pages in history. Struggle songs are our collective memory," he said.

"We believe there is deep hatred and irritations in some sections of our society towards ANCYL president Julius Malema, and the song 'dubhula ibhunu' should not be confused with that," Ngobese said.

"People should contest the ideological outlook or posture of the ANCYL president and leave our struggle songs alone."

The SA Communist Party said Malema had been taken to court by rightwing fanatics bent on re-writing the country's past.

The Social Movement Against Racist Tendencies (Smart) said it would immediately petition Lamont to provide the basis for his findings and join any parties which intended appealing the case.

"This is not a judgment against Malema, but against our history. If some individuals can still call our people kaffirs and allow others to sing 'De la Rey' then this judgment is laughable," said Panyaza Lesufi, the founding leader of Smart.

The song "De La Rey", written and performed by Bok van Blerk, is thought to be named after General Koos de la Rey, who was a Boer general during the second Anglo-Boer War.

It is about a desperate Boer soldier who, in the face of his own death and the destruction of the Afrikaner nation, calls on De La Rey to lead his people to victory.


A crowd broke into singing "dubhula ibhunu", (shoot the boer) at the South Gauteng High Court after the words were declared hate speech on Monday.

"We are not scared," sang another group.

In spite of contravening a court order, nobody was apprehended among the group of singers.

Judge Lamont ordered that the words not be used publicly or privately.

An ANCYL member said after the ruling: "When we sing these songs, we sing about history not about racism. I don't understand why he was guilty. We sing about the history of the ANC, there is no racism".

Culture of disrespect

Lobby rights group AfriForum, whose youth movement opened the civil case against Malema, led applause for the ruling.

The group's CEO Kallie Kriel said: "We are elated about the judgment as we knew all along that this was hate speech."

He said the ruling was a victory for the concept of mutual respect and dignity in communities over what he described as the culture of disrespect Malema was sowing.

"Should he try to take this on appeal, we will take this matter on. We have beaten him twice in court already," Kriel said.

The Christian Democratic Party said that the ANC should share some of the blame, as the party "went full out" to support Malema in this case.

CDP leader Theunis Botha said it was hoped the ANC would "make haste" in removing Malema as president of the ANCYL.

He said Malema had proven time and again that he was not fit to play a positive role in the country's future.

First step

Afrikanerbond secretary Jan Bosman said he trusted that the ruling was the first step in curbing racism and forcing political and public figures to be "responsible and careful".

"The race-card... is now regularly played. The inevitable consequence is that the broad South African society is becoming more race-based and divided."

Racism "in whatever colour and whatever form" had to be rejected.

Bosman said the next step was for the SA Human Rights Commission to evaluate and assess Malema's pronouncements within the context of the Bill of Rights.

Farmers' union TAU-SA said the ANC and its youth should accept the judgment.

"The time has come to stop fighting... and respect cultural groups and [different] races," its president Louis Meintjes said.

"The judgment... has vindicated TAU-SA in its attempt to erase hate speech from South African society and contribute to put an end to violent victimisation of farmers and farm dwellers."

In light of the ruling, TAU-SA called on the government to pay attention to violent crimes on farms and smallholdings.

Meintjes asked the government to consider setting up a dedicated unit to act against the perpetrators and maintain a database of farm attacks.

Keeping mum

The ANC Youth League, however, chose to remain silent on the outcome.

Malema was not present for the judgment, and his spokesperson Floyd Shivambu would not comment on the judgment or say where Malema was.

"No we are not speaking," Shivambu said.

The organisation said it would study the judgment and consult with the ANC and other fraternal organisations before commenting.

  • Wolraad Woltemade - 2011-09-12 23:24

    Are we still trying to hope for an epiphany? I have come to the conclusion that the systems' ideology was corrupt from the start. The "rainbow" nation of '94 was just a hoax. Simple. Time to do our own thing. FF - please work on the homeland policy, we are wasting our breath trying to live in peace and harmony with the ANC government and the bulk of their supporters.

      beicime - 2011-09-12 23:56

      Jessy Duarte stated o behalf of the ANC that the Afriforum is too small to influence the ANC. If the judge invoked the South African constitution, does she mean that the constitution does not apply to minorities? If so, her and the ANC understanding of any country constitution is questionable making the ANC unfit to govern.

      Elizabeth Welsh - 2011-09-13 01:00

      Exactly- Did anyone read The Count of Monte Cristo (or at least saw the movie?)

      tryanything - 2011-09-13 01:39

      Republic of the Western Cape here we come. The WC least this flush toilet seems to be working....

      Bettie - 2011-09-13 03:27

      Are we still trying to hope for an epiphany? I don't know anymore... I just realised "the ANC is appalled" seems to be an answer restricted to the Malema supporters. As a white male, I am appalled that the ANC would choose to defend such a racist song. Is it not true that the k-word is part of our heritage? Is it not true that racists jokes are part of our heritage? Yet, we as white men, have chosen to forget the heritage on our behalf in hopes of a better future in this twisted country... Just when you thought a breakthrough is approaching, the leading party\ makes it clear that a clear divide in the people is all that remains of what once was yearned at...

      Dave50 - 2011-09-13 05:23

      Some people should thank Juju, a lot of companies and people in SA get paid in USD $ and with the fuss created by all this racist rubbish and the way our goverment handled it the Rand is loosing ground so people get more Rand per Dollar, thank you Juju for putting more money in the hands of the gravey train and really making our country a laughing stock internationaly.

      Rolie - 2011-09-13 06:29

      Jesse Duarte is a ANC puppet - she should be sent to balloon conventions with all the hot air she spews.

      steve.dupreez - 2011-09-13 07:20

      I am neither an academic nor a politician but in light of Malema's constant verbal attacks on whites, more notibly those of the past weekend in Alexandra, I can only surmise that Malema is a rasist and that the song - when he sings it - is a call to arms of his followers. Malema openly declared war on whites this past weekend and now they claim the "shoot the Boer" song is neither rascist nor hatespeach? Go figure.

      scipio - 2011-09-13 07:22

      you are so right. lets stop pretending that we can live with people that hate us. we are surrounded by rascists. we need our own land with a government for us. the a n c are a complete and utter waste of space. corruption is their god. lets up sticks and start again. its possible. we are industious and clever people. what choices do we have. the latest i hear is showerhead talking of moulding malema into a good leader. we all know you cant polish a turd. lets just start again away from these people. remember they need us more than we need them.

      JM - 2011-09-13 07:37

      Malema is the reason this song was banned. If not for Malema nobody would be bothered. He is the one that told whites that they are criminals and should be treated as such. He is the one that declared a war on Saturday. He is the one that said during numerous public gatherings that white owned farms should be confiscated without compensation. Then he repeatedly sings a song targeted at that same minority group that tells them in no uncertain terms that they are rapists and that they need to be shot with a gun. These are the facts. Another fact is that the ANC decided not to rebuke him. The comments made by the ANC yesterday regarding the hate speech judgement is concerning to say the least. The question is – do they want a war in this country? It sure looks like it.

      JM - 2011-09-13 07:53

      I also find it quite disturbing that the ANC compares this song to the Voortrekker Monument and to the De la Rey song. Both of these so called Afrikaans symbols contain no direct threats to another population group. How would the ANC feel if they appeal this hate speech ruling, succeeds in getting it overturned and a group of Afrikaans artists get together and create a similar song in reply? Shaka Zulu annihilated 2 million people, mostly black people and yet this government allowed statues of him to be erected in this country. Even an international airport was named after him. This country’s leadership has gone mad!

      York Hunt - 2011-09-13 09:55

      This just shows you. The ANC does not stand for equal rights. The ANC government is all about racial division. Time for people to decide what side they are on. And yes, liberals, I'm talking to YOU!

      Currie_Mafia - 2011-09-13 11:24

      All this racial tension/hatred just goes to show that the rainbow nation is actually a rainbow notion. When in the company of Whites, I've heard of derogatory terms that are used to describe blacks from A - Z. I sure that I'm a coolie when my back is turned. Whilst, Malema's utterances are despicable, nothing concrete has been done since 1994 to aid the reconciliation process.

  • Martin du Plessis - 2011-09-12 23:32

    I still wait for a logical explanation as to why "De La Rey" being sung is a heinous and racial attack on Black people in south africa. IF, and i gotta stress the if, someone answers with a logical response detailing the subject and precisely the elements that are so hurtful to Native South Africans, then i'll never mention it ever again and also do my personal utmost to remove the song from my complete sphere of influence, such as it is.

      peaceinSA - 2011-09-12 23:38

      There isn't a logical explanation. Just as there isn't a logical explanation that singing about your desire to murder people should be completely acceptable.

      tryanything - 2011-09-13 01:36

      Sorry Martin its going to be a long wait...

      pitbull - 2011-09-13 05:33

      Logic is not one of the current government's attributes. Just like children it runs on impulse. But then if you cut off a cockroaches head it can still live and run around for a few days.

      Mebob - 2011-09-13 07:06

      The rainbow nation is not a hoax. If you look closely, you will see that at the end of our rainbow, you will find a pothole (not pot of gold).

      chrisvan - 2011-09-13 07:21

      Ja, skattie, I also do not understand, but hey, then we actually think, don't we? Logic? There is none.

      Protest - 2011-09-13 07:22

      "De La Rey" is not directly a heinous and racial attack on Black people in South Africa. It is a song that risks triggering the unification if the Boer Volk. The biggest threat to the Black people of South Africa is that the Boervolk starts to unite. Remember the classic words: "Divide and Conquer" Then remember: "Eendrag maak Mag" Therefore any song with the potential to unify the Boervolk, irrespective if the words carry offensive meaning or not, will cause a huge outcry as a "heinous and racial attack on Black people in South Africa"

      Susan - 2011-09-13 07:24

      I'm with you boet!

      Robby - 2011-09-13 07:42

      De La Rey got nothing to do with "Blacks" it is an Afrikaans heritage song about the Anglo Boere War. "De La Rey" can't be part of the debate.

      GuyverXT9 - 2011-09-13 07:54

      @Martin: They can't explain it logically as it was a simple knee jerk reaction because they didn't get their way. Tantrums like we've seen demonstrated usually come from kids 5 years and younger, goes to show the mentality of the ruling government and its "youth" wing.

      Martin du Plessis - 2011-09-13 08:07

      I guessed as much, Protest.

      vrystaat - 2011-09-13 08:31

      De La Rey didnt even have ANYTHING to do with black was whites against whites!had nothing to do with the dam black ppl,not everything is about you black ppl all the tym!wat about our afrikaaners history in this country?how we fought the british for this land..does the ANC honestly think the british would have handed over this country as easy as we did??

      joe2110 - 2011-09-13 09:17

      The ANC and Mal Emma should actually love the song "De La Rey" which is after all directed at "imperialist Britain" of the 19th century and not blacks. My own national anthem, "Flower of Scotland", is similar in sentiment as are many Irish rebel songs. "Follow me up to Carlow" refers to sending black Fitzwilliam's head, dripping red over to queen Liza, (Elizabeth I of England)and her ladies.Even though there is another queen Liza on the throne now, the English seem mature enough to handle the very real hatred expressed and symbolized in song by the people they oppressed and butchered in the past!

      Cindy - 2011-09-13 12:23

      "de la Rey" is about the Anglo/Boer War and the only place in which the "enemy" is mentioned (Oor die Kakies wat lag, ......, hulle dink dis verby.) makes it pefectly clear that the "enemy" are the Khaki's (English soldiers) so Martin is 100% correct, de la Rey cannot be construed as "hate speech" against other races only, at one hell of a stretch, us "souties".... its awright Martin my brand of Lower Albany "soutie" is tough, we don't take de la Rey as a threat boet!

  • peaceinSA - 2011-09-12 23:33

    Unfortunately, not everyone understands what "it was never intended literally" means.See

      pitbull - 2011-09-13 05:34

      Unfortunately, Mampara's/Malema's followers are like bunch of sheep. They will do what he tells them with the blind faith of the cult followers. Anyone with half a brain would see the insanity of following such a leader.

  • justice4all - 2011-09-12 23:36

    If the Jews in Germany after 1945 began singing songs about killing germans, that too would be unacceptable. Bunch of fargin iceholes

  • Andy skinstad - 2011-09-12 23:37

    thank you for the article, but the title is very miss-leading. Actual strategic and philosophical differences between the leadership of Mandela and Malema would be interesting.

  • Eugene - 2011-09-12 23:42

    If you are allowed to sing that other people should be shot and justify it on heritage and history - then everyone (all racial groups) should be allowed to do the same. I do not think Juluis would be happy if the word Boer was to be replaced with another race group in that song.

      pitbull - 2011-09-13 05:35

      Specifically the word Malema.

      joe2110 - 2011-09-13 09:27

      How about writing a song called "Blood River", with new appropriate words sung to the tune of Moon River. "Blood River, we beat you by a mile, by killing you in style that day"?? We'll follow the same rainbow. Malema you are dead, two bullets in the head, Blood River again.

  • PinkAndProud - 2011-09-12 23:48

    Panyaza Lesufi has to be mentally deranged to compare this wicked song about killing the boer to De la Rey. For heaven's sake, get an education.

      ES - 2011-09-13 02:58

      Written by Sam Vaknin , PhD Please read it and you will understand how mentally insane Malemma actually is

  • beicime - 2011-09-12 23:56

    Jessy Duarte stated o behalf of the ANC that the Afriforum is too small to influence the ANC. If the judge invoked the South African constitution, does she mean that the constitution does not apply to minorities? If so, her and the ANC understanding of any country constitution is questionable making the ANC unfit to govern.

      daaivark - 2011-09-13 07:23

      Jessy doesn't have the capacity to think for herself. All she can do is roll her eyes and spin what Fat Boy Slim and the Bent Brigade churn out.

  • Peeved - 2011-09-13 00:00

    True colors shining through, how can they claim to sing a song to remember their history when the song is sung with malice and intent and is so interpreted by the assembled masses of youth that believe Malema is going to provide them with untold riches for no work or effort on their part. As South Africans both black and white we collectively suffer thanks to the ANC and its incapacity to rule the country, by the end of this decade we will truly be back in the dark ages and ostracized internationally like we where compliments of the previous gov. The more things change the more they stay the same, we have the same masters again in power only a different color.

      Colleen - 2011-10-07 09:58

      I agree, however you show me one goverment through out the world that hasnt had some form of coruption, but the anc takes the cake they are so blatant that it's embarassing. the amount of meat on some of these goverment mp's could feed the nation for months.

  • robbieyahu - 2011-09-13 00:43

    i personally hate RACISM ... and be it from white or from black or from any other race !!! racism is evil if anybody makes racist remarks or songs i object ... we must start to love ... so by singing "shoot a boer !! .. or ...shoot a caffir !!! this is both evil !! no matter if some sang it around braai-fires or others for struggle songs IT INSTIGATES HATE !!! AND DOES NOT BELONG IN ANY SOCIETY ...PERIOD !!!!

      pitbull - 2011-09-13 05:40

      As Carl Sagan said" We are one species. We are star stuff." Racism is abhorrent.

  • Elizabeth Welsh - 2011-09-13 00:56

    I'm American, but I don't understand why black africans think the land is theirs. Didn't life originate in Africa? So what if a few left and came back 10,000 years later. They don't seem to respect property laws anyway.

      Peg-Leg-Sven - 2011-09-13 01:18

      Elizabeth, the education system in South Africa has been so dumbed down and what passes for History in today's classroom, preaches that the Blacks of Africa were the inventors of every conceivable invention that the world has ever had the privilege to use. This is thanks to the former president of South Africa, one Thabo Mbeki, who went around proclaiming the African Renaissance. to have a Renaissance requires that the Blacks had an advanced civilisation that slid into decline, sadly this is not factually true. They had never managed to raise themselves above the Stone-Age, except a few tribes that had managed to enter the Iron-Age. The only use they found for iron, was assagai points to kill their enemies. Academia said not a word, nor did the rest of the world condemn him for preaching Pseudo History, they were strangely quiet and for that reason the Blacks of South Africa now believe the White Settler stole their banks, writing, applied mathematics, their cars, planes, land, minerals, cities and anything else that was actually brought to Africa. These Historians around the world should hang their head in shame, as their silence has brought this unsustainable situation into being. When good men remain silent, evil is given a chance to flourish. AIDS in Africa does not mean the HIV virus, it stands for Accumulated Intelligence Deficiency Syndrome, this is no pill for stupidity.

      tryanything - 2011-09-13 01:34

      Just Google 'Black South African inventors....

      Hetrohero - 2011-09-13 01:55

      Who cares what they think.

      Peg-Leg-Sven - 2011-09-13 02:04

      @tryanything, I did and did not see one invention by a black South African before the Colonialists brought education, Universities, science, physics and all the other things to Africa. Inventing something after receiving the education from the "Thieving" Whites, is only a reflection as to how much the settlers changed the thinking of the Black tribes of Africa.

      flummoxed - 2011-09-13 06:26

      Good to read that not all Americans are blinkered in their observation of life in South Aftrican

      daaivark - 2011-09-13 07:23

      Lady, I think it best you stay in the US. Or acquire a spot of REAL information.

      daaivark - 2011-09-13 07:25

      Bear in mind that most commentators here have very limited points of view, Peg-leg being one of the less reliable sources.

      Totman - 2011-09-13 09:08

      @Elizabeth. There is some things that you can read in Peg-Leg-Sven's comment as maybe true. Not that I believe you have to be a major inventor to be count as a human with rights, but the current education on history they get is a bid one-sided. daaivark will maybe tell you I am wrong because he is mostly one who comment with trying to balance the impossible while just concentrate on the tenses, sentence structure and spelling. Irrelevant what the other one say.[sorry, daaivark. You know you had that one coming] I on the other hand are daily challenge to make sense with the facts that children gets to learn. The pro-black history facts are light in weight and scattered in context of time. Plain simple confusing. I am a follower of history and I presume if the facts is as scares as ours we will have to improvise. Saying all this, I still believe people read African or rather South African history wrong. There is enough[read black] to use and it is not necessary to see white[read settlers's history] as competition. The fact is true that we are dealing with a complex in some black people and due to current leadership it gets also daily develop in the SA white population. We do not have the leadership that can bind us, unite us and lift us out of this dilemma. On the lighter side. Yes, you came from here and seeing that you[read USA] are interested in your origins can cause some worries. Most black people do not like USA and a lot of whites feel the same. Good luck !!! LOL !!!!!

  • MikeLearview - 2011-09-13 01:00

    We may not get an epiphany, but we can always rely on to make us laugh: "Other organisations with links to the ANC towed the same line..." should of course read "Other organisations with links to the ANC toed the same line...". I'm only amazed that the report doesn't use the word "toad", especially as Mr Malema features so prominently.

  • karsten.kaminski - 2011-09-13 01:05

    I for one am starting to reconsider my future in this so called country of unity. Mr Mandela wanted unity, why all of the racism? Sorry for being white, should we not all live together in harmony? SERIOUSLY IT SHOULD NOT BE ABOUT CREED OR COLOUR!

  • martindupreez - 2011-09-13 01:17

    Are these people really so stupid that they believe themselves when they sing to kill another race is not racist. The people following these people are really so stupid as they know how it feels to be on the receiving end of such comments. Also the same people who was fighting for equality? What hippocrats all black people in South Africa turned out to be. I have never seen a group of black human rights group toy-toying for the rights of white people?

      Hetrohero - 2011-09-13 01:52

      Yes they are stupid. Case closed.

  • lapfa - 2011-09-13 01:49

    Instead of discussing this minor judgement, it is better to focus on important things. What can be done to create jobs in South Africa. Why are the minorities not getting involved in solving problems the country faces in creating jobs.

      daaivark - 2011-09-13 07:25

      A most valid point.

      allie - 2011-09-13 08:26

      Why must the white people solve the unemployment problem again?Why can`t the rich black people also build factories and supply jobs?Because they go to univarsity and prefer to study political science insteed of engineering.Jobs are lucrative in the government and you don`t have to work either.The prez is a good rollmodel.Notice when there`s a crises .Always whites helping out,out of compassion.But they still want to kill us all,ungrateful f-k--en idiots.They should blame their own ANC for making promisses they never kept just to get their votes.

      MP3 - 2011-09-13 09:15

      always refreshing to see comments like these... so mister majority, what pray tell are you doing to solve the problems of the country?

      Point Blank - 2011-09-13 10:04

      @lapfa, says who? There are THOUSANDS of white people working hard for a better South Africa. Your comment proves the sheer propaganda the ANC have spun against white people... get out more!!

      The Gecko - 2011-09-13 12:52

      "Why are the minorities not getting involved in solving problems the country faces in creating jobs." Because we are not allowed to. We can start businesses, but we can't get contracts due to BEE, thus cannot appoint more people...

  • Hetrohero - 2011-09-13 01:51

    This whole issue is a complete waste of time and money. Someone should be sued for THAT.

  • - 2011-09-13 02:23


  • J.B - 2011-09-13 02:43

    "It said the song was never directed at individual white South Africans, but rather at a class of land barons who "brutally exploited" black workers." Ummmmm - there is your answer. It IS hate speech and IS directed at white South Africans whether individual or not! I'm all for liberation, heritage and tradition but this "song" should have been discarded the moment apartheid was abolished. Shoot the Boer is hardly a sing of liberation - one does not obtain liberation through the senseless brutal killings of innocent people.

  • ES - 2011-09-13 02:51

    Please read the following article: Written by Sam Vaknin , PhD

  • CTatheist - 2011-09-13 04:12

    The more I look at the pictures of Malema and his extending gut, the more it reminds me of the pictures of Dingane we saw in our history textbooks. Dingane, the one who killed his own half brother for a shot at the throne.

      Mnumzane - 2011-09-13 07:09

      I thought you will say Dingane killed amabhunu.

  • Majordad.007 - 2011-09-13 05:19

    "The SA Communist Party said Malema had been taken to court by rightwing fanatics bent on re-writing the country's past." Comments like these display a lack of understanding. History cannot be un-written/re-written, only peoples appreciation of what occurred. So what happened is recorded in stone, only the scribes like to place this on a paper record where interpretation and other agendas affect the history should be result. History should be taught by the family as with the home language, then lets get education of an open mind and public record at school. Tragically this is not possible since someone has to teach the teachers.

  • pitbull - 2011-09-13 05:31

    Comparing Mandela to Mampara is like comparing Everest (8,848m) with the Marianas Trench (8,184m). The only similarity between the latter two are they are far from sea level. The only similarity between the former is that they are both black. There the similarities end.

  • WTF - 2011-09-13 05:46

    A diminutive man mobilising the disenchanted masses by blaming a minority, who are not in power, for their woes. The only thing we learn from history is that we do not learn from history. All he has to do is go to jail and write a book titled "My struggle", be released, invade Swaziland, and the circle will be complete... and when the dust settles, who will have to pick up the pieces? The "Bloody agents"... Youth League? Didn't Hitler have one of those?

  • Idrees Eddy Dadabhay - 2011-09-13 06:03

    When a nation perpetrates that of music (singing) There is none to save that nation from the distraction that awaits . May God save us all

      daaivark - 2011-09-13 07:26

      SAY WHAT!!!?

  • Rusty - 2011-09-13 06:03

    The ANC have announced their intention to file an appeal against the judgment of the South Gauteng High Court. Sooner or later the matter will land up in the Constitutional Court. Now we know exactly what Chief Justice Moegoe Moegoe is doing there. Makes you think, doesn't it?

      flummoxed - 2011-09-13 06:29

      Am on the same wavelength Rusty..

      daaivark - 2011-09-13 07:27

      I doubt that JZ thought that far ahead.

      BadBoy79 - 2011-09-13 07:56

      @ Daaivark - You underestimate JZ and the ANC. They are corrupt and taking this country down, but they've got more intelligence than you credit them with. "Delarey Delarey, Sal jy die boere kom lei, Delarey Delarey"!!

  • Baas Frik - 2011-09-13 06:04

    The ANC will take this to the constitutional court. They will lose the case and then you will hear their condemnation of Judge Mogoeng Mogoeng. Interesting times we live in. Julius Malema is an uneducated thug who plays the ANC like a puppet on a string. To compare the De La Rey song with the so called struggle song shows an ignorance beyond belief.

      Rusty - 2011-09-13 06:10

      @Baas Frik, I hope you are right. Can the ANC lose the case in the Con Court if Moegoe Moegoe is pulling the strings of the other judges who may get kicked off the bench of they don't tow the ANC party line?

      Baas Frik - 2011-09-13 06:29

      Rusty There is no way they can win this in the con court. Ask any legal eagle and they will tel you this. The ANC started the habit of taking every issue to court and then keep it there for as long as possible. It displays their total lack in leadership and it is going to burn them in the long run.

  • Proudly SA - 2011-09-13 06:10

    Good reply Mr Mulder; ANC resposnse is totally unacceptable and fact issue had to be taken out of ANC to resolve is indication of their complete lack of judgement. No civilised country in the world allows one group to sing such blatantly offensive songs or chants about other groups. This song made my children very scared when they heard it and asked why it was allowed to sing songs about killing each other.

      Trymore - 2011-09-13 07:37

      The whites u can't live with other people especial with blacks you are provoking blacks do you want our country to look like zimbabwe, whites in zimbabwe were once reconcilated but their unbecoming behaviour provoked mugabe, you have serious problem and you need to rectify it, this song was sung before julius was born and it was because of the oppression of blacks by white people, our children need to know about this that how this democracy came about, malema never directed this to anyone he was singing the heritage song, it

      Trymore - 2011-09-13 07:56

      It is time that the law law must be mathematical we have many people who have graduated in law who view this differently why because law is formulated vague sometimes judges follow their personal agenda political agendas, from the begining the judge was supposed to have thrown this case out of his court, nowadays you find judges interfiering in political matters where is Shilowa now he was thrown out because of he is popular than Lekota all this is unnecessary interferance by the courts in polical matters,

      Felix - 2011-09-13 08:03

      Try again Trymore, Madbob was provoked by greed and sifilis.

      Memo-H - 2011-09-13 10:06

      if this song is part of history, let it remain in the history books. It is not the time to be singing this song if we want a rainbow nation.

      Neill Mackenzie - 2011-09-13 13:43

      Hi Trymore, hope you are well after eating all that glue. I would just like to point a single fact out to you. Mugabe thought it was a good idea to kick out all the white people, because (according to you) the whites provoked him. When last did you take a look at Zim? Or should I ask: the lack of Zim... He is killing his own people, to make himself rich. If you think that is a great model to follow, then go ahead, run into a brick wall, repeatedly shouting the following: "I will not say stupid sh*t in comment sections!" Kind Regards

      Bosman - 2011-09-13 14:24

      @Trymore.....Really??!!? Are you seriously retarded? What happens in zim is pure greed and racism. Plain and simple. No white "provoked" Mugabe you twat. He just felt it was necessary to drive the country to his knees. You know who is feeling his greed the most? (of course you dont) Its the blacks of Zim starving of hunger.I will not ever say sorry for being a white south african and being part of a proud history where we had to fight the British for this country. Without the whites there wouldve been no South Africa. It wouldve been British South Africa. Is that provocation enough for you?!?? Its also quite ironic that the Majority in our country still feel the need to sing oppression songs about the minority after 17 years of democracy...Please think before you type anything you utter moron

      observer - 2011-09-13 17:15

      Why is it that everyone is missing the point? Something is seen as offensive when someone takes offense in it. It is not subjective, it is not left open for interpretation, it is blatant. "Kill the Boer" It was sung as a liberation song, and the liberation has been over for 18 years. Racial tensions are at an all time high, because a senior official in the ANC is not singing this song in remembrance of past struggles, but as a call for war (see article on Saturday). He has been doing so to agitate his white countrymen in his little political game, spurned on by his likeminded, uneducated fellow ANCYL'ers. So stop trying to defend it or cloak it in stale excuses. Move on, accept the legislative powers in the country and try and be mature human beings. Towns and cities are losing their original names in order to rewrite memories (painful to some because it reminds them of apartheid, although prior to Apartheid, said towns never existed, nor were stolen from them). However, this is NOT seen as erasing someone's culture because that would just not be logical if you are not the ANC. Two wrongs don't make a right, but in South Africa, that is exactly what it does in the eyes of the ANC and the ones benefitting from the fast emptying coffers of the treasury, which i have to mention is being filled by the tax payers, who if white, have no say as to the eradication of their heritage (blemished or not).

      observer - 2011-09-13 17:22

      adding on...i would love to say, lets please move on, hold hands and build a better future, however, this is not a movie, or a novel, this is the newest chapter, in a series of documentaries called "The African Way". We can not predict the future, but we can estimate future events by what has transpired in the past, in similar settings. It is sad, yes, and I would like nothing more than to be proven wrong, a cynic and called unpatriotic, but sadly, i doubt that would become reality.

  • flummoxed - 2011-09-13 06:20

    The only reason that the ANC are "appalled' by the outcome of Judge Lamont;s ruling is because Zuma too is known to sing his little ditty about 'picking up his machine gun' (literal translation) and that doesn't show him in a very good light either.

  • Durbsdude - 2011-09-13 06:30

    One is a magnanimous leader while the other is a racist coward that doesn't even have the moral fortitude to attend the judgement on his own racist court case.

  • Daar_is_Hoop - 2011-09-13 06:44

    Staan saam! As jy ook moeg is vir die rassistiese probleme in ons land is NOU die tyd om saam te staan! Ja, ek weet dat daar altyd dwarstrekkers is en vir hulle sal ons met respek hanteer, maar selfs diegene wat altyd hulle eie ding wil doen het die grysstof om te weet daar is die regte en die verkeerde manier van dinge doen is. Wat kan ek aanbied?, NIKS wat nie reeds JOUNE is nie. So as jy belangstel e-pos my dan vertel ek jou meer. Nou is die tyd om iets vir ons nasie en ons kinders te doen! Vir meer inligting epos my by

      PietPompies - 2011-09-13 07:00

      Engels asb.

      daaivark - 2011-09-13 07:28

      Toemaar Boet, ek sal maar buite die laager bly, dankie.

      SAFan - 2011-09-13 07:50

      Hoekom is dit afrikanerstaansaam en nie suidafrikanerstaansaam nie, bedoel dit dat ek as 'n engels sprekende suid afrikaner, nie deel hiervan is nie. ??

      Neill Mackenzie - 2011-09-13 14:39

      @SAFan. As jy kan boeries maak is jy in... (if you can BBQ sausage you are in).

  • gatvol4corru - 2011-09-13 06:52

    Wake up Pieter -- we never mattered. the case of "I demand,I want" is all that the ANC wanted. The corrupt-incompetent-racist-comrades,are out for themselves. UBUNTU -- means = fill your own pockets comrades. Let the poor & minority suffer

  • Ace - 2011-09-13 06:56

    Listen Malema and Malema followers, I as a young white South African take the below article as a threat against my life and the lives of my family. I will fight against you for myself and the rest of the logical black, white, indian, and any other South African. Who do you think you are Malema? Your words make me boil inside. I'm writing about this below article. Malema declares economic war 2011-09-10 16:00 ANCYL president Julius Malema declared an "economic war" against the "white minority" in Scwetla informal settlement on Saturday. "This is war, and we should fight, moving forward. There will be casualties, but I know that we are going to win," he said.

      Baas Frik - 2011-09-13 07:06

      I agree with you and support your sentiment. This Malema thug publicly threatened all White Afrikaners with war and death. I will also meet him on his terms but I can assure you that he will come off second best.

      Rusty - 2011-09-13 07:17

      Frik. I am a white English speaking South African. Malama's behaviour is directed against all whites, not only Afrikaners. He hates whites and he is attempting to stir up a race war between blacks and whites for his own political and financial gain.

      Dirk du Plessis - 2011-09-13 07:29

      Please guys- send us info where to meet- I will join. Enough is enough he should be kicked into touch

  • Wog Whisperer - 2011-09-13 07:01

    Management By Crisis !!! All over the place This f@@k-up will not come right, the way we see it now

  • Mnumzane - 2011-09-13 07:11

    Nanka lamabhunu asithathela izwe lethu manje asesithathela namaculo ethu. Kanti senzeni ngempela.

      Felix - 2011-09-13 08:08

      I don't know what you said, but I don't like the way you said it.

      Aleg - 2011-09-13 11:25

      I went to and translated word for word from Zulu in order to get the gist of what was said: Nanka (look) lamabhunu (Boer) asithathela (take hold) izwe (land, country, nation) lethu (our) manje (now) asesithathela (die, make disappear) namaculo (song) ethu (ours). Kanti (Whereas) senzeni (carry out) ngempela (absolutely). I doubt whether Mandela would ever have been so puerile as to choose to comment in another language on an English forum. Furthermore, I do believe that well-brought up, well-mannered, responsible people who are able to use their intellect and escape the mob mentality so that they can reason and think for themselves would choose to use him as a role model instead of the present juvenile delinquent.

      Bender - 2011-09-13 11:47

      "The boers/whites are taking our nation and our songs. What have we really done?" thats what she is saying

      Bender - 2011-09-13 11:52

      firstly, if the song stayed in a museum and in textbooks, that is ok because it was your history, but to sing it now in 2011 is hate speech, kill the boer or kill anyone is indicting hate speech, just as if the song was the other way round, i do not believe for one minute that if the song was kill the black, you people would not have had it banned and called us agents for singing it, if you want to sing ur song and u say its your heratige then so is the K word to the afrikaner. racism cant not only be from whites, as most blacks believe. oh and for u blacks who say de la rey is racist On a mountain in the night We lie in the dark and wait In the mud and the blood As rain and streepsak clings to me And my house and my farm were burnt to the ground so they could capture us But those flames and those fires now burns deep deep within me. De La Rey, De La Rey can you come and lead the Boers? De La Rey, De La Rey General, General we will fall around you as one. General De La Rey. The Khakis that laugh A handful of us against an massive force With our backs to the cliffs of the mountains They think its over for us But the heart of a Boer is deeper and wider, they will come to see On a horse he comes, the lion of West Transvaal De La Rey, De La Rey can you come and lead the Boers? De La Rey, De La Rey General, General we will fall around you as one. General De La Rey. Because my wife and my child are in a camp dying, And the Khakis are walking over a nation that will rise again

      Aleg - 2011-09-13 12:37

      @Bender - I appreciate it that you translated for us. Mine was just a crude translation word for word. Thank you.

      Patience - 2011-09-13 13:27

      Mnumzane, nobody is taking your "songs" (plural). This issue is about ONE song (singular)and rightly so. I would seriously like to know how many "Liberation Songs" the ANC has in their repertoir of Struggle Songs? It seems there's only ONE. Why can't the ANCYL sing other struggle songs? Why does it always have to be this one? Please enlighten the readers of this forum.

      wjdladla - 2011-09-13 18:38

      Umbedo nenzondo yocalucalulo. Buka nalaba abakithi abampisholo abahambisana nembono yo bhasi. Kutheni nathi abantu abamnyama singazi buzi imbuzo eminengi, Kutheni singahlangani sibone ukuthi kudlalwa ngathi ezweni lethu. Kusetshenziswa inkundla zemitho kwazona okushaya khona imithetho ngabamhlophe. Kodwa sengathi kukhona abazoyikhotha imbenge ewomile.

  • chrisvan - 2011-09-13 07:17

    Shame...someone p...d on Mal-emma's parade. I still think he has great audacity saying half the sadly thought-out buncum he spits through the hole in his face. It is sad that there is even a reference made to Madiba. He is such a gentleman and awesome leader, that mentioning this numpy in the same sentence is sacreligeous. And why is the ANCYL so quiet? MMMMMH??

  • letsee - 2011-09-13 07:20

    Mandela is adored throughout the whole world for some reason and Malema probably can't read well enough to understand Mandela.

  • Susan - 2011-09-13 07:22

    In the song 'de la Rey' no nation is mentioned in a derogatory manner or inciteful manner as "Dubhula Ibhunu". There is no mention of shooting any particular race, as in this song. For Ms Duarte to say that if we ban this particular song, we are saying should we 'forget the holocaust', is extremely short-sighted. How would anyone like it if the persons responsible for the holocaust put up swastika flags all over the country - the holocaust was a racist act of murder perpetrated on a people, because they did not 'fit' the ideology of the ruling party! There are many other ways one can remember the struggle without singing songs whose words could incite people to violence.

      flummoxed - 2011-09-13 07:49

      Ms Duarte's problem is that she isn't a Patricia de Lille..

  • Sived - 2011-09-13 07:23

    The ANC leadership ought to show their authority and instruct their supporters to respect and adhere to the letter of the law.

      daaivark - 2011-09-13 07:30

      HA HA HA HA HA. Comedy time.

  • haroldrvjansen - 2011-09-13 07:29

    Please, nobody is trying to re-write any history. The fact is that it is HISTORY. Maybe we can all come together, all Africans - Black, white, yellow, brown, all colours - during a Cultural event and sing "Kill the boer" and "My Sarie Marais" and celebrate where we have come from, and hopefully renew where we are going. To sing any song in the manner that it was sung by Julius not only brings dishonour to the song, but also the history that he is trying to protect. We are all African's and there is a place for each one of us in this beautiful country.

      daaivark - 2011-09-13 07:35

      Well said. I fully support that view.

  • Nibiru - 2011-09-13 07:32

    How come if you call a certain section of the population Ks it is totally unacceptable but if you threaten to kill another section of the population it is sort of ok

  • Kev - 2011-09-13 07:41

    De La Rey is a song about the Boers fighting the British. These ignorant pricks try compare in to shoot the boer. If its a case of preserving history, then it applies to both sides. Apartheid was wrong but its still history so preserve the use of the "K" word and "boy" etc.

  • flummoxed - 2011-09-13 07:46

    Today's Presidential statement "There is a place for Malema within the ANC but he must learn to control his rhetoric." Ja, well, no, fine - so whose the naughty boy who'll be slapped on the wrist; grounded for a day or two and then allowed to go out and play with all the other little Anarchists.

  • Leon Groenewald - 2011-09-13 07:49

    Mandela approach vs. Malema... Oh please, Malema uses his mouth to insight violence, Mandela planted bombs and got a peace prize. As long as the whites die; the world is happy. We're sick of dying because of black savagery!

  • casskot - 2011-09-13 07:50

    The ANC spends to much time defending the screw-ups of its leadership and memebers in top positions instead focusing on ways and means to enhance and advance our countries economy and overall position globally.It has become clear that they don't have what it takes to meet the challenges ahead be it on the local and global front.Nation Building and patriotism rooting out corruption installing confidence amongst the shareholders of this Country is a start. C'mon ANC i protested for you guys during my schooling on equal education, got sjambokked by SB all for nothing man!!!You just don't care anymore stop causing racial divide and stop giving racial preference, stop this minority and majority crap think of SA as one nation serve with vision and purpose, strive to reach a common goal.

  • John - 2011-09-13 08:07

    Republic of the Western Cape here we come .. yes indeed . if the country is to be racist lets go all the way. free cape .. with passports required and no taxes to central gomment minimum education required for residence and voting .. whites coloreds indians moslems and blacks with education ok otherwise back to where you came from

      WHITERIGHT - 2011-09-13 08:22

      If only John....If only.

  • Lion King - 2011-09-13 08:13

    Is Julius getting ready far war or what? I see he is wearing his military hat.. is that for his youth war.. What is he trying to do.. SA wll never become like Zimbabwe

  • WHITERIGHT - 2011-09-13 08:20

    "It said the song was never directed at individual white South Africans, but rather at a class of land barons who "brutally exploited" black workers." By " brutally exploited " he means, provide the black workers with employment, accommodation & meals. If anyone is being exploited on farms, send the dept of labour out to investigate & force the exploiters to abide by the labour laws. Instead many, decent, law abiding white farmers are & have been murdered in the name of crime. Who knows what racial insults they suffered in their final moments. The black criminal has a almost hate filled urge to kill in this country. Singing stupid songs to stupid people, really does not make sense, unless one supports the killing of white farmers !

  • errol.wagner - 2011-09-13 08:25


  • Jynxd - 2011-09-13 08:29

    What surprises me is that the ANC is making claims about "rewriting history", has any one picked up a school history textbook? Much of the Afrikaans history has been left out - Van Riebek (spelling?) specifically... Again hypercritical of the ANC.

  • steve - 2011-09-13 09:10

    Ag! let them have their song and we will just call a spade a spade, let's not kid ourselves anymore there is no silver lining at the end of this story, let's concentrate on building the future of our real homeland the Western Cape.