News24

Shabangu tells MPs to shut up

2012-08-21 18:48

Johannesburg - The parliamentary debate on the Marikana shootings momentarily descended into a game of mudslinging between rival politicians in which Mining Minister Susan Shabangu snapped and told MPs to “shut up”.

The debate on Tuesday, which was initiated by ANC chief whip Mathole Motshekga, was meant to mark the death of at least 44 people and the injuries of many others following an industrial dispute at the Lonmin platinum mine in Marikana, near Rustenburg.

Shabangu hit back at Cope’s Mosioua Lekota who had effectively accused her of favouring the National Union of Mineworkers in her intervention in the dispute.

He accused Shabangu of leaving out the Association of Mineworkers and Construction Union (Amcu) despite its key role in the conflict.

Shabangu accused Lekota of unleashing the army on Khutsong residents during his tenure as defence minister when the township’s residence resisted the changes in the Gauteng/North West boundary.

Snapped

Shabangu defended her actions, saying she had not been aware of Amcu’s existence.

She was called to order by a fellow MP when she snapped and ordered opposition MPs to “shut up” when they laughed or murmured in response to her remarks.

“The difference between us and all of you is that we don’t engage [in mediation] publicly,’’ she told the House.

Lekota denied the Khutsong claim and said that whatever he did at the time was in his capacity as an ANC minister.

An MP objected to Shabangu’s remarks and parliamentary Speaker Max Sisulu said he would make a ruling on the issue.

DA spokesperson on police issues Dianne Kohler Barnard called for Police Minister Nathi Mthethwa’s resignation, describing him as an “empty suit”.

Otherwise the mood remained sombre.

Motshekga said the use of violence demeaned people’s humanity.

Cool heads

“In this period of national mourning, we need to be able to call for cool heads, for calm and rational dialogue to prevail and to commit to ensuring that we never witness another Marikana tragedy again,” he said.

DA parliamentary leader Lindiwe Mazibuko called for the resignation of the leaders of the unions and the management of Lonmin.

She also said the commission of inquiry, announced by President Jacob Zuma, should not to be reduced to an internal inquiry.

“Although the searing images of this tragedy will remind us of Sharpeville and Boipatong, let us not forget South Africa today is a different country,” she said.

“The rule of law must be allowed to take its course unhindered.”

United Democratic Movement leader Bantu Holomisa slammed the tactics police used to disperse the striking workers.

“Sadly ... Marikana massacre-type incidents are here to stay, unless we do away with the deployment of people with no professional police background to senior SAPS levels to command juniors with military training,” he said.

African Christian Democratic Party leader Kenneth Meshoe wanted to know why live ammunition was used despite an order “by way of a memorandum in December last year [for police] not to shoot at protesters with live ammunition”.

Mthethwa told Parliament that memorial services for the dead would be held all over the country on Thursday.

Comments
  • Motho - 2012-08-21 18:55

    Unfortunately, politicians are at each others' throats instead of provide leadership that will assist in finding "durable" solutions.

      charlesdumbwin.dumbwin - 2012-08-21 18:59

      Within the ANC, you will find NO such leadership...

      lacrimose.wolf - 2012-08-21 19:10

      These are the problem solving skills we're all supposed to follow? Eish. Ms Shabangu et al must explain why no-one did anything after the 1st 10 died.

      squeegee.pilot - 2012-08-21 19:18

      Will parliament discuss the three murdered orphans in Zimpopo?

      christelle.james.7 - 2012-08-21 19:21

      It is a power struggle. Nothing more nothing less. All about the person, not about the people. So much for power to the people!

      chaplinncharlie - 2012-08-21 19:30

      I believe it is "Sharrup" and not "Shut up"... To believe they use such language in Parliament. Makes one Think doesn't it....

      alf.pop - 2012-08-21 20:09

      Why was she not kicked out of the house? The speaker applying double standards here - that is South African Democracy!

      atholl.canterbury - 2012-08-21 20:11

      motho ... politicians always see the trees ... they never see the wood. It seems as if the critical components here are: Roleplayers: . [Mine Management] - Labour - Union(s) Issues : . Remuneration - Representation [union power] - Negotiation (procedure) Spectators: . Police - Sangoma - Muthi Critical Point : . Union Power/Control for Representation - ['Law' of 50% +1] Is the issue here not a battle for [union power] to obtain [50%] to influence [Mine Management] ---- at all cost. Why don't the politicians (and Mine Management) focus on the [50%] rule? A 'New' 30% or 40% rule for the 'power to negotiate' would: . eliminate (lessen) the need for labour control [union power]. . strengthen the Mine Management Negotiating leverage. . create more labour stability and union competition to improve their bargaining skills. It's too late for - who shot first - which muthi was used - who unleashed the army - who mediates .

      lownabester - 2012-08-21 20:15

      She has no manners. And cannot even handle her own department. Wonder what her CV looks like??

      helio.paulo.7 - 2012-08-21 21:28

      So true, and unfortunately for the DA..Diane Kohler Barnard has put her fliipping oversize foot in her mouth again, she is a big liability for the DA and should be shown the door

  • charlesdumbwin.dumbwin - 2012-08-21 18:59

    Eish, tula wena!

      chaplinncharlie - 2012-08-21 19:34

      Charles to think what will happen when they nationalise the mines. All the investors pull out and the fat cats get fatter and fatter. I wonder how they going to justify the LOW pay then? They will spin them some other BS story that it's because of appartheid that we are where we are... Makes one wonder...

      eddy.deepfield - 2012-08-21 20:06

      Voters who support the ANC do so by faith. Faith is required in the absence of evidence. They believe ridiculous promises from ANC politicians and Unions. There are so many suckers in South Africa we lead the world in the production of suckers.

      tw2066 - 2012-08-21 20:18

      Eddy, I am sure you are probably right about ANC voters, however my theory goes they vote ANC through sheer stupidity....

      kevin.watson.7906 - 2012-08-21 20:34

      Chaplincharlie, the fat cats will only get fatter for a short while and then the mines will start closing, just as it happened in Zambia.

  • sharon.erwin.96 - 2012-08-21 19:02

    “The difference between us and all of you is that we don’t engage [in mediation] publicly" Translation: We are the ANC and we are too important to speak to peasants.

      marc.vantubbergh - 2012-08-21 19:08

      yip that's why they are known as the Arrogant Nepotistic Corruptibles....

      Desilusionada - 2012-08-21 19:13

      Yeah, And when we "engage" in public like parliament, then we tell others to 'shut up" Now after all this engaging BS, and wasting of time, as all that was said did not bring any new insights, what was achieved? The downfall of the ANC? The Minister(s) resigning? The money today paid to them all for sitting on their mostly fat behinds, could collectively have paid for the funerals of all those killed...

      lacrimose.wolf - 2012-08-21 19:23

      We don't engage in mediation at all. We stay safely tucked away in Blomefontein deporting illegal miners and leave it up to the local police to sort out

  • jeremy.forbes.1293 - 2012-08-21 19:03

    Empty vessels make the most noise.

      marc.vantubbergh - 2012-08-21 19:09

      and is a lot of noise not called a SHABANGU!?

  • ad.madock - 2012-08-21 19:05

    Next time union leaders must march infront and not hide away. Zwelinzima Vavi and Tony ehrenreich should set examples and not let their members take the bullet for them.

      ant.duke - 2012-08-21 20:38

      Oh yeah...! Erenreich in front...

      neville.chamberlain.509 - 2012-08-21 21:18

      Tony Ehrenreich in front???? You must be joking!!!! The only thing he is in front of is cheap shots at opposition parties and plundering Textile workers pension funds

      ad.madock - 2012-08-21 21:47

      Ya!..I bet Tony is right in front in the bicycle lanes in Blouberg this summer. Its all he complain about.

  • Armand - 2012-08-21 19:08

    n Benoude kat maak benoude spronge! The ANC is in a corner :)

  • wendy.schneider3 - 2012-08-21 19:09

    moer mekaar!

      lownabester - 2012-08-21 20:18

      Sê ek ook.

  • larry.piggott1 - 2012-08-21 19:12

    Typical ANC arrogance. Unspeakable untouchables.

  • phillip.cwazibe - 2012-08-21 19:12

    “by way of a memorandum in December last year [for police] not to shoot at protesters with live ammunition”. Did the memo advise on how to deal with armed and confrontational strikers?

      ad.madock - 2012-08-21 19:17

      Exactly. If you come @ me with a panga or a spear do you think im gonna shoot you with a rubber bullet?

      tw2066 - 2012-08-21 20:45

      JZ comes alot with a spear...

  • crracker.crackerr - 2012-08-21 19:13

    Those same politicians may just regret their criticism of the police. They are the ones who will need the protection of the police the most. As for the DA? You lost my support although just one little vote. But that's it. I watched your parliamentary leader on TV a minute or so ago. She should next time go out and show us how to regulate and contain a similar situation. Her big mouth at least seems commensurate with the rest of her appearance. So that's at least one point in her favour that will remain unchallenged.

      neville.chamberlain.509 - 2012-08-21 21:19

      Which queen B would that be - the Dutchman with the double barrel surname or the coconut?

  • phillip.cwazibe - 2012-08-21 19:13

    “by way of a memorandum in December last year [for police] not to shoot at protesters with live ammunition”.Did the memo advise on how to deal with armed and confrontational strikers?

  • nigel.vanysendyk - 2012-08-21 19:18

    sooo, all our politicians "leaders" are shouting at each other, this is the last thing we need. MAN THE F**K UP AND START LEADING !!!!!!!

      jim.binnie.1 - 2012-08-21 20:33

      No Chance with the current idiots in power

  • maseratifittipaldi - 2012-08-21 19:28

    Shabangu defended her actions, saying she had not been aware of Amcu’s existence. Our Minister of Mining said this? Where was she?

      jim.binnie.1 - 2012-08-21 20:34

      How about on MARS?? - or is that too close to reality??

      kevin.watson.7906 - 2012-08-21 20:35

      Misusing her govt credit card jaunting around the world.

  • Thapelo Mashego - 2012-08-21 19:29

    izt abt ANC and other parties or do we want a solution?they shud for a moment put them selves on to the police's shoes.our MPs r all just jokes

      tw2066 - 2012-08-21 20:47

      r u abl 2 rt thz n antha lawidj?

  • PETESKEAT - 2012-08-21 19:35

    I would rather the nation mourn 34 armed with intent miners than more members of the police. Those police members deserve the support of government and citizenry. The unbridled indiscipline of the strikers and the competing unions is what led to this tragic point.

      george.viljoen - 2012-08-21 19:53

      Thanks for your comment. Nobody mentions the two policemen that were hacked to death !!!

  • JackTrend - 2012-08-21 19:38

    goodness they are dumb

      Danny Hlakong - 2012-08-21 20:05

      i dont say the police are wrong or right,now the important thing is to deal whith the solution of the conflict & other thing i read the comment of white guys they are happy......

      roger.wardsmith - 2012-08-21 20:23

      Yep - It's frightening !! What a waste of Tax Payers hard earned money

      crracker.crackerr - 2012-08-21 21:03

      @ Danny Hlakong This is not about white guys being happy. It is instead about the clear evidence on video of what the police (majority by far being black, you little racist rubbish!) was exposed to. Now the politicians (once again the majority by far being black, you little racist rubbish!) are trying to capitalize by blaming the police. Like your are trying to do, your little racist rubbish.

  • johnnie.vercuil - 2012-08-21 19:47

    What does she do in Parliament if she does not even have manners.

  • Kwajo.m - 2012-08-21 19:52

    Shabangu defended her actions, saying she had not been aware of Amcu’s existence. Who is here advisors?

  • pierre.joubert.338 - 2012-08-21 20:01

    'Motshekga said the use of violence demeaned people’s humanity.' 'African Christian Democratic Party leader Kenneth Meshoe wanted to know why live ammunition' HELLO!!! Am I missing something here??? Didn't those 'strikers all wield pangas, spears and fire arms?? What were they intending to do with them??? You want to kill, expect to be killed.

      ceba.mlandu - 2012-08-22 11:39

      I also don't get it. Were the miners gonna run up to the police, blades and spades in hand, suddenly stop in front of them and say \we're just playing mates. We're not really gonna hack you to death. Those 10 okes we did kill were just a joke\. It's easy for these backseat leaders, with their bodyguards to talk rubbish.

      ceba.mlandu - 2012-08-22 11:40

      I also don't get it. Were the miners gonna run up to the police, blades and spades in hand, suddenly stop in front of them and say \we're just playing mates. We're not really gonna hack you to death. Those 10 okes we did kill were just a joke\. It's easy for these backseat leaders, with their bodyguards to talk rubbish.

  • netswera.livhuwani - 2012-08-21 20:05

    The leadership of the ANC is very questionable, these woman ministers are not qualified to lead the country in this level. First was Engie and her childish response that she doesn’t deliver books to school,now this Shabangu bit......telling MPs to shut up what is this?are we a bunch of clowns in a zoo parliament? If the head of the house is weak the there is chaos in the house,the oldmen must go,Zuma must resign before the total irreversible damage is done.

      isabel.w.stokes - 2012-08-21 20:14

      Why is this a problem because she's a woman? I've heard of more idiotic statements from men over the years. "We will kill for Zuma" "God is on the side of the ANC" "The ANC will rule till Jesus comes". These are some of the many moronic statements made by men. I could go on and on. Yes, she was out of line, but not because she was a woman. You are completely sexist. The only sensible thing you said was that JZ must go. Keep your hatred of women to yourself - it only shows you up as a backward-thinking chauvinist.

      kevin.watson.7906 - 2012-08-21 20:40

      Isabel you are quite right. Your views are tempered by the fact that in your heritage women are no longer treated as property or as children. If you read African Traditional law it is significantly at odds with the Constitution and your viewpoint. Shabangu's problem is not that she is female but that she is an stupid, incompetent bootlicker.

      tw2066 - 2012-08-21 20:50

      Ha ha - Netswera the men are worse!! Kevin has got it 100% correct about Susan Sheebangoo, and isabel has it 100% correst about you - you f4rt.

  • kevin.pitzer - 2012-08-21 20:18

    Well done Minister but hopefully this was not about frustration of becoming a failed state and exposure of all that is real.

  • thobejane.thabo - 2012-08-21 20:26

    they even forgot the agenda

  • joe.peters.56 - 2012-08-21 20:28

    Vote DA

      crracker.crackerr - 2012-08-21 21:06

      No longer.

  • ant.duke - 2012-08-21 20:34

    How disgusting that there's a funeral ad attached to this piece.

  • sifiso.msimango - 2012-08-21 20:45

    well done Suzan!!

      tw2066 - 2012-08-21 20:50

      ?

  • pieterev - 2012-08-22 05:04

    I have been following all the comments relating to this article, and you know what I realised. Statement 1. It is a fact that we as South Africans are quick to slate everybody, from our fellow comment writers, the miners, the police, unions, politicians and even God. Statement 2. It is a fact that we currently have (ill experienced)leaders and committees. However, why do we not stop being led by the noses and stand up. Let us start doing something about this. come with good workable suggestions, rather we help the poor strugglers, show then how it must be done. Action speaks louder than words. Really, people we NEED to have a mind shift change. This country of ours is going to the dogs. Let US (mr and mrs citizen) start by changing this.

  • sibonelo.hlatshwayo - 2012-08-22 08:47

    Ha ha ha that was very rude of her.. she must control her language next time. i wonder if she talkes to her children in that manner...

  • george.mokoena1 - 2012-08-22 09:25

    our government is a joke

  • ceba.mlandu - 2012-08-22 11:32

    I don't get this stupid idea of not using proper lead at protests. If I'm a pig and I'm called to control a riot where the rioters have machetes, pick axes, axes, spade, sickles and real guns with real bullets, I think I'd like a rifle with lots of bullets. The bigger the bullets the better. Rubber bullets my arse

  • ceba.mlandu - 2012-08-22 11:32

    I don't get this stupid idea of not using proper lead at protests. If I'm a pig and I'm called to control a riot where the rioters have machetes, pick axes, axes, spade, sickles and real guns with real bullets, I think I'd like a rifle with lots of bullets. The bigger the bullets the better. Rubber bullets my arse

  • ro.jhb.1 - 2012-08-22 17:37

    What a bunch of idiotic leeches - parasites of the worst order. If only they could be lined up against a wall and put us out of our misery

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