ACDP 'jumping gun' on holidays

2012-11-12 22:06

Johannesburg - The commission for the protection and promotion of cultural, religious and linguistic communities accused the ACDP on Monday of jumping the gun on Christian holidays.

CRL head Wesley Mabuza said the commission was merely calling for other religious groups to also be accommodated or integrated.

"Our mandate is to protect the cultures and religions of all communities. If we called for the removal of the Christian holidays, we would be failing to protect the Christian religion," said Mabuza who is a Methodist Church pastor.

Members of the African Christian Democratic Party protested in Johannesburg on Saturday, and said the CRL should "keep its hands off Christmas and Good Friday".

They said they had heard that the commission was exploring the idea of asking the government to scrap the two religious holidays from the national calendar.

They handed a memorandum of understanding to Home Affairs Minister Naledi Pandor in which they said the removal of the holidays would be discriminatory, as 79.5% of South Africa's population was Christian.

Mabuza said the commission was aware that there were already too many holidays in the calendar..

"Tomorrow [Tuesday] is Diwali. Hindu people looking to celebrate the holiday will have to put in leave. We are saying for equality sake, can they not be given a day off instead of having to take it from their leave days," said Mabuza.

The Hindu holiday is marked by the setting off of fireworks to symbolise the victory of good over evil, and follows a month-long fast.

"How do we also make them feel at home in this country?" asked Mabuza.

He called on ACDP leader Kenneth Meshoe to join the CRL in its call.

"[He] is in Parliament. He has the platform to rectify this and ask them to rectify this [inequality] and accommodate everyone," Mabuza said.

Pandor told the ACDP protesters she had not yet received a report on the matter from the CRL.

Mabuza said a report was being compiled and that it would probably be completed by the end of January.

  • jackie.stone.501 - 2012-11-12 22:16

    What about 2 days for Rastafarian? or two days for non-believers?

      mark.a.fysh - 2012-11-12 22:48

      Yes and one for the loons that populate "The commission for the protection and promotion of cultural, religious and linguistic communities" Sheesh, I wonder what their letterhead looks like.

      aniken.vader.31 - 2012-11-13 00:06

      anc - for the love of God, Allah, Budha, Chrisna, etc, etc....... ARE THERE NO OTHER ISSUES THAT RE MORE PRESSING TO THE POOR, THE CRIME STATS, THE CORRUPTION, THE EDUCATION, THE ECONOMY, THE OPEN TOILETS, ETC ETC ETC...! wow... they have NOTHING BETTER to do other than finding issues that cause more hate between the sa population????? There IS a saying - let sleeping dogs lie! Do not try to stirr the pott that should not be stired - the religious issues are the LEAST that should concern you bloddy devils....

      tw2066 - 2012-11-13 05:52

      gee Eddy - looking at your profile you are somewhat obsessed with religion yourself, albeit disagreeing with anything status quo. And whats with all the articles you have written? Either you are trying to force your point of view or are looking for something? Either way, that religious obsession makes you more religious than most.

      Montagnes.Bleues - 2012-11-13 06:16

      Halala..... In the beginning

      Alien42063 - 2012-11-13 06:19

      IF this really is a problem I got a simple solution. There are so many religions you can't give everyone off on all the days. Each Person should get 3 or 4 Public holiday\Cultural Holiday tokens they can use throughout the year. Over Diwali, Xmas or whenever your religion or culture dictates etc. Problem solved.

      eddy.deepfield - 2012-11-13 06:29

      South Africa is a secular state, therefore there should be NO official religious holidays. Christians, Jews, Hindus and Muslims can celebrate their own holy days on their own. Christians can apply for leave and indulge there own imbecility, just like the other superstitious people have to do.

      ralph.thornley - 2012-11-13 07:06

      Atheists already have a special day. 1st April!! The fool has said in his heart their is no God-----.

      junebugg.kinte - 2012-11-13 12:50

      Since this is a democratic country , how about we let let the public vote on this matter?

      paul.bester1 - 2012-11-13 16:08

      @Ralph Hey there Ralphie, judging by your comment I'm assuming you're religious. Nice example you're setting for your kind...

  • bosveld.reaper - 2012-11-12 22:16

    How can the ANC rule to Jesus comes if they do not believe?

      eddy.deepfield - 2012-11-13 05:22

      Believe in what? That the world is six thousand years old and was created by Jesus himself? Are you still at school? Christianity is a religion based on fear of hell and salvation from it by atonement. What loving person let alone God would send anyone there?

      fredster.mania.5 - 2012-11-13 07:24 sound like a broken record again. Focus on the subject and stop slandering God's name

      ianingwe - 2012-11-13 08:24

      Fred which god are you referring to?

  • debduplessis - 2012-11-12 22:18

    Loose the political public holidays & incorporate all religious holidays ... there will be more even spread throughout the year ;)

      debduplessis - 2012-11-13 09:33

      atheitis... we not talking about the mythological legend gods... just the religious ones ;)

  • bosveld.reaper - 2012-11-12 22:24

    How about if you are Hindu you work over christmas?if y

      KReddy - 2012-11-12 23:22

      I wouldn't mind actually.

      eddy.deepfield - 2012-11-13 05:24

      How about dumping superstition all together?

      KReddy - 2012-11-13 08:56

      @eddy, if you are making that comment at me, how about you f.uck of you non entity in my life. You just a sad comment here.

      eddy.deepfield - 2012-11-13 09:11

      Kreddy - not at you but bosveld, but thank you for your comment it makes me want to convert to Hinduism. Your guru will be proud of you and when you reincarnate you will be much better person.

  • andrea.duplessis.33 - 2012-11-12 22:34

    How about adding 4 more days to the minimum 15 leave days per year, and removing religious public holidays, then u put in leave for the religious holiday of your choice. 4 days will cover the Christian Christmas and Easter, and most other religions' holidays?

      wayne.strydom - 2012-11-13 05:52

      I agree with this one. I think the Americans do the same thing. You have so many days leave and you use them on the religious holidays, or otherwise, of your choice.

  • tumisang.kolobe - 2012-11-12 22:35

    South Africa is 80% Christian and in a democratic state, majority rules, if people wish to celebrate Diwani or whatwhat they are welcome to relocate to a country that offers such holidays,here we live amongts Christians, if you want rastafarian then go to Jamaica.....

      KReddy - 2012-11-12 23:27

      And in a democratic state, majority rules? Contradict much? So now the minorit groups must be totally ignored. It does not work like that in a multi racial, multi ethnic democrcay. The CRL is looking into the matter and the outcome may well be adjustments made to the leave credits of organizations, no cancellation of christmas and good friday, that will never happen in sa as u rightly gave figures of the Christian numbers in SA. If you are brainless, go to the toilet........

      rodney.bevan.58 - 2012-11-12 23:34

      KReddy, go to any middle eastern country and see how much voice the minority have, in fact see how much voice the population in general has. Yes, SA is multi cultural, as is Britain, America, Canada, OZ etc. guaranteed they will listen to the minorities as well as the majority, but guess which voices will sway the vote.

      KReddy - 2012-11-12 23:39

      I don't prescribe to the violence of the Middle East and why is there even a comparison with them? It does not apply here. Are you getting worked up because of the unbalanced state of mind the ANC is in lately and that xmas will get deleted from public holidays? I am aware that the majority choice will win as should it be in a democracy. But, I would prefer if I could take a day of from work, outside of my annual leave days for religious purposes. If not, then I will do what I've been doing all along.

      eddy.deepfield - 2012-11-13 05:31

      South Africa is a secular state not a Christian state like the Papal state in Rome. Only "born again relationship with Jesus" people are real Christians. Most so called Christians have been contaminated by ancestral worship and tradition. Rather become an atheist, no holidays to observe or hell or fake doctrines to fear, much simpler. Science will set you free.

      tw2066 - 2012-11-13 05:55

      Eddy, I see that only the Christian God is an issue in your writings. Budda and Allah no problem. Maybe you should read Al Qaran. Or, what about Scientology, yes theres a good book to pick on too.

      fredster.mania.5 - 2012-11-13 07:25

      Hear Hear!!!

      KReddy - 2012-11-13 08:59

      Why must atheists try to convince ppl that believe in their Gods? Are they holding you back from something, impinging your life in some way? As you believe in nothing and presumably \science\ then science is your \God\.

      paul.bester1 - 2012-11-13 16:16

      Do you want to know why people all over the world have such a problem with christians?? It's because it's the only religion that wants to force it's beliefs down your throat. No other religion has as much propaganda as christianity. Have you christians actually looked at your religion properly? Have you seen how much of your beliefs are actually just copied from other ancient religions? Do yourselves a favour and do a bit of research into your beliefs...oh wait, sorry, sheep don't question, they just follow.

  • judith.taylor.56 - 2012-11-12 22:39

    I suggest that everyone has the right to take leave for their cultural or religious holidays. No such holidays should be part of the national holiday structure. This would mean we are all equal and atheists score as their days off are really for relaxation

      rodney.bevan.58 - 2012-11-12 22:56

      This is a christian country based on christian beliefs and morals, that's why 80% of the population is of a christian based faith. To try and please 20% of the population you discriminate against the 80%? Seriously, only trouble will come of this. Before anyone bleats on about the land issue, please note, the government owns most of the land, why not ask them to give/sell land to those who want it instead of affecting profitable farmland which feeds the population.

      KReddy - 2012-11-12 23:32

      @Rodney, according to ur argument why should sa accomodate few over so many? Then tell me , why must the state use its many (land) to accomodate a few (the profitable farms)??? Your rationale is lopsided and makes no sense. Its like verse versa so ur argument is full of c.r.ap.

      fredster.mania.5 - 2012-11-13 07:34

      atheist...We unfortunately have Christians that focus on religion and not relationship. Sad to say that they profess to be Christians but do not practice what they preach. On the flip side, can you imagine if they Christians stop praying for this country, in what mess it would be? Can you also imagine if Christians voted for a Christian party to be in charge, what blessings we would receive? But no...they all want to be their own gods

      adriaan.mostert - 2012-11-13 08:20

      @Fredster69: You are joking right? How many people have prayed for your impotent god to heal an amputee's leg? And nothing happened? He is not even powerful enough to do that and you want him to fix this country? Halve of this countries problems are that people pray (which means nothing) instead to get off their knees and do something about it.

      ianingwe - 2012-11-13 08:37

      There is a strong social stigma attached to those who do not ascribe to one of the major religions. In the census before the last one people were asked about their beliefs and most listed their childhood indoctrination irrespective of their current status. The numbers of practicing members of the different religions is unknown and very likely is much lower than the 80% stated for christianity.

      ianingwe - 2012-11-13 08:41

      Rodney officially the country is secular. In reality the two christian holidays are detritus left over from the days of NP and reformed church domination and should be consigned to the rubbish heap of reconciliation and progress! ;-)

  • kwenzekile.madiba - 2012-11-12 23:28

    I agre with ACDP ascenssion day was scrapped so we should be vigilant on Christmas and Good Friday less we are caught napping

  • eddy.deepfield - 2012-11-13 00:04

    Who cares, God is dead. If you think not, where is he?

      Maverick82 - 2012-11-13 05:13

      Hhhm dude, Jesus is the one that was a human like u and I and then was nailed to the cross and died....

      eddy.deepfield - 2012-11-13 05:37

      And Maverick you know this because? You were there? No? You heard it in Church or read it in the Bible? And you believe this superstition? Where is Jesus now? Where is hell? Where is heaven? Where is Paul? etc. Was the world created by Jesus six thousand years ago as the Bible tells us so?

      tw2066 - 2012-11-13 05:56

      Still picking on the Christians Eddy. Must watch out, the Muslims not so nice. Bad mouth Allah Allah both mighty and merciful, and these dudes will stick a letter bomb in your home...

      wayne.strydom - 2012-11-13 05:59

      Eddy, I bet you have an understanding of the writings of Aristotle and others, and some of the other people who "existed" many years ago? And you are probably inclined to believe him. What about Napoleon? I think he is a myth too. I can't see him, have never met him. Aah, then there's Charles Darwin, the manufacturer of evolution THEORY which so many believe more than anything else. The same theory that drove maniacs like hitler to exterminate millions because natural selection had not eradicated them quickly enough... Never seen him, never existed.

      eddy.deepfield - 2012-11-13 07:06

      Wayne - The following is a list of writers who lived and wrote during the time, or within a century after the time, that Christ is said to have lived and performed his wonderful works:Josephus, Philo-Judaeus, Seneca, Pliny the Elder, Suetonius, Juvenal, Martial, Persius, Plutarch, Justus of Tiberius, Apollonius, Pliny the Younger, Tacitus, Quintilian, Lucanus, Epictetus, Silius Italicus, Statius, Ptolemy, Hermogones, Valerius Maximus, Arrian, Petronius, Dion Pruseus, Paterculus, Appian, Theon of Smyrna, Phlegon, Pompon Mela, Quintius Curtius, Lucian, Pausanias, Valerius Flaccus, Florus Lucius, Favorinus, Phaedrus, Damis, Aulus Gellius, Columella, Dio Chrysostom, Lysias, Appion of Alexandria. Enough of the writings of the authors named in the foregoing list remains to form a library. Yet in this mass of Jewish and Pagan literature, aside from two forged passages in the works of a Jewish author, and two disputed passages in the works of Roman writers, there is to be found no mention of Jesus Christ.

      eddy.deepfield - 2012-11-13 07:08

      contd - Philo was born before the beginning of the Christian era, and lived until long after the reputed death of Christ. He wrote an account of the Jews covering the entire time that Christ is said to have existed on earth. He was living in or near Jerusalem when Christ's miraculous birth and the Herodian massacre occurred. He was there when Christ made his triumphal entry into Jerusalem. He was there when the crucifixion with its attendant earthquake, supernatural darkness, and resurrection of the dead took place -- when Christ himself rose from the dead, and in the presence of many witnesses ascended into heaven. These marvelous events which must have filled the world with amazement, had they really occurred, were unknown to him. It was Philo who developed the doctrine of the Logos, or Word, and although this Word incarnate dwelt in that very land and in the presence of multitudes revealed himself and demonstrated his divine powers, Philo saw it not. From "The Christ" -- John E. Remsberg

  • moses.govender.7 - 2012-11-13 00:20

    So what about atheists or even satanists? They should be allowed to have days off as well! If others get religious days off then those who dont practicw any organised or socially accepted religions cant be discriminated against too! And how do we limit the number of days off that one can take? Surely you cant use the number of christian holidays as a guidline! Some religions have 5 important days!!! The whole thing is a joke.

  • Jacques - 2012-11-13 03:11

    Surely the way forward is, say, 3 days leave a year in your contract for 'religeous holidays'. That way, if 80% of people are christian, the status quo is upheld. If not, people can celebrate diwali, hannukah, their birthdays, the cricket or whatever it is they deem appropriate. No mobs of religeous crusaders, also no crippled economy...

      hilda.macarthur - 2012-11-13 06:01

      This is really the only way they can accommodate everyone.

      vernon.samuel.7 - 2012-11-13 06:57

      Jacques, you are already creating militant factions in the religion of cricket. If you are only giving 3 days off, you are catering for only those of the 20/20 and 50-over denominations. Those of the 5-day test faith will be severely prejudiced. I see future holy wars in the cricket religion and you being labelled a false prophet.

      Jacques - 2012-11-13 11:39

      I guess that wolf-character in Pinocchio never got the credit he deserved for his words, which turns out to be prophecy: '...everyday is a holiday...'.

  • vik.vm - 2012-11-13 03:13

    it was a very popular pagan holiday - Brumalia (at the end of Saturnalia), chosen by the church to be "a birthday of Christ" ...because of it popularity: _ In the fourth century, church officials decided to institute the birth of Jesus as a holiday. Unfortunately, the Bible does not mention date for his birth (a fact Puritans later pointed out in order to deny the legitimacy of the celebration). Although some evidence suggests that his birth may have occurred in the spring (why would shepherds be herding in the middle of winter?), Pope Julius I chose December 25. It is commonly believed that the church chose this date in an effort to adopt and absorb the traditions of the pagan Saturnalia festival_ PLEASE MAKE THE HALLOWEEN a public holiday too !!! It is more fun and ...cheaper too

  • tshepisot - 2012-11-13 04:31

    As an atheist I also want two days off to celebrate not having an imaginary friend. RSA is not a Christian state, if it was Desmond Tutu would be owning that compound in KZN and people like me would be dead killed for not being delutional.

      Maverick82 - 2012-11-13 05:06

      Why don't u just take all 365 days off

      eddy.deepfield - 2012-11-13 05:42

      Maverick - Why don't you reveal your Christ love and pray for him?

  • Malefane - 2012-11-13 05:32

    Who is Mabuza? Stop causing confussion? South Africa has majority as christians. What is your problem?

  • Alien42063 - 2012-11-13 06:19

    IF this really is a problem I got a simple solution. There are so many religions you can't give everyone off on all the days. Each Person should get 3 or 4 Public holiday\Cultural Holiday tokens they can use throughout the year. Over Diwali, Xmas or whenever your religion or culture dictates etc. Problem solved.

  • Jaco Grobler - 2012-11-13 06:38

    I have to agree with some of the less populour opinions here, most of the 80 percent of christian citizens counted in the census, do not have a clue, or find it very hard to serve God as they should (including me). This country would be in a terrific state if 80% of us lived our lives strictly (or as best humanly possible) by the ways of the Bible. As for my take on the review of public holidays , take it and keep it, my God lives in me and around me and I certainly do not need a overly commercialized holiday to remind me of this, or celebrate his glory.

  • tshepisot - 2012-11-13 06:44

    Maverick82 not long ago non-believers were being killed by people like you. The advent of free speech allows us to acknowledge your beliefs but I reserve the right to say you r freaking talking ish having a god. Anyway I took 365 days off listening to your delusional crap

  • barend.steyn.9 - 2012-11-13 06:54

    Another indication that the people of the devil are at work in South Africa. God have mercy on their souls.

  • tshepisot - 2012-11-13 07:00

    Have you read Deuteronomy? If we had to live by "the ways of the Bible" ,I'd still be a slave. Women would be oppressed, gays killed for the sexual preference e.t.c read it you'll get what I'm saying

  • ralph.thornley - 2012-11-13 07:07

    Commerce will never allow the the demise of Christmas or Easter. All other holidays are of no commercial value.

      ianingwe - 2012-11-13 08:53

      so why are the religiots making such a fuss? Too much of the bonus being spent on the commercial and not enough as tithes and donations towards the good life for the preacher?

  • barend.steyn.9 - 2012-11-13 07:13

    Another indication that the devil's people are at work in South Africa. God have mercy on their souls.

      eddy.deepfield - 2012-11-13 07:27

      You mean the same devil that told Hansie to match fix and Ministers of Christ to commit adultery, molest children, waste millions on luxury cars, mansions and jets?

  • marilyn.docherty.9 - 2012-11-13 07:31

    Soon we will be celebrating Chinese holidays!!!!

  • Kwajo.m - 2012-11-13 07:37

    The devil has landed and only got 39 days to unleash. December 21, 2012. Watch the space, you heard it first from Kwajo.

  • Litha Thando Yono Ka-Zola - 2012-11-13 07:39

    Self righteous Christians. Get used to the fact that when your Life switch get's flicked off.Mr Maggot gets hold of you. That's the only after death experience that's awaits you

  • charmaine.mcdonald2 - 2012-11-13 07:48

    Some great comments below on this issue. "There is Only One God, and His Standard Religion is The same from generation to generation, Humans Beings, if you believe in The Supreme Creator, then do not dispute, but Worship God, unseen, and believe that Jesus Christ will come again as Promised." I do not believe that the Holy Bible is a Lie, the 10 commandments are for all Human Beings. "Love Thy Neighbor" even if they worship idols and demons. That is their choice. Too many man made religions in this world.

  • Asdiedamwalbars - 2012-11-13 07:52

    Nothing wrong that the ACDP jumping the gun. Why do the commission concentrate to demolish religion ..than rather tackle all this abuse of taxpayers money and well as school books on time, safety in the country, medical care, all services, roads, clean water and housing.

  • Gilbert Madondo - 2012-11-13 08:05

    Jesus said the gates of hell will not prevail over His Church,let them curse,jump and shout they will not move us we are here to stay. For centuries kings and governments sought to destroy Christianity but to their surprise it grew stronger and faster under persecution. As we speak the Church is growing faster than anywhere else in the communist republic of China,the power of my God!!!! I LOVE HIM. He fights His battles and He has never lost not one.

  • willem.louw.16 - 2012-11-13 08:29

    I live in Germany and we also have quite a large base of foreigners with different religions. We don't celebrate other cultures' holidays and we certainly don't curb Christian holidays because other people feel neglected. If you try an please everyone you will end up upsetting everyone... Traditionally a country has a primary religion not many, If you want to have Hindu, Muslim etc public holidays, move to one of those countries!

  • tshepisot - 2012-11-13 08:56

    If there are 80% Christians in RSA why isn't ACDP the ruling party? Tell me.... maybe that's because you also doubt the superstition they claim to stand for. Critical thinking, reason and logic shall prevail,that's the only trinity

  • Silas Hlahla - 2012-11-13 09:18

    everyday is Christmas to me!

  • matshidiso.rantai - 2012-11-13 09:36

    May be they should take away Human rights day, Women's day & Heritage day. Nobody attend those activities anyway.

  • Jade-Mach - 2012-11-14 01:03

    Whether Christmas gets banned,that shouldn't stop Christians from celebrating it the same way other cultures celebrate theirs. Christians are only making noise because they just need an excuse not to go to work and sit at home! The honest truth is there are many cultures and religions all over the world,so its rather ingenious for one religion to want to dominate everything. Our constitution recognises the different cultures and religious groups,therefore they all deserve the same treatment n its its very simple; no oe gets a holiday. Practice your own religion and culture during your own time.\r\n\r\nWhat's more fascinating is that as South Africans and Africans we seem to be promoting and embracing foreign cultures and religions while we forget about our own. We practice things we dnt undrstand just because of our so called faith! \r\n\r\nIf you want to give special treatment to one group,then you are going to have to afford all the other groups the same privileges.

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