Cele does not recall 'shoot to kill'

2012-02-06 11:37

Johannesburg - Suspended national police commissioner Bheki Cele has told the South Gauteng High Court he cannot remember telling police officers to "shoot to kill", The Sowetan reported on Monday.

"I do remember ordering the police to use deadly force when under attack," he said in court on Friday. He is suing The Sowetan for defamation.

The case continues on Monday.

Cele said he did not take issue with cartoon depictions of himself carrying firearms, but was concerned about a photograph the newspaper digitally manipulated to appear as if he was holding a firearm.

"If it were an exact picture I would not have complained," Cele said.

The newspaper's articles about him were also unbalanced, he said.

He claimed the image, which was published on July 7 and July 18, 2007, "damages my campaign".

Cele said if the newspaper had told him it had been manipulated, he would have been satisfied with an apology. He voiced concerns that the picture could be used by cyber criminals.

"It means somebody might take my head and put it on a crime scene."

  • Foc - 2012-02-06 11:43

    Your head IS a crime scene!!

      Tandas - 2012-02-06 11:50

      NOPE!!! In order to recall anything you need to have a brain... so he is actually right when he says he can't recall anything. Why is everybody so hard on the poor man?

      Larry - 2012-02-06 12:16

      Brainless, that explains it.

      John - 2012-02-06 12:41

      There must be a record of a speech in zulu were he used the word 'bulala' somewhere?

      RSole - 2012-02-06 13:01

      Memory loss is one of the symptoms of walking around with your head up your ar$e. Wrong person wrong job. Idiot!

      John - 2012-02-06 13:13

      I'ts over 2 Hours.Answer is accepted!

      jogesig - 2012-02-06 19:09

  • Wendy - 2012-02-06 11:45

    of course you can't remember !!

      Max - 2012-02-06 12:06

      I didn't know a lack of mental ability could be used as a defence.

      ivan.coetzee2 - 2012-02-06 12:15

      Denial is not a river in Africa, but it is a culture that flows through the ANC!

  • Herman - 2012-02-06 11:47

    The leaders of all our government departments in SA seems to be bred dumb and criminal.

      Alfred - 2012-02-06 11:56

      And with the inherent ability to become deathly ill at the drop of a hat, a ridiculous pimped out hat in Cele's case.

  • Perfume5 - 2012-02-06 11:48

    How is it possible that he cannot recall telling officers "shoot to kill"...I recall him saying that the police must not hesitate to fire when confronted by armed thugs, he went on to say "kill or be killed". Did he also not say that "police should not die with their guns in their pockets".

  • John - 2012-02-06 11:51

    Bheki Cele has told the South Gauteng High Court he cannot remember telling police officers to "shoot to kill"... Amazing, the rest of the country can remember him making that comment.. The statement "aim for the head" did not mean police officers were expected to kill criminals... A shot to the head is regarded just as a deterrent. Mind you, the way our cops shoot the head may be too small a target. "It means somebody might take my head and put it on a crime scene.".... Its probably there already. Or isn't bribery and corruption regarded as a crime?

  • Heiku - 2012-02-06 11:53

    I remember "Shoot to kill" and I still agree with the notion.

      richard.hipkin - 2012-02-06 12:27

      Yup, me too. If police are under fire then they must shoot to kill, finish and klaar... As usual the News24 do-gooders cheer when there are criminals shot dead by police but all attack Cele for saying so.. *sigh*

      planetdonovan - 2012-02-06 12:33

      it's incredibly dangerous to allow cops to exercise discretion regarding the use of deadly force, especially in this country. who will hold them accountable when they "accidentally" kill someone innocent. they have already demonstrated gross incompetence in the past when, for example, conducting a high speed chase on the wrong side of the highway, or getting into a shootout near a primary school.

      DuToitCoetzee - 2012-02-06 12:39

      Thank you. Two sober people. ALL on this site, who said something, praised him for saying that and now suddenly some have worst amnesia than Cele. The next thing is going to be some people saying,..".but I did not said so". "I was saying...bla...bla...bla..."

      Deirdre - 2012-02-06 12:40

      @ Pointblank ... I don't think they're critising his saying so, but rather his denial of saying it ... and furthermore, aiming for the head is a ka k instruction, aim for the body, it's a bigger target, easier to hit, especially with a heavy gun that has a high recoil

      DuToitCoetzee - 2012-02-06 13:39

      @Fafrica. Aiming for the head is an expression of seriousness. When you said aiming for the head it says the same than aiming to cause fatal injury. No-one will aim for the head when one are in a situation where the change to miss is great and one than rather aim for the body to ensure a higher hit %. The change that police can shoot some-one in the head, on a distance, is not good with the standard of firearms issued. Barrel to head further than 4m becomes a slim change in a fast action aim with there service pistols/revolvers.

      Deirdre - 2012-02-06 13:48

      @ DuToitCcoetzee... thanks for clarifying that, but I think the chance of an SAPS member shooting anybody in the head is slim and nothing and slim just left the building! With the exception of a handful of policemen, I wouldn't trust them to hit anything that they aim for

      DuToitCoetzee - 2012-02-06 14:01

      @Fafrica. Can't agree more!!!AMEN!

      Jennifer - 2012-02-06 14:05

      It's not the 'shoot to kill' , it's the lying to cover his bum. He could say yes I said that and realise that the police need better training instead. (there will always be thug cops, they're everywhere.)

  • Mashudu - 2012-02-06 11:56

    Cele May be you were high.

  • Deeteem - 2012-02-06 12:00

    I am sure SABC or ETV could give you a copy of you saying that on C D sothat you can playback at home and try and remember !! Dumba&& !!

  • Lumko Ntshinka - 2012-02-06 12:01

    Lol sudden case of amnesia neh bra cele

  • RobertKeeling - 2012-02-06 12:01

    I doubt whether anyone in cyberspace would be interested in putting his mug in a crime scene!

  • Robsschele - 2012-02-06 12:05

    Deny deny deny. The only thing the ANC is good with. If a politician is not satisfied how he is quoted he should clear it up straight away otherwise it will be regarded as the truth.

  • Marion - 2012-02-06 12:08

    Whether 'shoot to kill' or 'deadly force', I believe that shooting an armed individual before you get shot is acceptable whether you are a cop or a civilian. The problem is that there have been some 'unfortunate' instances where a***holes (in the guise of cops) simply shot for the sake of shooting and killed innocent civilians.

  • Vicky - 2012-02-06 12:08

    Lie and deny - brain free

  • nthathanem - 2012-02-06 12:10

    Sick!!! selective amnesia.

  • Shirley - 2012-02-06 12:11

    First amnesia,then altzheimers,then suddenly rushed to hospital with deadly brain illness. Good luck to the doctors if they can actually find a brain!!!!!

  • Ziggie - 2012-02-06 12:20

    Just play the news video with him saying it.

      richard.hipkin - 2012-02-06 12:28

      Which one...?

      Shistirrer - 2012-02-06 12:45

      All of them.

  • skootzie - 2012-02-06 12:20

    "In police jargon, deadly force is also referred to as shoot to kill." - - Just saying.

  • Elkieta - 2012-02-06 12:21

    Celelitis has just started.

      Nkulekweni - 2012-02-06 13:03

      Soon to be followed by shaikilitis...finger in till>court>ICU>golf course

  • braamc - 2012-02-06 12:23

    Also can't recall signing fraudulent lease agreements

  • eradingoana - 2012-02-06 12:23

    He said aim at the head but not kill. Surely he should take his group of Police Officers with him to Sterkfontein for a check-up. If he can still be Police Commissioner, this country would be at risk. Hope Zuma wont take that chance again.

      Ziggie - 2012-02-06 12:51

      Not Sterkfontein, rather Pretoria zoo

  • Sechaba - 2012-02-06 12:24

    i dont expect you to remember

  • TBlogger - 2012-02-06 12:36

    hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah! dam ass prick!

  • Makatikamusona - 2012-02-06 12:46

    Cele my man you him or you don't but fact remains he really was on the right track to make SA a safer place to be in.

  • Mark Milligan - 2012-02-06 12:46

    What an idiot.

  • heinrich.crouse - 2012-02-06 12:53

    The Ronald Reagan defense. Pitiful.

  • TP.Masekwa - 2012-02-06 12:55

    Yooo!! This serous, he is even lost memory because of dipression....

  • Thabiso - 2012-02-06 13:01

    This guy has been suspended for a while as police chief, anyone know when he will be relieved of his duties, or have his case heard at least? A million plus a year for doing nothing is rather hefty for Joe Public. He is even chasing poor sowetan on our cost...

  • Tammy - 2012-02-06 13:09

    Shame Cele, must be hard to have such a short memory. Don't worry, we DO recall you saying "shoot to Kill"

  • MastersVoice - 2012-02-06 13:10

    I suppose "Shoot to kill" is just a cultural way of saying "hug one another", just like "Shoot the farmer" means you must not shoot farmers...

  • Gavin - 2012-02-06 13:11

    This dude is just to dumb to be allowed to even walk around without the aid of an escort, never mind in charge of the SA Customer service police force army or whatever it is the police are called now.

  • Chris Malandelwazintombi Languza - 2012-02-06 13:13

    this is an unfortunate position first it was selebi now this man. it seems like once you occupy this position you turn to lose your memory. liar liar liar.

  • Tammy - 2012-02-06 13:14

    i just remembered that I also suffer from amnesia - who is cele again - LOL

  • Victor - 2012-02-06 13:15

    Typical African lifeline DENY,DENY,DENY

  • Victor - 2012-02-06 13:17

    African James Dean "Rebel without a clue"

  • aardvarkie - 2012-02-06 13:18

    Couldv'e sworn I saw him mention shoot to kill on television. However my memory is bad, really baaad.

      Tammy - 2012-02-06 14:07

      LOL aardvarkie - mine too!

  • thinga - 2012-02-06 14:03

    "Shoot to kill" has caused a lot of police deaths since its inception. Why? Because thugs know about this, their mandate also is "Shoot police first to kill before police shoot to kill you". It has been like this since...

      Scratch Tuesday - 2012-02-20 11:07

      Yah he did make that statement..!- he mus jus stop lying..!-

  • bmaestro - 2012-02-06 14:10


  • Andre - 2012-02-06 14:12

    It is unreasonable to expect him to remember. If you can't, you cannot.

  • Sydney - 2012-02-06 14:19

    On the point of Cele: I've been to three Police stations recently to have documents certified. All three of them still proudly displays the picture of Cele as Police Commissioner, right next to Mr Zuma! What message does that give to the public and service SAPS members?

  • Warwick - 2012-02-06 14:57

    Get the SABC or ETV to repaly the tapes.

  • Kusleg - 2012-02-06 15:48

    Mr Cele is simply making peace with the thugs because he is not too sure weather or not he will remain as police chief or join us in the rough South African streets.

  • Nick - 2012-02-06 15:52

    Apparently Cele can change the laws of physics at will, because "shooting to kill", apparently does not mean "using deadly force" and vice versa. This guy needs a medal... for stupidity

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