Proper land reform needed - Nkwinti

2012-11-06 11:15

Johannesburg - The ramifications of the Natives Land Act of 1913 should be reversed in a just and constitutional manner in order to maintain stability in South Africa, Rural Development Minister Gugile Nkwinti said on Tuesday.

If the issue of land in the country was not resolved, everything else would fall apart, Nkwinti told a New Age business breakfast in Johannesburg.

"Land doesn't grow, people grow, and just and equitable redistribution is needed to reach peace," he said.

Nwinti said there was currently "creative tension" among South Africans because the subject of land was not settled, and he blamed this on "the past".

In order to move forward, "just and constitutional means" were needed.

He said there were problems relating to land in the country, including a growing population.

To reverse this there would have to be corrective measures, including the relocating of people.

"People think the idea of reversing this is naive, but it has to be done."

Nwinti said mass concentration of ownership of land, which was unjust, also had to be reviewed.

He said there should be a focus on the conditions for state-owned land, privately-owned land, and foreign-owned land.

  • gert.swart.393 - 2012-11-06 11:21

    The land issue could have been resolved 10 times over if it weren't for the corruption and incompetence in his department!

      aniken.vader.31 - 2012-11-06 11:44

      "Land doesn't grow, people grow" - In that case STOP BUILDING RDP HOUSES AS A SINGLE UNIT! These are free houses (beggers should not be choosers), and as such one should NOT BUILD FLAT BUT UP! You can place MORE families on the SAME LAND if you build UPWARDS! IDIOTS! If you want a garden, then build a garden on top of the block of flats! This way you can service MORE THAN ONE FAMILY! What is so hard to understand that? You think that by STEALING LAND FROM EXISTING OWNERS WILL SOLVE YOUR LAND PROBLEMS??? Maybe in the near future but not the long future which makes you a BAD PLANNER FOR THE FUTURE OF SOUTH AFRICA! Which means you shouldn't be at the helm of decision making!

      charlesbronson.bronson - 2012-11-06 11:46

      Does not help. You will not use the land for NOTHING!! You can even plant a mielie (Corn) Bafoon!!!!

      andrez.kolesky - 2012-11-06 12:10

      "Land doesn't grow, people grow" People are "growing sick" of this tune over and over again ....

      bosveld.reaper - 2012-11-06 12:27

      Why does the ANC not hand over land already owned by the state? They are after all the biggest owner of Land?

      scouter.fourone - 2012-11-06 12:28

      @Zambezi - why don't you go and troll somewhere else? Your type of comment is so obviously contrived.....

      thefith.element.3 - 2012-11-06 12:31

      Oh dear zambezi, you been drinking again? Why dont you run outside and play in the sandpit. You are as thick as a garden chair! You probably didnt finish school or had History, the land did not belong to the blacks idiot, it belonged to the Koi. Eish you really are dof!

      mariuskowie - 2012-11-06 12:46

      This land reform hoax is getting out of hand. When the homelands was re-incorporated into South Africa, the land ownership was not suddenly handed back to whites. This land is still in the hands of black owners, individual and tribal owned. The homelands made up nearly 50% of the surface area of South Africa. I don't have to mention the government owned land. The land reform is in reality targeting a relatively small bit of land. But, as long as any land is white owned, the noise over land reform will not subside. Please ANC, make the actual land ownership figures for the whole of South Africa public. But then again, you cannot dare to. It will expose the land reform for the fraud it actually is.

      aspruyt - 2012-11-06 13:07

      zambezi.river - You will never earn more than the "whites" or amount to anything more than a failure with your state of mind and reasoning skills. Shame. Work for it, earn it or fack off and die.

      gerrit.vanbreda1 - 2012-11-06 13:11

      Zambezi, I dare you, come on to my propertie and see what will happen.

      beverly.young3 - 2012-11-06 13:26

      What do they want land for? They cant farm, they have no money, (so says everyone) therefore, if you give them land, must you the finance it as well? Every time it gets near to voting etc, this old rubbish comes spewing out of their mouths. Gugile Nkwinti owns a HUGE house near here, let him give that to someone?

      vlammie.pilot - 2012-11-06 14:28

      @zambesi: You should be equally careful, you might just get without asking for anything.

      wesley.bischoff - 2012-11-06 15:14

      Can't wait to kill and rape? Ooo eh eh

  • Andrea - 2012-11-06 11:24

    Great. Let's start with Nkandla.

      Matthew Jones - 2013-05-21 09:20

      And the comment of the day goes to: Andream.101!!!

  • Shaun - 2012-11-06 11:25

    the state owns more land than the private sector does,share that land with the people then lets go from there.

      aarchaic - 2012-11-06 11:33

      King Zwelentini owns 33% of KZN what does 1 man need all that for...

      wwrer.ww - 2012-11-06 11:41

      The government owns a lot of land, yet they are much like a communist government in the sense that they don't want to give away private ownership of the land to the people: they can only rent it. So the whites would just be handing over more land to the ANC communist government.

      wesley.bischoff - 2012-11-06 11:44

      They want the people to think all the land is owned by whites...

  • hermann.hanekom - 2012-11-06 11:26

    I think education should come first and then have educated people solve the issue.

      wesley.bischoff - 2012-11-06 11:46

      Why would they want to educate? Keeping the masses ignorant is what secures them votes, and if they need violent protesters, they just spin some story to them.

      richard.bosmano - 2012-11-06 12:44

      thandi intellectuals ? are you mad. Because the former president sucked a pipe and thought of himself as an intellectual doesn't make it so. At least he had a brain , the rest of this anc , "intellectual" is not in their dictionary sweeti

      wesley.bischoff - 2012-11-06 14:32

      I wasn't insulting the uneducated. It is not something they chose. They are just neglected by government, and fed lies to keep them following.

  • jonathan.meyer.140 - 2012-11-06 11:29

    Talk talk talk but nobody does anything....WTF?

  • Desilusionada - 2012-11-06 11:30

    So you say Verwoerd had it right? He only missed out on the colour? Racist Labour Laws, Forced Removals, Muzzling of the Media, Police Brutality, Political Intolerance. Exactly as the NP used to do. Only now it is under the guise of "Adjusting the Wrongs of the Past"? Things happen quicker nowadays than earlier times. 48 Years then is compressed into 20 today. And the then blind overseas sheeple blindly believing ANC drivel have woken up. And compared to the old government, the current one is substantially more incompetent.....

      wesley.bischoff - 2012-11-06 11:49

      I think he is saying that sooner or later there will be a crack, and things will change. More and more people are seeing the ANC for what they are, and with knowledge, comes critical thinking. Hopefully they will stand against the ANC, because all they want is to do as they please.

      heinrich.etsebeth - 2012-11-06 11:50

      @ruth: What he is saying is that the current regime's way of doing things is exactly the same as the way the nats did things... comprehension 101 was never your strong point was it?

      andre.kuhn.583 - 2012-11-06 12:30

      50 years of white nats and now another 50 years of black nats. South Africa will not survive such a scenario. My hopes as a resident and non citizen are dwindling fast. My hope is that all those who do not feel at home with the ANC will stand up sooner than later.

      oistar.tutu.9 - 2012-11-06 13:58

      Hey ruth, when you get your panties untwisted from your bra strap, perhaps you won't jump to your incomplete conclusion

  • crracker.crackerr - 2012-11-06 11:30

    Relocating people? Forced mass removals? Taking for example urban dwellers and sending them to some remote area to live off the land under the control of some new owners' class - probably the Party or some Commissar? We need a proper and transparent land audit with full details of the agricultural activities taking place on the land. Let's not ignore the Zulu and and other tribal ownership of land. Let's see who owns what.

      wesley.bischoff - 2012-11-06 11:52

      Like they will ever do that...

  • zimzon.zimzon - 2012-11-06 11:34

    Thousands and thousands of households got land and a house free all over South Africa and especially in the metropoles since 1994. Many thousands now own a hop house and property in their "homeland". Land does not necessary mean a farm, what is this obsession on farm land, only a very few can benefit from that if the new owners will use it for commercial farming?

      silvia.vaneck2 - 2012-11-06 11:44

      I would be more worried about food production than who owns land. There are 50 million people in South Africa and the one thing we all have in common, be it black, white or any other colour, is that we all need to eat and we all need clean water to drink!!!

  • rob.bayliss.94 - 2012-11-06 11:34

    Read again.....he has hit the nail on the head without realising it. The biggest problem is the growing rural population! So Minister, what are you going to do about that?????

      riekie.koekemoer.3 - 2012-11-06 11:46

      "People grow not land" Then stop the population explosion.

      andre.kuhn.583 - 2012-11-06 12:40

      Its tough but you need to reduce the grants and make them move into the cities where they adopt a western lifestyle which goes along with having less children..... That would mean that you need to establish the correct environment for job creation etc etc. I think the ANC is not up to this task.

      richard.bosmano - 2012-11-06 12:46

      We need something like a beubonic plague out brake in africa to solve that problem

      oistar.tutu.9 - 2012-11-06 13:59

      OOPs, Don't say Western lifestyle. They will do everything but that ...

  • wesley.bischoff - 2012-11-06 11:38

    And what is land going to do? Whoever gets the land needs the experience and expertise to manage a sustainable commercial farm, otherwise how will money be made? Ask the government for land, they own most of it anyway.

      silvia.vaneck2 - 2012-11-06 11:46

      Never mind money. How will enough food to feed 50 million people be produced?

      jeff.marett - 2012-11-06 12:32

      Yup, the dogs need their space. Now shutup and go mow the grass Mshini!!

      willem.d.jager - 2012-11-06 12:40

      mshiniboys that way of thinking is your prison. Political freedom lies not the amount of land you own. I own none. I wouldn't mind an acre or so in the end, but I know it's not going to be given to me because of some entitlement. In your quest for freedom also do some research on the productivity of those farms that have already been handed over. Everybody knows they're a mess. Easy come easy go, bro. Where is Africa going to run to next when SA is spent? This is the end of the line mate.

      wesley.bischoff - 2012-11-06 14:35

      Really Mshini? And where do you suppose all the food that feeds the people comes from? Why are food prices going up? Because more and more farmers are attacked, leave the country, less commercial farming, so more food has to be imported.

  • yrhonour.honour - 2012-11-06 11:39

    Nothing to add - all said in 1st 4 comments

      oistar.tutu.9 - 2012-11-06 14:53

      And don't forget why apartheid was created in the first place and that was because of the blacks stealing the white man's belongings, cattle included. The first point of apartheid was to prevent the blacks from being too near the temptation to steal

  • sydthefirst - 2012-11-06 11:41

    Dear Minister, I read LEGALISED LAND GRAB. Do you think the people of this country is stupid?

  • rob.gunning.1 - 2012-11-06 11:41

    Still baffles me to understand what happened with all the land claims since 1994. I also remember reading an article a few years ago stating that all land claims had been finalised so what is the problem now?

  • tobydt - 2012-11-06 11:42

    The IRONY is that the government has been spending BILLIONS on acquiring land. But no redistribution happens. The government still owns the land, it merely leases it out to the new owner. No transferal of ownership.

  • terrylee.heuer - 2012-11-06 11:43

    Start with state owned land they have plenty to go around!!!

  • kobus.erasmus.5 - 2012-11-06 11:48

    - You can't eat land. - Buildings don't materialize out of thin air once you have land. - Owning land does not make you intelligent, doesn't give you an education. - Fruit trees, vegetables and grains don't plant and water themselves once you have land. - When you have land, petrol and diesel don't seep out of the soil. - Once you have land, the money to pay your labourers doesn't grow on the trees that you failed to plant. Land will not solve the poor's problems. An asteroid on Luthuli house might.

  • beryl.knipe - 2012-11-06 11:48

    Don't know about anyone else but I've learned a lot from this article and the Minister has really made everyone feel better and of course he's explained exactly how he'll be achieving this mammoth task. The end of his speech was really cool, he decided to make himself look ever-so-important and blame the past. Tch! 1. Define: "Everything else would fall apart." 2. What is a "New Age" business breakfast? 3. Land does grow. 4. Please explain: "Creative tension." What's that? 5. I thought just and constitutional redistribution was worked out long, long ago? All just talk - again. 6. A "growing population" indeed! 7. "Relocating of People??" Are you SERIOUS? the very practice you HATED??? 8. What does "mass concentration of ownership" mean?

  • eyesears.handsfeet - 2012-11-06 11:50

    And yet there are still no propper audits or records of land ownership. Typical! gugile nkwinti (anc) mentality when he messed up the whole department by not doing his job, but wants a salary and more. Relocate who to where?

  • BigChiefPlumbPudding - 2012-11-06 11:52

    We need to create more wealth, not take it away from one and give it to another. I wonder if we will ever move away from this backward way of thinking. It's the same for Land. The Government has plenty land. Start training programs on training farms and let's get the ball rolling. Or is it a question of it being so much more convenient to cry apartheid and take something that others have taken generations to build up? And of course so much more convenient that the government won't then have to spend any money, therefore more money available to loot and steal.

  • mshiniboys - 2012-11-06 11:56

    Section 25 of your constitution enshrines the right to property, which is a standard international human right. The Section is very detailed, making it unique among human rights instruments. The Section amongst others covers arbitrary deprivation of property and compensation in great detail, which is in the context of the South African post-apartheid era and the Black Economic Empowerment program. The Section states “No one may be deprived of property except in terms of law of general application, and no law may permit arbitrary deprivation of property. Property may be expropriated only in terms of law of general application for a public purpose or in the public interest; and subject to compensation, the amount of which and the time and manner of payment of which have either been agreed to by those affected or decided or approved by a court.” Very contradictory in nature and does not say anything about the "ramifications of the land the land act".We have no one to blame but ourselves for deliberately trading our land and our people for freedom by putting things in the constitutions that we can not change now.People were nodding heads as if they could understand when this constitution was being processed.I wonder if one word of it means anything to them because they even breach it all the time.

      martin.v.fick - 2012-11-06 13:41

      Breaching the constitution does not make it right to do so. Theft is wrong. The constitution protects your right to own what you have worked for, paid for. It is your right, and it forms the basis of the law. To do away with it would spell anarchy, because I would kill you because I like your house. Or maybe I just don't like you. And no-one would be able to stop me, or hold me accountable.

  • Antipoaching - 2012-11-06 11:57

    Gug's you're a tit, how far back are you going to go in reversing the "land issue"? Follow your thinking to its logical conclusion please and give the land back to the Khoi.. they were here long before all of us, whitey, Xhosa, Zulu, Sotho Tswana etc etc...

  • andre.kuhn.583 - 2012-11-06 12:05

    Talking of the same rubbish over and over again. The problem lies only with the economy. If these bunch of comrades would manage our economy well than their would be no need for land reform. Why? Because people would prefer to stay in the cities. Just look over the fence to USA and understand what happened in the past 80 years. Nkwinti cannot be that ignorant so I presume that there are other motives behind his remarks. The ANC cannot be trusted anymore!!!!!!

  • tiresias.watiresias - 2012-11-06 12:06

    High time the tribal land system is reformed.

  • stanley.marries - 2012-11-06 12:07


  • riaan.viljoen.35 - 2012-11-06 12:10

    Try the traditional work hard and buy approach. Its been done by the minority for years and it works

      rocky.bell.5 - 2012-11-06 14:24

      Karl Still around with your drivel and imposing your BS on everybody else. Maybe you should read the comment properly before making a a** of yourself.

  • crracker.crackerr - 2012-11-06 12:15

    What's the use of disposing with productive commercial farmers only to starve because of a shortage of food the next day and of course the extra pressure the loss of state revenue and jobs will exert? NO FOOD NO STABILITY. One only has to google “food situation Zimbabwe” to realize how deadly the destruction of viable and successful commercial farming can be. Already South Africa has to feed its neighbours. Now imagine how hard the neighbours will be hit if our food production/supply runs into a disaster. Does the ANC long for another North Korea here? The average South African couldn’t care about the skin colour of farm owners. It is an excuse by some elite who will of course be the preferential recipients of land in its various ownership forms. They themselves will not be the “proud” workers or tillers of the land. The labour fodder will be imported to work the land under strict supervision. And still we will see a mess and a fall in production. And the many fights for privilege among the new elite. We already see the disastrous consequences in the form of radical and violent protests because of unfulfilled promises by the ANC. Now they want to push more unrealizable promises into the system for short term political gain and of course to keep the dishonest ones in their ranks out of court.

  • JohnnoBfree - 2012-11-06 12:18

    I have an idea, why not start by getting the farms that are already in black ownership to be productive. If you can sort this fiasco out I have no problem with who ever owns the land, just as long as its working and that we do not have a food crisis on our hands ten years down the line. The world is in such a mess we need to produce food because soon no one is going to have spare food to give to starving Africa.

  • sugar.creek.904 - 2012-11-06 12:27

    The problem with South Africa is that we had a Truth and Reconciliation commission to please the World. Real matters such as distribution of wealth, economic freedom and the social injustices and results of all Apartheid driven law were swept under the carpet. The honeymoon is over and reality bites in, Poor Service Delivery is a social problem with roots in Apartheid which designed a government to service a minority, and of course even in White SA corruption was there!! Just not as stupidly done as by the ANC. South Africa needs to really heal and right wrongs or else we heading for that place the Whites begged would not happen in 1991 where a civil war is a real possibility!

  • abner.malema - 2012-11-06 12:33

    It should have been done in 1994. Now people talk about commercial land as if other race are incapable of being productive. If you want to be productive land should be distributed equally among all races

      wesley.bischoff - 2012-11-06 14:50

      Not incapable, just not experienced. The government should have had a programme that taught people how to farm sustainably on a commercial scale, and then lease land to the people. If after 5 years they show they can make it a success, THEN give or sell the land. Just giving people land is not going to solve anything. Plus, government owns 40% of the land anyway, not white people.

  • TheSingingHorse - 2012-11-06 12:34

    I agree . There should be land reforms. All unproductive land should be taken away and put to good use . ie feed all the foreigners who have entered our land.How else are we going to sustain them? We do not want them to go elsewhere and bad mouth us.It would ruin SA's reputation.It would make our case difficult when we approach the IMF for funding.

  • gerrit.meyer.96 - 2012-11-06 12:37

    Give all the land to the farmers so that we can produce food for Africa....All over Africa white farmers are providing food for millions of Black People.Foe do you even know how to plant Maize??? Don,t criticize with a mouth full of food when your brothers is dying from hunger!!!

  • xoli.xuma - 2012-11-06 12:38

    take it without compesation,

      Muffin_man_can - 2012-11-06 12:51

      Try it and see what happens..

      thomas.w.reid.77 - 2012-11-06 12:54

      Why don't YOU come take my farm? Brave on the net I see.

      martin.v.fick - 2012-11-06 13:26

      Does taking anything from any-one without compensation solve anything? Or does it just repeat the mistakes and injustices of the past? Two wrongs. Which is worse? Why? If I help myself to your car without compenssating you, it is theft. I matters not what my reasons for stealing your posessions are. You would be aggrieved. Especially if you really valued your car, and you have worked very hard to get it. Especially if that car is what you earn your living from.

      wesley.bischoff - 2012-11-06 14:52

      So then i can go an take Nkandla without compensation? And Zumba's 3 other residences? It is, afterall, paid with tax money...

      wesley.bischoff - 2012-11-06 14:52

      Maybe they don't want land, maybe they want revenge...

  • thomas.w.reid.77 - 2012-11-06 12:52

    And everybody in the world STOP BREEDING!!! Where the hell will this end??? There is only so much space and resources available!!!

  • hendrik.andries.5 - 2012-11-06 12:58

    If you drive out of Middelburg(MP), towards Loskop dam(on you're left hand side), there is thousands of acres given to you're black tjommies, with money to start farms and a hunting farm. 2 Years down the line there is NOTHING left. It doesn't look like we are going to have a civil war, but you and you're short sighted friends are just begging for it.

      munyadziwa.muleyakenny - 2012-11-06 16:14

      Gorvernment must take back the land and give it back to their rightful owners and they must do the same as nationalist government who gave money to all white people and I think this will be the same as verwoerd and others who sent their children outside the country so that they can get educated like members of apartheid gorvernment did.

      Philip Nel - 2012-11-06 18:47

      Wow mun!!! You have just proven how stupid you are .

  • IcemanGP - 2012-11-06 12:59

    And to which part of history do you go back to? The part that benefits just one race group.

  • richard.bernardo.982 - 2012-11-06 12:59

    This is a very welcome comment by the Minister. It is re-assuring to hear "just and constitutional means" as the way forward for solving the land issue. However there should be more impetus given to solving the land issue. It seems though that government is dragging its feet and this could have been resolved much sooner as there is ample property both agricultural/commercial/residential available on the open market.The willing buyer- willing seller concept is unfairly blamed for creating delays with land reform. The delays appear to be with slow administration, collusion between corrupt officials and fraudulent sellers that are hampering the processes.

  • gary.desousa.7 - 2012-11-06 13:01

    At least he mentions state owned land in the equation. That has to be used first for farming ,food security etc,services,roads and then the balance distributed and STOP this socialist/communist idea that all people must get a plot.

  • martin.v.fick - 2012-11-06 13:11

    Minister Nkwinti has a serious dilemma. On one hand he has a political job, with a mandate, and on the other, he has a problem he cannot solve. Or not simply at least. The core of the problem is the constitutional right to ownership. His own included. But the masses are demanding what they don't have. They want what they want and they perceive that they have the political power to take what they want. Like getting from a to z without going through the alphabet. Why is the land (currently in the hands of commercial farmers) important? Well it has been developed, often over generations, and so it is appealing. but the masses generally do not have the institutional memory or capacity to keep it productive. Their objective is maybe closer to an eye for an eye in mentality. So the argument degenerates into a racial one, subjuctive and uninformed. The answers to complex problems require an objective approach. Not an emotional, ignorant slanging match that feeds hatred.

  • sefako.mokgalaka - 2012-11-06 14:15

    It has been 18 years of empty promises. When are you starting with the reform?

      wesley.bischoff - 2012-11-06 16:09

      Reform starts with an attitude, to better yourself and your family, without depending on others or the government. Reform doesn't come from receiving land. My dad was also dirt poor, him and his 8 siblings couldn't even afford shoelaces. Yet my dad did what he had to to reform his own life. He didn't get handouts from government or anyone else. He did it on his own. Funny how some people can do this, while others just extend the hand.

  • phumi.ntlabati - 2012-11-06 14:24

    It is old leaders like yourself Mr. Nkwinti that are delaying the land reform process, because of your cowardness! Old people by their very nature are afraid of taking risk and decisive action! We should learn from Zimbabwe when they hired a 35 year old vibrant Honorable Saviour Kasukuwere to head the Zimbabwe/Ministry of Youth Development, Indigenization and Empowerment. He has managed to address the 350 year old problem in two years! Zimbabwe is on the road to recovery as we speak! Whites are gaining confidence everyday in this country and soon will start denying the attrocities of the past like Mulder did. We should even make it illegal for apartheid denialists, like De Klerk and Mulder to exixt in this country, like what Paul Kgakgame is doing in Ruanda!

      rocky.bell.5 - 2012-11-06 14:55

      ..................dream on, buddie.....dream on. De Klerk GAVE you your freedom.....FACT.

      khathutshelo.muafrica - 2012-11-06 15:32

      U r ryt phuti,thy so scared of the queen those elders,puppets of evil imperialists lyk Khama..

      khathutshelo.muafrica - 2012-11-06 15:34

      Phumi nt phuti...sorry native

      andre.kuhn.583 - 2012-11-06 19:33

      Phumi, you sound like Hitler

  • dewaldmontgomery - 2012-11-06 14:44

    I still find it fascinating WHY land is so important. An overwhelming number of black people DON'T WANT TO FARM. They MOVE TO CITIES. Look at your own census results!

  • christiaan.henning - 2012-11-06 14:48

    If anyone white, black, green, blue, fat, thin wants to steal from me, I will fight you. I have never stolen from anyone. Move on, break the cycle. This is sad, that's all.

      munyadziwa.muleyakenny - 2012-11-06 16:07

      Only if your grandfather was here in south africa during apartheid government then the land is not yours and you won't fight anyone and remember this is south africa not netherlands.

  • maverick.generators - 2012-11-06 16:41

    One by one African countries have followed the same path of fail after independence with always the same result. The only exception being Botswana. Human intelligence allows us to learn from the mistakes of others and find new, more functional and effective ways. Not in Africa though, the only continent in the world where Marxist ideology is still worshipped. The lazy, stupid and useless look up to government for help, corrupt governments then introduce knee jerk policies to hold onto power with disastrous effects on the economy and the country as a whole. The ironic thing is that African countries that have experienced this in the past have now opened their doors and are on the up. With the exception of SA, where the sheer stupidity and ignorance of some of its population cheers on the idiocies spewed from the mouths of the stupid and ignorant politicians that they elect.

  • jan.wagner.54943 - 2012-11-06 18:05

    If the department of land reform start spending the money they are given to BUY land instead of giving the money back to treasury more than enough land will be bought to cater for the needy

  • blackyv1 - 2012-11-06 21:41

    we should take the land why should we ask them? them toke it by force! lets learn from the best!!!!!!!!do the same.

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