'Waterkloof 2' released from prison

2011-12-19 14:05

Pretoria - Two of the so-called "Waterkloof Four" were released from Zonderwater Prison outside Pretoria on Monday, the department of correctional services said.

"They are [being] released as we speak," said spokesperson Zacharia Modise at about 13:30.

He said that Gert van Schalkwyk and Reinach Tiedt were at the community corrections centre where they will have to report to in terms of their parole conditions.

Prison authorities initially ignored the Pretoria Regional Court's order on Thursday for the release of the two under house arrest.

Modise's statement came shortly before an urgent application was about to be brought before the North Gauteng High Court in a bid to force the department to abide with the ruling of the Regional Court.

Modise said a statement on the matter would be released by the department shortly.

He insisted that the department did not agree with the order that the pair be released on parole.

"We are not happy with the court order. We want to challenge this."

Tiedt and Van Schalkwyk were among a group of four boys convicted of killing a homeless man and assaulting another at a park in Pretoria in 2001. They were each sentenced to 12 years’ imprisonment.

Van Schalkwyk and Tiedt have served three years of the sentence.

The remaining two were being held in another prison and not included in the release order.

  • Sharmay - 2011-12-19 14:12

    Not cool. They should serve their sentence.

      Deon - 2011-12-19 14:18

      Unfortuantely the jails are full, more criminals will be let out soon. Recently the building of 4 jails have been cancelled, but we need probably 10 more new jails.

      RobinHood - 2011-12-19 14:23

      Joe you are sick

      RobinHood - 2011-12-19 14:29

      The answer is not to "get rid of them" and yes - you will burn our fingers if you try to be sarcastic - nobody can see your face!

      RSole - 2011-12-19 14:29

      @ Joe. Hopefully you'r homeless too.

      Azande - 2011-12-19 15:27

      @Joe, I hope they catch you for yo drug use.

      Graham - 2011-12-19 15:37

      Everybody should serve there sentence!

      Jack - 2011-12-19 15:55

      Hopefully the last of the racist generation, it's easy to stereotype people. Every race has it's a-holes!

      Mr Kcopah - 2011-12-19 20:04

      @Bones not all of us possess such "humourous bones" so Joe c**t expect us sense his

      Russell - 2011-12-19 23:02

      No Sharmay, this is F%$#ing cool

      Len - 2011-12-19 23:26

      @Deon. If jails are full, why not release those whose term was coming towards the end?

      Sharkshoot - 2011-12-21 09:26

      This is a travesty of justice. All four should have been released.

      Abe - 2011-12-21 12:31

      News24 loves to omit important details. People should get their facts straight. These two did not murder anyone. They were at the scene and aware of the crime but kept quiet about it. They were found guilty based on their complicity in this regard. The other two who murdered the man are still behind bars.

  • lebo.lathane - 2011-12-19 14:12

    Our Justice system is pathetic! FULL STOP!

      mike.clery - 2011-12-19 17:05

      Let's be clear about something - this isn't the judiciary doing this, it's the executive (government)and their advisory bodies. The judiciary's only involvement was ordering specific Correctional Services employees to follow the Parole Board's ruling.

      Sunshine - 2011-12-19 20:53

      Louis, how do you know it's Lebo's government?

      Len - 2011-12-19 23:27

      It is not pathetic, it only benefits some

      Len - 2011-12-19 23:27

      Government and the judiciary are separate and should remain separate.

  • Humble - 2011-12-19 14:13

    Are you sure this time round?? There not going to be a follow up article saying the opposite?

      Humble - 2011-12-19 14:26

      Indeed... i had to laugh when i heard 3 different stories the other day when they first announced this! 1 from News24, 1 from 5FM & another on tv... gotta love the SA media! I say impose fines on sensationalistic journos!

      Deon - 2011-12-19 15:40

      The media can not be blamed to report on a court order or 2. Not many people ignore court orders, only a few people that think they are too important.

  • Steets79 - 2011-12-19 14:14

    Tiedt is going to get some "sugar" from his "old/new' found love...

  • Truthis - 2011-12-19 14:15

    They should rot!!

      Monique - 2011-12-20 08:28

      @Graziella-that is not a nice thing to say...carefull, your wish might be overturned.

  • Willie - 2011-12-19 14:16

    Wie het wie gebribe?

      joeycilliers - 2011-12-20 19:48

      Seker Robert Mc Bribe.

  • ludlowdj - 2011-12-19 14:17

    Bottom line, if its good for one its good for all. In a country where two sets of laws exist depending on the colour of your skin, its good to see that the government doesn't get away with just letting non white criminals out on lame excuses.

      Van - 2011-12-20 01:05

      @Timmy This is not parole, unlike the scum that is released be jz and mbeki on a yearly basis.

  • J.p. - 2011-12-19 14:18

    What's good for Schaik is good for them.

      Azande - 2011-12-19 15:30

      U mixing two disparate issues.

      Repline - 2011-12-19 15:56

      @ Azande, Crime is Crime, unfortunatly lady Justice is blind and do not diffrentiate between the lesser of two evils.

      Len - 2011-12-19 23:31

      Except Shaik did not murder anyone, neither did Selebi but this is South Africa, so we should compared murderers with crooksters

  • Vytjie - 2011-12-19 14:20

    If these guys can proof that they are changed possitive citizens, we should give them a chance. They are young and can still make their contribution in our country, instead of being dependend on the government. How about for forgiving? Why do we want to keep people down? Give them a chance to proof the pesimists wrong

      joedoos - 2011-12-19 14:31

      Do you value a human life to 3 years in jail? That life is gone. Snuffed out. Ended. Those that did it spend 3 years in jail. Lekke! How many years would you want your killers to sit in jail?

      Juno - 2011-12-19 14:31

      Uh because they deliberately killed somebody?? They should have been given the death penalty..

      Deon - 2011-12-19 14:51

      Rather build more jails.

      Azande - 2011-12-19 15:33

      I guess Tereblanch murderers can rest assured, its only gonna be for three years at most.

      Repline - 2011-12-19 16:04

      Im neither for nor against these guys, what they did can never be undone, and they will have to live with the labelling for the rest of their lives. However. @ Joe, Can you even place a value on a human life, or any life for that matter. Do you prefer the value to be 12 years... 20 years... life/death? Whatever happened happened and these guys did a terrible thing but in no way can any price be placed on any life. Personally the whole idea of "jail-time" is to rehabilitate the individual. In most cases this will never happen. But sometimes it does happen, when good people for some reason just do bad things and sometimes those things just spin out of control. I pity these guys more than anything else, as they have ruined there aspirations in life. I can only hope for their own sakes that they realise that what they did was wrong, and will aspire to become greater than that which they were. Welcome back to society, please remember to be decent.

      Vytjie - 2011-12-19 16:08

      Joe if anybody of us should be valued to our behaviour most of us would be destined to live in a cage. I agree with you, however, I belive that people should get a second change. Sometimes we kill people, not physical, but with wat we say.

      Vytjie - 2011-12-19 16:11

      Juno not al 4 did the physical killing. Have you followed the court case? We are to fast with our judgements at times

      Vytjie - 2011-12-19 16:15

      Philipbad, if you are able to compare these two killings, then the answere would be yes. However I doubt it. If someone can be charged for spilling alcohol on our prez, the how can you can compare ET with an unknown hobo? Can you ignore the prominency of the incident? As far as I am concerned the are more differences than comparison in these cases.

      Hallo - 2011-12-19 17:15

      Proof hey? Tell me does the same apply with regards to farm murderers? I mean why would we want to keep them down too?

      Carla - 2011-12-19 17:34

      Here is a very changed man:

      Wall - 2011-12-19 22:48

      It's not as if they're really being set free, they'll still be punished for many more years, just in a rehabilitative way. They won't be free to do what they want.

      Len - 2011-12-19 23:32

      Would you then recommend that all prisons be openned and all murderers be given such a chance, or is this limited to only these individuals?

      Len - 2011-12-19 23:35

      If you are convicted of murder, then you are convicted for the killing of someone either as a co-conspirator or the one who actually the did. If some were not convicted of murder, then there would have been different conviction and sentences. Surely, that is clear if someone follows the storyline

      Len - 2011-12-19 23:36

      @Vytjie. So, murder is not really murder to you. If someone kills a hobo, they deserve to get out of jail after 3 years, but if they kill ET, then that is different? What makes their lives so different that our legal system should impose different sentences for their murder?

  • MissGremlin - 2011-12-19 14:20

    My biggest problem with this is not the prisoners involved, but that dept of corrections feels they are above the law. It's all about having their little kingdom, and wielding power over prisoners. I know of a person on the parole list, and the instruction has been issued for release, but the guards and prison officials, are refusing to acknowlege the instruction.

      Juno - 2011-12-19 14:33

      Totally! Why on earth are they questioning the decision? It is not in their jurisdiction to even do so surely? Really shocking..

      Azande - 2011-12-19 15:40

      Just to share some info in this issue regarding Department of Correctional Services (DCS). DCS has jurisdiction in deciding who can/not be granted parole. Parole considerations include "rehabilitation report, conduct during the time in jail, and half of the sentence should have been already served in jail". The ground that DCS is standing on which make sense is, “the two spent only a quarter (not half) of their sentence". This is not difficult to understand.

      Juno - 2011-12-19 16:14

      That may be however the point is that CS's were legally obliged to release the prisoners - if this was not the case they would not have been released today. Surely their objection should also have been raised before judgement and not after? Yes object by all means but follow procedure.I doubt it's procedure to ignore a court order unless I'm missing the obvious. It is not clear what the process is - how unusual.

      Van - 2011-12-20 01:07

      This is NOT parole. Try and understand the difference.

  • Howard - 2011-12-19 14:24

    They will be back where they belong

  • vastis1 - 2011-12-19 14:33

    They killed a man, but want to be free, Money talks!

      richard.hipkin - 2011-12-21 12:04

      Really? Do you know something we don't?

  • Shirley - 2011-12-19 14:38

    Wether or not they should be released is debateable. However I do feel that corrections department should not be allowed to ignore court orders as they see fit! The court should have the final say. Too many institutions are able to do as they please in S.A.

  • FormulaSA - 2011-12-19 14:39

    Seriously controversial case...let us endeavour to never judge someone merely by the colour of there skin and not the content of their many lives have been ruined by hate. @FormulaSA

  • Milton Chinogwenya - 2011-12-19 14:40

    Malema is right. Mbeki was better

      Azande - 2011-12-19 15:43

      Hahaha, dont start that one. That's my president and I don’t want him tangled in this current spate of insane decisions by the current leadership.

      Deon - 2011-12-19 16:14

      It is a bit late now, you wanted Zuma.

      Vytjie - 2011-12-19 16:22

      He is defenitaly not my first choice for prez. However can't you remember how many people was released from jail, after Mandela's release?

      Len - 2011-12-19 23:40

      @Vytjie. They all met a set of criteria, one of which was to have served more than 50% of their sentence.

  • Cina - 2011-12-19 15:03

    Everybody is going on about there release, I agree they should still be in jail but what about all the rapist and other murderers that gets parole and then murder and rape again.

      Azande - 2011-12-19 15:46

      they got their parole after they had served 50% of their sentence in jail. That isn't hard to conceive and understand, is it?

      Cina - 2011-12-19 16:04

      @Azande, ag crap man, there is that case in Pta now of the Tukkies student that was brutally raped and hacked with a panga of a guy that was out on a R1000 bail and has escaped 3 other times from jail. And many more like this one.

      Juno - 2011-12-19 16:18

      @ Azande not true! Check your facts!

      Azande - 2011-12-19 20:44

      @Cina, I don't think we are on the same page in terms of the subject we are deliberating on. Parole, bail and escape are three totally different things.

      Azande - 2011-12-19 20:45

      @Juno, I checked the facts. Come with any dispute, its welcome.

      Len - 2011-12-19 23:41

      Are any of these rapists and murderers you refer to released after serving a quarter of their sentences too?

      Len - 2011-12-19 23:44

      Bail and being released are totally 2 different issues. Being released means just that and that you cannot be convicted of such a crime. Skipping bail is not same as being released. Just thought I should clarify the difference. For your information "A SUSPECTED rapist who escaped from a city hospital last month, days after allegedly attacking a Tuks student in her home, is back behind bars and appeared ..."

      Monique - 2011-12-20 08:37

      @Azande-You are just too fking clever aren't you?? How do you know that these people serve 50% of their sentences...inside info or a guess or do you just know everything? Fact of the matter is that this is what is happening in our country to all criminals, the only reason there is such a big hype about this one is because of their skin colour and the media presence.

      DuToitCoetzee - 2011-12-20 09:10

      @Azande. Nothing to do with the article, but commenting on the facts that you claim to know in full. The prisoners that spend half there sentences was half of their sentences that they would have spend if they were release because of good behavior. eg. 12 years could have came out at 6 years, but served 3 years and were released on that basis. There is were the 50% came from. Not all of them, but this way of calculation was use on some.

      Azande - 2011-12-20 10:51

      @monique, as a proud citizen, i take time to read the legislations and regulations of this country hence i'm enlightened a bit about the parole processes. @du toit, for yo info: correctional services is in a process of challenging the court decision as the believe that the release of the two is against the legal prescripts that regulate "early release" of inmates. They will be basing their arguments on exactly what i said above. In closing, I'm not in anyway saying the two should not have been released because they committed murder, i am saying "legally their release is premature thus unlawful".

  • bella.koekelies - 2011-12-19 15:11

    You cannot compare the actions of a 16year old with Shabir Sheik. I also feel 3yrs is too little, but if according to reports their actions in jail show that they are rehabilitated sufficiently to be released. House arrest - I think you need more self-discipline to obey rules than in any jail. Let's give them a chance & see if they can return something good to society.

      Juno - 2011-12-19 16:21

      I take it this is not a selective principle on your part. It would therefore need to apply across board - including rapists, paedophiles? God forbid!

      Wall - 2011-12-19 22:54

      Juno - NOT across the board, only for people who were under age when they committed the crime and who have access to infrastructure where controlled, supervised, correctional, rehabilitational discipline is possible.

      Len - 2011-12-19 23:46

      The 16 year old killed someone and Shabir Shaik did not. Agreed, these cannot be comparable. If we give them a chance, should all other murderers who have served a quarter of their sentences be given a chance too, or is this limited to these four?

      Len - 2011-12-19 23:48

      @Wall. So, people who are well off should not spend their full terms in prison because they have the infrastructure? What prevents someone from a squatter camp from having access to the same justice?

      Wall - 2011-12-20 08:40

      Lenand, I've read all your replies and wonder if you've misread everything I've said on purpose, or if I didn't express myself clearly. I'll respond to each one under their threads... Regarding this - in my opinion, a first-time offender who was underage when he committed his crime, and who has shown through his behaviour and progress in his prison time that he can be rehabilitated and can be a productive citizen, should be given this chance. I said nothing on earth about being well off/rich/not in squatter camps. What I mean by infrastructure is that it should be possible to monitor them, they should definitely have a strong support system at home, etc. I don't know how the house arrest works in terms of regulation, but it should be possible to regulate your movement. And kind of a side note... does anyone know how the basic necessities work with prisoners in house arrest? Does the government feed them or do their families? Because obviously, if they're not allowed to work for money, they will need to have the resources to survive, if the government doesn't do the feeding and cleaning.

  • Zander - 2011-12-19 15:15

    Point is, they denied all the way that they had done, if they just admitted guilt from the start and taken responsibility, they would have received a lighter sentence, and would have been out of prison years ago, and could have had this all behind them, but they were arrogant fools.

      Zander - 2011-12-19 15:17

      although I have to say, this is only a big deal cause its 4 rich white children. This sort of thing happens every day with criminals getting released early, I guess they are so in the spot light, that they wont dare put a foot wrong

      Xolani Ziqubu - 2011-12-19 15:37

      Its sad that u think 12 years is harsh for taking a life. But then again this country still has dual sentancing standards...

      Azande - 2011-12-19 15:50

      @Zander, and I have to say if you were black you wouldn't say that, would you?

      Wall - 2011-12-19 22:56

      Zander, off topic regarding the release, but the whole darn case was in the spotlight waaaaay more than any other case. You hear about kids who commit murder almost monthly, and yet their court cases aren't dragged into public and their schools' (and parents') names aren't dragged through the mud with them.

      Len - 2011-12-19 23:49

      @Zander. Know any murderers who were released 25% into their jail terms? If so, can you provide references?

      Len - 2011-12-19 23:51

      @Wall. Are you speculating or stating fact? If you are stating fact, can you provide reference to the cases you refer to where people were found guilty of murder and were released with 25% of their sentence?

      Wall - 2011-12-20 08:42

      Lenand, read my post. I said OFF TOPIC, in other words it has nothing to do with the article, but only with Zander's original post. Like he said, this whole case was in the spot light more than others of its kind, and that was the point I was highlighting. I don't even understand how your question relates to what I said at all.

  • Julie - 2011-12-19 15:16

    Yipeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee! I am so glad they have been released! The other two should also be released!!!!!!

      Lauren - 2011-12-19 15:31

      Should have been given life!!!

      Len - 2011-12-19 23:52

      Yes, Julie, I am sure your delight will be more pronounced when other murderers are released too.

      Jannie - 2011-12-20 08:29

      Julie you are sick, and get some perspective, they killed someone for fun, i know what comes out of that school, self entitled trash who think they are gods gift to the human race

  • Peter - 2011-12-19 15:23

    There must be a valid reason for there release.Await the full report before pointing fingers.There must be a reason for there release,not a pie in the sky.Nobody can be released after serving only three years !!! For a crime like this.

      Hallo - 2011-12-19 15:45

      The reason is money talks and too many afrikaners still have connections in high places. Their ilk is no better then the ones running the country today.

      Deon - 2011-12-19 16:12

      It seems as if theire are controversy over a law that was changed some time ago. It probably also helped that they were minors at the time of the murder / incidents.

      Len - 2011-12-19 23:54

      Their sentences were not commutted. Their sentences were not overturned. They are still guilty of murder and they are still sentenced for 12 years. So, no, there is nothing else we do not know that would have mitigated the release because it if were so, the story would be out by now

      Len - 2011-12-19 23:54

      @Deon. That they were minors only applies in sentencing, not being released after a quarter of the time. They were tried as adults

  • Carin - 2011-12-19 16:05

    They've been released, so just get over it.

      Jan - 2011-12-19 16:10

      Remember this remark when someone kills someone close to you.

      Nurse - 2011-12-19 18:50

      You'll eat those words when a convicted criminal who is roaming the streets due to lax enforcement of criminal law targets you or your family. We'll tell you to get over it DEAR.

      Jannie - 2011-12-20 08:22

      Carin, you have obviously never lost a loved one to MURDER, these guys killed a boemelaar for kicks... HOW SICK CAN YOU GET?

      phunkylizzyswan - 2011-12-20 09:35

      Jan + Jannie I doubt that this mans' family even know that he was murdered. He is the "unknown homeless" man. I think they don't care.

  • Jan - 2011-12-19 16:06

    Can't help wondering how much money was involved in this.

      chubbycheeks - 2011-12-19 16:58

      My thoughts too Jan!

      Carla - 2011-12-19 17:26

      The costs of counsel, Jan.

      SeeVeeDeeEl - 2011-12-19 17:29

      Have your straw man have an amount in mind?

  • Nikki - 2011-12-19 16:14

    I wonder if they were released as they were 15 when they committed the crime - now they are 18 (Adults) and more than likely would have to be transferred to another prison with older criminals - Just a thought - I dont agree with them being released, but I am wondering if they were in tried as juviniles - anybody know???

      Johan - 2011-12-19 16:24

      They are 25 now and they were in prison with other adult offenders. The case was only brought to court after a year or two went by and it took many years to complete.

      Johan - 2011-12-19 16:25

      Oh and they were tried as adults.

      Chum Scrubber - 2011-12-19 20:56

      Ok, between Johan and Nikki you've confused me. They committed the cowardly phsyco crime as 15 year olds. They spent 3 years in jail. Now they're 25 according to Johan. At what age were the brutal okies actually tried for the crime? According to Johan, it must have been 22 - 7 years after the incident?

      Wall - 2011-12-19 22:58

      Chum, the 3 years in jail came after a very long legal process, so yes, they only started serving their sentence 7 years after the assault. It happened in 2001 and they have been in prison since 2008. (I think my years are right? Feel free to correct me.)

      Len - 2011-12-19 23:56

      No, they were not. They were tried as adults. They committed the murder in 2001, when they were 16. 10 years later, they are 26, at least I hope they are.

  • AlQuestioningLife - 2011-12-19 16:17

    How many other kids who were under 16 when they committed murder have ever gone to a real prison.? Just a thought.....

      Vytjie - 2011-12-19 16:25

      Good question! People tend to forget that right after the Waterkloof conviction, the law changed for children, which woul have not destined them to jail

      Carla - 2011-12-19 17:29

      At the time the minimum sentences read that children should not go to jail unles absolutely necessary. then a few young ones landed up with the minimum sentences and there was the case of Sv B. this led to a project to find all those kids and determine at what state of appeal etc the cases were and to ascertain whether they should be moved. The project was completed

      Chum Scrubber - 2011-12-19 20:59

      They should go to jail though. A person committing a crime like this is surely verging on Satanic, how do you beat an old man to death at any age - is it possible for such people to ever reform, its just so incredibly evil what they did? I would not like them around me.

      Wall - 2011-12-19 23:00

      Chum, they were drunk and (supposedly) thought the guy was a house breaker. Yes, the drunkenness probably helped them come to that conclusion. But it wasn't a satanic thing, just a drunken rage. (P.S. I don't mean "just" as in it's not bad, but certainly better than satanistic.)

      Len - 2011-12-19 23:58

      They were tried as adults, not as kids. They were 23 when they were found guilty

      Len - 2011-12-20 00:01

      @Wall. Murder is the unlawful killing of another person. Whether it is done for fun, muti killing, revenge or drunken driving in our roads. It is still murder. A taxi driver was recently found guilty of murder even though he was driving recklessly and the police will likely charge those driving drunk with murder if their actions results in someone being killed. Method of killing may be a mitigating factor in sentencing, not in early parole.

      Wall - 2011-12-20 08:45

      Lenand, again, read my post. I was replying to Chum's question about whether it was a Satanistic killing. It wasn't. If you'll note my P.S. at the end, I specified that I'm in no way saying murder isn't murder. I just said that it wasn't a Satanistic ritual or something.

  • Trevor - 2011-12-19 16:26

    What a Christmas will they have?@ least the tax payer will save on 2 meals????

  • Carin - 2011-12-19 16:41

    to be honest, if these kids were yours? what would you have said,thank you, or no thank you, keep them in jail?

      Len - 2011-12-20 00:02

      If these kids had murdered a member of your family, would you be saying get them out of jail?

      Jannie - 2011-12-20 09:04

      do the crime pay the time.

  • Dan - 2011-12-19 16:46

    Its a sad day... with our justice system, at times, everyday is a sad day. At least they didn't plead illness - it seems to be a trend these days! What were these kids (kids back then) fed to even consider doing this to another human being, let alone homeless or a crime based on race? Does this hatred / thought come from the top of the family tree? People trying to buy the dockets for this case so it can go away! I feel even 12 years is a joke for that kind of crime (especially after all the other rubbish that has happened)! The DCS and the justice ministry should hang their heads in shame, but alas they are worried about their own jobs (or finding someone "decent" to run the department), keeping their leaders in power and calming the waves that the folk from Limpopo are busy making!

  • chubbycheeks - 2011-12-19 16:51

    This just blows my mind!! UNACCEPTABLE!! They belong in JAIL!! Is 3years all a mans life is worth these days?? Or does that only apply when your parents are filthy rich?? SCUMBAGS!

  • anthon.walters - 2011-12-19 16:56

    Judging by the atrocious spelling and grammar mistakes by some of the contributors of this thread I would rather see the Education Department rot in jail. Makes me think... maybe the officials of DCS couldn't read the court order?

  • Angelo - 2011-12-19 16:59

    Lets forget for a second that the person killed was a homeless man and that the kids who did it was white and rich. Just Imagine that 4 young people were involved in the murder of your father just because they can, all of them receive 12 years but 2 gets released after serving only 3 years... Think it over again. I will refrain from bringing race or money into it. Do we happily release convicted killers/criminals very early just because the have apparently rehabilitated or do you want everyone regardless of race, economic status or political connections, to serve their sentence? One thing is for certain you cannot applaud the release of these two men and still bemoan the level of crime in SA. You cannot shout from the roof tops when an ANC cadre is released and comment that now atleast now they releasing all races. "Oh but they made a mistake" and they must take responsibility for it ... The issue i have is not only about this case but the fact that we are/have been setting a precedent that even if you are caught and convicted of a crime, you will not be punished severely. Its all about risk and reward and currently the risk is low and the reward is great. Crime, i have to say, does pay.

      Dean Kenad - 2011-12-19 19:14

      Well said angelo

      Chum Scrubber - 2011-12-19 21:05

      Well said Angelo, absolutely true. Scary that the department ignored the order though, right or wrong.

  • annie.kalahari - 2011-12-19 17:05

    No doubt: these four rich Afrikaner kids, aged 15, were vile little racists who drove around in Pretoria looking for black vagrants to beat up – but something very strange happened in court: the 'corpse' introduced as evidence of their crime was no vagrant and had NONE of the marks which he should have had had he beaten bludgeoned and kicked to death. On the contrary, the forensic experts testified that the man had bled to death when he injured himself on a steel picket-fence while stealing from a house a considerable distance away. He was surrounded by the items he had stolen. He was a well-dressed man and was well-nourished, according to the evidence. The description in the court that this man had been a 'vagrant' did not match the body's appearance at all. While these were vile little racists they still were convicted wrongfully because the court ignored this evidence despite the overwhelming reasonable doubt it presented. Meanwhile independent investigators have discovered that the 'vagrant' which they had so viciously assaulted, had been treated and survived. When one wants to convict someone for murder for being vile little white racists, at least the 'proper corpse' should have been introduced as evidence.

      Chum Scrubber - 2011-12-19 21:12

      If true, they certainly deserved at least 3 years for beating the oke that survived to near death. Little cretins like this cause the hatred that results in my freinds getting raped and murdered. They have a lot more blood on their hands (white peoples blood) than the poor oke they beat up. I detest racist cowards like this. Its ok to be a racist, I believe its natural human nature, but it gives nobody the right to behave the way these kids did.

      Wall - 2011-12-19 23:06

      Chum, I agree. I've read the information that Annie posted in another blog as well, and for that reason I believe they were innocent of murder (although anything is possible and I try not to let it affect my judgment)... BUT they ADMITTED to bashing a guy's head in with a hammer and kicking him with steel-tipped shoes and so on, so they definitely deserved to spend time in prison.

      Len - 2011-12-20 00:06

      If that is the case, then they could not have been found guilty of murder. Fact is that they were found guilty of murder and lost all their appeals. This would imply that the court found that they indeed murdered someone and assaulted another. People do not get convicted for murder, if they were not found guilty of murder.

      Andrew - 2011-12-20 06:41

      For a long time now we have been advocating an overhaul of our justice system, which is not consistant in its judgements. This is possibly due to appointing inexperienced judges.

      Wall - 2011-12-20 08:46

      Lenand, so you've never heard of anyone who was sentenced for something and later found to be innocent? Never? I've heard of several people who were given the death sentence and then, many years later, evidence came to light that proved their innocence. (I do still support the death sentence, though, but only in cases where it could be proven without any shadow of a doubt.)

      Angelo - 2011-12-20 08:54

      @annie.kalahari are you seriously saying to me that 4 high priced advocates allowed their clients to be found guilty of murder for someone who fell on a steel picket fence? You telling me that through the entire appeals process these advocates could not use this alleged autopsy report to their advantage? I'm clenching my buttocks mam/sir your smoke machine wont work on me.

      Onke Dali - 2011-12-20 09:36

      Chum chum chum, just because you and your friends are racist doesn't make it natural amigo. It's actually quite amusing watching you guys agree to such nonsense because of some imagined sense of being persecuted. The saying is true "white people are crazy" , paranoid schizophrenia being the most common disease.

      Chum Scrubber - 2011-12-20 18:46

      Oh dear Onke, guess you're not racist then, you just think white people are crazy. If I thought black people were crazy I guess you would not think that even "slightly" racist of me then, would you? Soort soek soort, just don't let it affect your judgement in life. Denial boet, it does not help deal with it.

      Ry Short - 2011-12-21 08:43

      Why is it that people don't proof read their own comments to make sure it follows a logical progression? Think about what you want to say first and only then write it down. Goodness. Has anybody given thought to what may happen now that they are out? I'm sure there are a few member of society who feel that they haven't received their dues just yet..

  • annie.kalahari - 2011-12-19 17:08

    No doubt: these four rich Afrikaner kids, aged 15, were vile little racists who drove around in Pretoria looking for black vagrants to beat up – but did they deliberately murder one of their victims? Or were they convicted with ‘the wrong corpse?’

      Len - 2011-12-20 00:10

  • Carla - 2011-12-19 17:23

    DCS: bad cases make bad law. This is a bad case because the law is bad. Sort out the gaping holes in the two Acts and your own regulations.

      Len - 2011-12-20 00:11

      Which law are you referring to?

  • Chum Scrubber - 2011-12-19 20:39

    What is scary is how the department chose to ignore the court order. Sounds very Zimbabwe to me, if this sort of thing continues we're on the road to anarchy. That said, I think when hienous cowardly crimes like this are carried out, the perps should serve as much of their sentences as possible. The department should never however be allowed to ignore a court order, whoever is responsible should be severely dealt with before the cancer becomes the norm.

  • Rita - 2011-12-19 22:34

    There was never any evidence that they killed this man who was not even homeless but a robber who just robbed a house and was still surrounded by the stuff he stole when his body was found.

      Len - 2011-12-20 00:12

      They were convicted of murder. They admitted to beating someone and bashing his skull in. If anyone finds someone who stole items, it is advisable that they call the police, wouldn't you say so?

      Onke Dali - 2011-12-20 09:20

      So Rita, assuming you're correct about the man being a robber you feel they were justified in murdering him in cold blood?

  • mamoshianem1 - 2011-12-19 22:38

    I'm ashamed to be a citizen of SA,If serious crimes are taken for granted.The message that they send to people is you can commit crime as you please.Money will set you free.

  • Peter - 2011-12-20 00:17

    Same crowd who's up in arms about rapists and murders that get off lightly now applaud this. Strange indeed. Makes you think what their motivation is. How can you stand for this but bemoan the crime rate in SA??

      Jannie - 2011-12-20 08:32

      I agree, some of the whiteys ( and i am white) on this site, sing praises when 2 murderers walk out cause they are white, and then scream blue murder when the same happens after their oom or tannie were killed by some thug.

      Tyrone - 2011-12-20 12:50

      100% agree @Jannie

  • mario - 2011-12-20 07:53

    they would have never done this if there is a death penalty in this country.

  • Cynthia - 2011-12-20 08:26

    The shame of it all! A poor homeless man who had absolutely nothing except his life and the Waterkloof Four took that and probably for sport!!! I hope that whenever the four of you close your eyes this poor defenceless man's face will always be there, staring back at you and I hope when you watch a movie or try and concentrate on something important, you will always hear his screams ringing in his ears. A 12 year sentence is as big a joke as Shaik getting off with terminal illness. How do you live with your conscience? I hope the prison authorities go ahead with their application and they have my best wishes.

  • Robi - 2011-12-20 08:28

    The boys behaved like KZN police squad who kills suspects. It is interesting, lets c whether what happened to the boys will happen to the KZN police squad.

  • kgomotso.segooa - 2011-12-20 08:46

    A 19 year old gets busted for shoplifting and gets sentenced for 10yrs and another teen took someone's life only serves few years in jail and people make it race issue. Justice for the rich and the poor must just suffer the consequences. I feel that they must be re-sentenced. Even the guy who killed 5 runners must go to jail, he was drunk and a danger to society but he also enjoying the benefits of law abiding citizen. Something needs to be done and very fast. However; we always talk and no action, maybe we should take to the streets and this time will be different, it will not be for salary increase but to force the government to abide by the rules. Why must justice be for certain individuals the selected few?

  • BossoYaDibosso - 2011-12-20 11:29

    @beanie Black people kill in somewhat an auto response to life circumstance like no job,education "end of thinking capacity",while "most" white people would probably kill for fun because they are bored,have less problems and would rather kill a homeless guy with no real reward afterwards.It's not like they benefitted from killing the homeless guy so it's much more wrong.Ladies and gents,let's not racialise it hey.Good Morning

  • Blanche - 2011-12-20 12:28

    i don't get it... why are they being released? who decided that & how can that be right? They're already only serving a 12 year sentence for murder. Someone please explain to me how this is happening in our country.

  • mushongaj - 2011-12-20 14:12

    3 years for murdering a homeless man! this is sick. its fraudulent.

  • mushongaj - 2011-12-20 14:24

    3 years fot murdering a homeless man! ummh this is sick. its fraudulent!

  • Bruce - 2011-12-20 18:08

    The question is, why did the prison authorities not want them released? What do they know? They killed a person whom they did not know, who had done nothing to them and it was unlikely he ever could. Sure this guys were young, too young to be cruising the streets in a motor car looking for entertainment. If I remember correctly they never even had a licence! How did they get access to a car?

  • Cheryl - 2011-12-20 21:44

    Guess they must be innocent if they have been set free.....but then who killed that man and will the guilty person not get life for murder????? or i guess homeless people dont count.

  • Boerklong - 2011-12-21 13:31

    Why is it a problem when two of four WHITE murderers are released on parole, and will probably NEVER commit this crime again gets released? When some BLACK convicted murderers get released on parole, and commit these hanus crimes gain its not an issue?? How many farm murderers have been relesed only to kill again?? And now these two boys are released, there will be good reasons for this, people are up in arms about it, including the correctional services who granted the bail...??? WTF!

  • Mohsin - 2011-12-21 16:09

    This is what alcohol does, rather sit @ home and smoke some herb

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