AS IT HAPPENED: Panayiotou defence questions Siyoni arrest conditions

2016-11-22 15:30

After Terry Price, for the defence, spent the better part of the day cross-questioning so-called 'enforcer' Lt. Col. Mayi, the other officers who accompanied Luthando Siyoni during his arrest were also called up to provide their version of events.

The accused in the Panayiotou case

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Last Updated at 16:25
22 Nov 15:24

22 Nov 15:24

TP: Would this conversation about the lawyer be contained in your pocket book? 

DG: None of the conversations was recorded in the pocket book, except the injury and that I returned him safely 

TP: Why did you not record the conversation about an attorney in your pocket book? 

DG: I don't know 

TP: Because it didn't happen, that's why 

DG: It definitely did happen 

TP: I would love to finish this witness your honour, but I need to go back and review everything that has been said 

Chetty: Court is adjourned to tomorrow, 09:30

22 Nov 15:21

TP: Now this that you told the court, did you tell this to the state prosecutor before you came to testify here? 

DG: Yes, that is correct 

TP: When did you tell him, this stuff that you have told us for the first time today? 

DG: When I consulted with the prosecutor this morning 

TP: Why did you not put all this in your statement initially? 

DG: It was straightforward, I was taking the man where he needed to go and brought him back. I did not realise it was going to be such a big issue. 

DG: I was to take him there and bring him back with no injury. 

TP: You're telling this court that the exceptionally important question he asked and the answer you gave him of the lawyer was not something of importance? 

DG: That is not what I was saying 

DG: If he had asked for a lawyer, I would have turned back and would have made sure that he does have one 

TP: I can't understand you, it is exceptionally important that he spoke about it, and that you offered him one, and that he said no, he doesn't want one. 

DG: I did ask Koen if he knew his rights, and he only asked me when he could get one, and I asked him if he wanted one now, and if he said yes I would have turned back and made the necessary arrangements. 

22 Nov 15:15

TP: I just want to ask one or two questions before I address your lordship 

TP: You made a statement 

DG: That is correct 

TP: And you wrote it down 

DG: I typed it down 

TP: So the content is your own words 

DG: That is correct 

TP: Can you recall the date of the statement? 

DG: I think it was the same day that I typed it, and my colleague signed it on the first day we worked day shift, I think in May 

TP: And by colleague, you mean Reynolds? 

DG: Yes 

TP: And do you agree, that much of what you have told the court today is not in that statement? 

DG: That is correct 

22 Nov 15:12

MS: And can you tell the court what happened there? 

DG: That was when I realised many people know Siyoni 

DG: The town was busy and we drove in slowly, and he greeted at least three people, if it wasn't more 

DG: I opened the back door and spoke to him, and asked him how it was that so many people know him 

DG: His answer was that during the Grahamstown Festival, he would do bouncer work, and that was how so many people got to know him 

DG: He said during the day he would work at the festival, and in the evening he worked at a tavern, but I can't recall the name 

DG: What I do remember, is that he had taken my jacket and pulled it over himself to cover the handcuffs, as if he was embarrassed 

MS: Came back to PE and you placed him back in the holding cells at Kabega Park 

DG: That is correct 

MS: Any additional injuries? 

DG: Not at all 

MS: I have no further questions 

22 Nov 15:07

MS: Can you tell the court further what happened when you arrived in Fort Beaufort? 

DG: When I dropped him at the charge office, where he was placed in the cells, I asked them if they would offer him something to eat 

MS: Do you know if he got anything to eat? 

DG: I don't know 

MS: And on the way back, did you have anything to eat or drink? 

DG: At the Total garage at Fort Beaufort, as you leave town, we stopped as we were also hungry 

DG: I gave money to my partner, and she bought pies and cooldrink for all of us 

DG: And I gave him a pack of biscuits that were in my bag 

DG: The cooldrink I still remember, Reynolds asked if he wanted Coke or Energade as he was such a fitness freak 

MS: On the way back, was Mr Siyoni awake, did he sleep? 

DG: He was awake the whole way back 

MS: His disposition, was he talking, was he quiet? 

DG: He didn't talk, but he was laughing as I teased Dianne, because I am permanently teasing her 

DG: The worst was when he asked us if we are married 

DG: Because I was teasing her so much 

MS: At some stage, did you stop in Grahamstown? 

DG: Yes 

DG: At the Engen, to put in petrol

22 Nov 15:00

MS: And what was his response? 

DG: He just said, no no no, he's just asking, and then we proceeded 

MS: It was put to this court that Mr Siyoni did not have any sleep on the route to Fort Beaufort 

DG: That's not true 

MS: What is your indication? 

DG: That was one of the light moments of the trip 

DG: He was snoring lightly while he slept in the back 

DG: I said to my partner that now I can't sleep, because his snoring is keeping me awake 

DG: We laughed about it 

MS: On the way to Fort Beaufort, did he have anything to eat or drink? 

DG: No 

22 Nov 14:57

MS: At that time when you left Kabega Park, did you know where you were going? 

DG: Not at that stage 

MS: Explain to us, under what impression were you and what happened further? 

DG: I was under the impression I was going to a magistrate to go for a confession 

MS: And what happened then? 

DG: I was not far from the charge office, when I got a call to say we were going to Fort Beaufort 

MS: The last thing I want to check, before you went to Fort Beaufort, legal representation, was that discussed at any stage? 

DG: When I asked him if he knew where we were going, that was in the presence of Koen, and I had to explain to him who I was and that I had no insight to the docket. 

DG: I asked Koen if he had his rights explained to him and whether he was aware that he may have an attorney present 

DG: As we were driving, not far from the charge office, before I received the call to say we must go to Fort Beaufort, Mr Siyoni asked me when he could see an attorney 

DG: I told him that he could have one any time he would like one, and I asked him specifically if he would like to see one now 

DG: Because then I would not have driven further, I would have turned back to the charge office 

22 Nov 14:51

MS: Can you explain to us? 

DG: It is hand and feet cuffs 

DG: It is the type of handcuffs, I call the old prison handcuffs, they wrap around the hand and close with a lock. The same with the feet cuffs. 

DG: And then I use a loose chain that ties them together, that allows him movement but not enough that he can reach me 

MS: Now, did you put those cuffs on him? 

DG: That is correct 

MS: And if the pants were torn to such an extent that they were falling off, would you have noticed? 

DG: I would have seen it immediately and I would not have allowed it 

MS: When you say you would not allow it, what do you mean, what would you have done? 

DG: I have a woman with me, who was my partner, and I would have given Koen instruction to give the man another pair of pants 

DG: I don't think it would have been a humiliation to him, but to me too 

22 Nov 14:46

MS: Beside his injury to his eye, do you have knowledge of a split lip? 

DG: Not at all 

MS: If his lip was split and was bleeding, would you have observed it? 

DG: Definitely 

MS: Do you know if his pants were torn? 

MS: To such a degree that his pants were falling down and he had to keep it up? 

DG: Not at all 

MS: Can you explain to us, how was Siyoni handcuffed before he was placed in the vehicle? 

DG: I want to make sure, is it by me, because I handcuffed him 

MS: Yes 

DG: The reason I say that was because the handcuffs placed on him by Constable Koen, I removed 

DG: It is not the first time I transport a suspect, I have a special set of handcuffs that I use  

22 Nov 14:42

DG: I have two reasons 

DG: The first reason, I have had an operation on my eye 28 times 

DG: I have a cyst problem, and as I am standing in the court here, my left eye has a cyst and I can tell you [in] three to four days' time I will need to have it operated on. 

DG: I have had this problem since 2006. During the mornings my eye will be swollen shut, but after putting a warm teabag [on it], the swelling subsides 

DG: The heat from the teabag opens the glands 

DG: In other words, I can't cry, but when I do cry, it is for no apparent reason 

DG: The second reason is that when I transport this man, no one can come back and say that I assaulted this man, or that I hurt this man 

DG: In any way 

DG: I also had him sign my pocket book, to say that I observed his injury 

22 Nov 14:41

MS: I want to show you a photo 

MS: I intend to lead evidence at a later stage that this photo was taken on the 29th of April at around 06:30am 

MS: Can you describe to the court the swollenness of the left eye 

TP: Is it meant as it is there, on the photo, or when he observed it? 

MS: I have shown you a photograph, but what did you observe when you saw the man with a swollen eye? 

DG: Just as it is in the photograph, it was swollen a little more but he could still see out of it 

MS: What I want to know, why did you show interest in this injury? I am not a police officer. I want to know why would you be interested in this swollen eye? 

22 Nov 14:34

MS: He is a detective at Kabega Park, is he not? 

DG: Yes 

DG: He introduced me to a person, who was well built 

DG: That was Mr Siyoni 

DG: That was when it [was] explained that this was the man I need to take for the confession 

DG: I saw that the man's left eye was swollen 

DG: I explained to him who I was and introduced myself to him 

DG: I also explained I have no insight into the docket and was not involved in the investigation and had no knowledge of the case 

DG: I explained if he had any questions that he needed to ask Mr Koen 

DG: It was also then that I asked what had happened to his eye 

DG: It was in the presence of Constable Koen 

DG: He indicated that other police, and the word he used was "gemoer" (beaten)

DG: I asked if he referred to Constable Koen, and he said no 

22 Nov 14:29

DG: To this day I am not sure, I just received a call from detective head Colonel Rowan 

MS: Is this the colonel known as "Grumpy"? 

DG: That is his nickname 

MS: And what was his request? How did it occur that you became involved? 

DG: If I remember correctly, he called me and asked me for a favour 

DG: He asked me to take a suspect for a confession 

MS: At that stage, were you aware of where the confession was going to take place? 

DG: He did not tell me at all at that stage. 

MS: And then? 

DG: He also mentioned it was a murder case and he said he would arrange a vehicle for us 

DG: I couldn't understand clearly what he meant by that as I was driving a double cab bakkie and I did explain to him that I have such a vehicle 

DG: He insisted that we use the vehicle that he made available to us 

DG: He asked me to go to the charge office, and there I would receive further particulars 

DG: At the charge office, I met with Constable Koen 

22 Nov 14:23

MS: Mr Greeff, is it correct that you are [a] warrant officer attached to the police unit at Kabega Park? 

DG: That is correct 

MS: Is it correct that during the early hours of the 28th of April 2015 that you transported a man named Luthando Siyoni to make a confession in Fort Beaufort? 

DG: That is correct 

MS: Where were you working that morning? 

DG: I worked night shift at the crime office section of the detectives 

MS: Can you tell us how did it occur that you had to transport Mr Siyoni to Fort Beaufort? 

22 Nov 14:19

Warrant Officer Dirk Ignatius Greeff (DG) is called up to the witness stand. Greeff is one of the officers who accompanied Siyoni to Fort Beaufort. 

[Greeff is sworn in] 

22 Nov 14:17

22 Nov 12:33

22 Nov 12:32

TP: And if we look, this is your signature under interpreter, is that his signature on the left? 

WM: Yes 

TP: OK, we are going to show you a number of signatures, are they all his? 

WM: Yes 

TP: Did you see him sign with your own eyes? 

WM: Yes 

TP: No further questions 

Chetty: Mr Daubermann 

PD: No questions 

MS: If we can have a short adjournment, I just have one or two aspects I need to clarify quickly.


MS: I have no re-examination for the witness, my lord 

MS: I now want to ask for a lunch adjournment 

MS: Two of my police officials were involved with an accident with a kudu 

MS: I am trying to get other witnesses and should have at least one witness available after the lunch break 

Chetty: Any objections? 

TP: None, my lord 

Chetty: We will stand down until 14:15. Court is adjourned. 

22 Nov 12:27

TP: She saw him, that he had a swollen eye, a split lip, his knees were dirty and his pants were torn 

TP: Is it your evidence that she didn't see it, because it wasn't there? 

WM: It is not true what she is saying, but she did see him there 

TP: So she is lying about that? 

WM: Yes, she is lying 

TP: Approximately 25 minutes later, Mr Greef noted the swollen eye, so she couldn't be that wrong 

MS: I checked my record, I don't find it in my evidence that Babalwa Breakfast says that the knees was dirty 

TP: It is an error on our part 

TP: The split lip, torn pants and eye are still there 

TP: This is a statement taken from Sizwe Vumazonke, taken by Captain Swanepoel, with you in attendance 

TP: Do you recall it? 

WM: Yes, I recall it 

TP: This is the same Vumazonke that you said didn't need an interpreter, but here he is using one, and it's you 

WM: Yes 

TP: If we read here: "The police injured me." You should remember that 

TP: Is that the first time you remember him making the allegation that he was assaulted? 

WM: Yes 

22 Nov 12:21

TP: When we go to the SAP22 - prisoner's property - the entry is nil. They found no property on him, no money, no cellphone. 

WM: The person who can make a clear explanation is the person who took down the SAP22 

TP: You know what a SAP22 is, don't you? 

WM: I was going to explain 

WM: When you detain a person, you cannot book a person's personal belongings into the SAP22 while the relatives are present, because the personal belongings are normally handed over to the relative. 

TP: What relative was there? 

WM: Babalwa 

TP: She's his girlfriend, not a relative 

WM: OK, his girlfriend 

TP: My question was, that do you agree Babalwa saw Siyoni at Kabega Park during the early hours of April 28? 

WM: That is what I am disputing, that it is the only time... 

TP: I am not saying it is the only time, forget the other time, all I am saying is that she saw him 

WM: Yes, she saw him 

22 Nov 12:17

TP: She was implicating herself in the crime 

WM: No I don't think so, she merely was keeping Siyoni's money for safekeeping 

TP: But we have been over this, [in] her statement she says that the money was given by Chris to pay for the murder of [his] wife, that makes her an accomplice. 

WM: That never occurred to me, it just appeared that she was being truthful 

TP: Your claim that, when you went into Infinity, you say the first person you spoke to was Siyoni, it wasn't, it was Pumlani 

WM: No, it was Siyoni 

TP: We will show the CCTV footage that shows that it was not 

TP: You say he went back in to collect his wages, totalling about R380 

TP: Did you take anything off him? 

WM: No one took anything from him 

WM: When he was arrested, maybe he gave his girlfriend his stuff 

TP: Are you guessing, did you see it? 

WM: No, I didn't see anything. 

22 Nov 12:12

TP: Only because he never knew that he did not have to let you in 

TP: Who did the house belong to, him or his mother? 

WM: The shack behind the house belonged to Siyoni 

TP: He said so? 

WM: Yes 

TP: And now, horror of horrors, the money is not in the wardrobe 

TP: Were you not surprised that the money was not there? 

WM: I was not surprised at all. That comes back to the reason why we went to the house without a search warrant 

TP: And you had to go through another two properties if I'm not mistaken 

WM: That is not so. When we emerged from the house, we went to the vehicle. Siyoni spoke to Babalwa, and she said she had forgot to tell him she removed it from the house and gave it to a relative for safekeeping. 

TP: And you went to that house, and you entered that house and the money was found? 

WM: We were at the gate of the house, Babalwa called out to the lady and she brought the money. 

TP: And did you tell Babalwa she did not have to point out the money to you? 

WM: Babalwa is the one who gave the information in her statement about the money and it was the boyfriend who had willingly told us that we can go and fetch the money. I saw no reason to warn them. 

22 Nov 12:07

TP: Did you have a search warrant? 

WM: I did not have a search warrant 

TP: You have to have a search warrant 

WM: You don't always have to conduct a search without a search warrant 

TP: Tell us when you don't need to do a search without a search warrant 

WM: It is under the circumstances, when the circumstances are of such a nature that what you are looking for, may have been removed. 

TP: Who else would have known about that money, the two people who knew about it were [with you] 

WM: We were not aware that the two of them were the only people who knew about the money 

TP: Were you given the indication that anyone else was involved? 

WM: That is correct. When we got the money, it was not found at his place, it was found elsewhere. 

TP: You jumping the gun, when you left KwaNobuhle, did you know if anyone else had knowledge of the money? 

WM: We did not know about the money, Thando told us his money was at home in a wardrobe, and we believed that his mother could access the money. 

TP: Where did you get that? 

WM: He was living at home, she could go into the room 

TP: Did you get permission from Siyoni to search the house? 

WM: It was not a search 

WM: The fact that we were there with Siyoni in his house proves he had given us permission 

22 Nov 12:00

WM: I did explain the rights to this young man. After I explained his rights, he said he understands, he said he's feeling free, and that he is prepared to show the money that is at his house. 

TP: Are you now saying he volunteered to show you the money? 

WM: Yes, the girlfriend had already made mention of the money 

TP: Yes, so you knew about the money, before you even took him to the house? 

WM: Yes 

TP: So you must have told him you knew about the money, because Babalwa had already told him 

WM: I did not have to tell him about the money, I told him his girlfriend had given me a full account of what happened 

TP: So out of the blue, he just said I will take you to the money 

WM: I don't know what prompted him 

WM: Maybe he was aware his girlfriend knew about the money 

22 Nov 11:56

TP: But that is exactly what Siyoni said happened, you pulled his pants down and had a look 

WM: That never happened 

TP: Police are issued pepper spray 

WM: Visible policing 

TP: Come now, anyone who wants can sign for it 

WM: I only know of visible policing. No one in my team that I am aware of have pepper spray. 

TP: Is it correct that you went to his house to search for the money? 

WM: We never conducted a search, he was going to do the pointing out of the money. 

TP: Are you aware you should warn a person of his rights before a pointing out? 

WM: Yes, that is so in respect to a formal pointing out 

WM: Here, I had already placed the person under arrest and the money he was pointing out was not a formal pointing out 

TP: Why do you say that? 

WM: Here is an arrested person making mention of money remaining in the house. Now for example, anyone can just enter into the room and remove the money. 

WM: This could happen while we are still busy trying to set up a formal pointing out. 

TP: He was going to point out the money, you should have warned him 

TP: That never happened

22 Nov 11:52

TP: Surely you could write down what he told you, you have got your diary there 

WM: The reason why I didn't get into details was because it would give the impression that he would be forced or compelled 

TP: Apart from that answer making no sense at all, you cannot show this court any written document that shows what he said to you 

WM: That is correct, that is why I didn't want to take details. That information should have been taken by the investigating officer. 

TP: You didn't take any note of any confessions he made, without any indication he would say anything to anyone else? 

WM: I am not entitled to effect an arrest on a person and then obtain a confession from him 

TP: That is not correct, it is not law that you can't do it 

TP: I am not going to argue the law with you 

TP: What I want to put to you is that if Mr Siyoni said nothing further, you would have nothing against him. 

WM: I had a statement and it was confirmed by the money. 

TP: You are jumping ahead, I'm talking about at Kwanobuhle. You only had Babalwa's statement and nothing else. 

WM: Yes that is correct, I had the statement 

TP: Now, when you gave the document to Babalwa to read, can you show us how she read it? 

WM: [sits] "Babalwa was sitting down" [he holds up the paper at some distance from him

TP: Is it like this? 

WM: Yes 

TP: What if I told you that she is legally blind? 

MS: Is he referring to now, or at the time? 

TP: The document we have put before this court is that it's been like that since age 7 

TP: The reason you don't know is because she didn't read it 

WM: No, she read it 

[TP talks about the suspect who had soiled his pants] 

TP: Did you have a look? 

WM: No 

TP: How did you know? 

WM: I saw a wetness 

22 Nov 11:42

TP: But why did it take so long? 

WM: I told her what information I had, and then she told me what information she had. This doesn't happen over a short period. 

TP: So once you got her statement, you went to the other office and placed him under arrest? 

WM: Yes 

TP: And if you are consistent, you warned him and he didn't make any requests? 

WM: I did say that after I informed him yesterday, I explained his rights and the reasons for his arrest, he even showed his co-operation and said let's go to the house and get the R30 000. 

TP: So he opened up spontaneously? 

WM: That is correct 

TP: Did he waive his rights to an attorney? 

WM: That is correct, he never asked for an attorney 

TP: And he specifically told you that? 

WM: That is correct, that is why we went to the place he said we must go to 

TP: What he told you, the way he implicated himself, did you write it down? 

WM: I never wrote it down, because we did not go into the details 

22 Nov 11:37

TP: And do you know where he would have got something like this? 

WM: Everyone is aware that I placed Mr Siyoni under arrest at Uitenhage after I picked him up at Infinity 

TP: Mr Swanepoel goes on, "Mr Siyoni, after leaving the building, was handcuffed and placed in a vehicle

WM: He was not handcuffed 

TP: Let's go on. How long did you speak to Babalwa Breakfast? You said it was about an hour and a half 

WM: Yes, it was about an hour and a half that I listened to her statement 

TP: How long did you sit with her before you went to arrest Siyoni? 

WM: It was from the time we arrived just after 9pm, up to just after 23:40 

TP: So you must have been in her company alone for two hours plus 

WM: Yes, that is correct 

TP: And this is a person who spontaneously opened up to you and told you everything? 

WM: Yes 

22 Nov 11:33

TP: Let me tell you Mr Stander is a very senior prosecutor, and he will never assume anything, the only way he would have said that is if someone had told him 

TP: I am now going to refer you to a statement from Captain Swanepoel 

TP: This is a statement he filed opposing the bail application of Mr Panayiotou this year 

TP: I will make this available to the court 

TP: Mr Swanepoel has a habit of not marking his pages, but I read from page 16. 

TP: [reads] "Siyoni was arrested at the Infinity Lounge, where he was informed of his rights

TP: According to you, that is not right 

WM: That is incorrect, I did not arrest him there 

TP: And Swanepoel was not there 

WM: That is correct 

22 Nov 11:30

TP: Colonel Mayi, you say you never handcuffed Mr Siyoni at Infinity 

WM: I never handcuffed him there 

TP: And you never placed him under arrest 

TP: I want to read to you from page 480 of the bail application 

Chetty: Is this part of the bail proceedings? 

TP: Yes 

Chetty: That hasn't been handed in 

TP: It will be, but Mr Stander does have a copy so we won't be misleading the court 

TP: [reads] "Beeton: Where was he arrested. Stander at the shop

TP: So that is incorrect? 

WM: He was taken from the shop, he was not arrested 

TP: Do you agree that Mr Siyoni was not arrested? 

WM: That is correct, but someone may have assumed that when he was taken from the shop, he was arrested. 

22 Nov 11:25

22 Nov 11:14

22 Nov 11:14

TP: An hour after that, WO Greef and Reynolds describe his eye as red and swollen when they took him to Fort Beaufort 

TP: How did it get from a tiny scratch to that? 

WM: What happened, that eye sustained a minor scratch. When I left him it was not swollen. It could have swollen afterwards. 

TP: You have got to be joking colonel. 

WM: I am not joking and there is no reason for me to deny that he had a scratch 

TP: There is every reason, it is because you and your team beat him up, and that is why you are minimising the nature of his injuries 

WM: No one ever assaulted Siyoni 

TP: Do you know that Captain Swanepoel took a statement from him, and he says he had a red left eye 

WM: I don't deny that... if you hit me for example, my eye doesn't turn red immediately, it develops 

TP: You have turned a whale into a tadpole 

TP: I am about to move on to a new area, I shouldn't be more than another hour, but perhaps we can take the adjournment 

Chetty: Court is adjourned

22 Nov 11:10

WM: I was going to place the handcuffs on him in the front 

WM: When I placed the handcuffs on him, he got up from the chair 

TP: Was any of the handcuff on him already? 

WM: One side 

TP: So his hands weren't together yet? 

WM: That is correct, we were trying to tie his hands together 

WM: He threw his hands up, and I told him I was bound to put handcuffs on him because I was taking him to the township 

WM: He resisted and I requested the help of my young men to help 

WM: We grabbed him and placed the handcuffs on him 

TP: How many of your young men, as you call them, assisted you? 

WM: We were five altogether, but not all of us 

TP: OK, where does the injury come from, sorry, the tiny little scratch? 

WM: I did indicate. He was sitting down, and when we put the handcuff on him, he got up and threw up his hands... 

TP: So was it the handcuff that caused the cut? 

WM: I don't want to commit to say it was the handcuff 

TP: Did you notice the scratch immediately? 

WM: No 

TP: Can you describe the scratch, perhaps you can show us on the ruler 

TP: I am not going to give it a measurement, I am just asking you to give us an idea 

TP: Was it visible?

WM: Not very 

22 Nov 11:03

TP: The following day, on the 28th? 

WM: Yes 

TP: Which way did you drive? 

WM: Fort Beaufort 

TP: So at some point in time you were in Fort Beaufort? 

WM: Yes that is correct, we had to go through Fort Beaufort to get to Alice 

TP: The small injury you say Siyoni sustained, can you explain how that happened? 

WM: It was after I had explained to him and the statement I had from Babalwa. 

WM: I now explained his rights to him and explained he was now under arrest 

TP: [One] second, before now he had given his full co-operation 

TP: He had done everything you had asked him to do that far? 

WM: It was not a very long time, it was a very short time 

TP: What I am saying is that before you handcuffed him, you had no reason to believe he would resist 

WM: That is correct 

TP: Tell us how you handcuffed him, and how he resisted 

22 Nov 10:59

TP: Let's go to Kwanobuhle 

TP: Siyoni says he wasn't handcuffed during the trip, but immediately after he got out the car he was handcuffed 

WM: That is not true, that didn't happen 

TP: Now, besides the five of you, Babalwa Breakfast and Luthando Siyoni, was there anyone else at the station? 

WM: Two security officers were there, keeping guard of the building 

TP: You arrived in pitch darkness 

WM: Yes 

TP: So aside from the guards, was there anyone else? 

WM: No 

TP: So if we forget the guards, then it was just the 7 of you? 

WM: Yes 

TP: Is it an out of the way police station 

WM: No 

TP: It is in the township 

WM: Yes 

TP: You said you came from Alice and after the arrest you returned 

WM: Yes 

22 Nov 10:54

TP: You are a colonel in the police and you don't know 

WM: I know about the judge's rules in the pocket book, but that is an old thing, that is why we have the SAP14a 

TP: I am not talking judge's rules or SAP14 

TP: I am talking standing orders 

[TP reads from standing orders] 

TP: Do you see that, you saying you didn't know that? 

WM: I didn't say that I didn't know. What I am saying is that I can't remember if I got him to sign in the pocket book 

TP: Let me put it to you that according to this order, you would have HAD to ask him to sign and if he didn't sign, you would have had to get someone else to sign. 

WM: Yes, but this does not refer to the SAP14a 

TP: That's because this has nothing to do with the SAP14a. It is supposed to happen immediately when you warn the person 

TP: The simple question is, did you know this is compulsory or not? 

WM: Yes I did 

TP: But you don't know if it happened here 

WM: What I said is I don't want to commit myself to say that he signed, but I did write down indicating that I did explain his rights to him. 

22 Nov 10:49

TP: The diary that is now missing 

WM: Unfortunately 

TP: Fortunately for you 

TP: Did he sign your diary? 

WM: I can't recall if I made him sign 

TP: Do you know that there are standing orders that you are compelled to put it in your pocket book or diary and to give the suspect the opportunity to sign? 

WM: That is why I say I can't recall if he signed 

TP: Are you aware that it is compulsory to do so? 

WM: That is not compulsory, that is why there is the provision of the SAP14a 

TP: Are you saying it is not compulsory? 

WM: Sometimes it does happen, but that is why the SAP14a is provided 

TP: Do you understand my English? 

TP: You do not need the interpreter 

TP: I am going to ask you, are you not aware that it [is] compulsory for you to make a note in your pocket book, and to let the suspect sign, if not to get a fellow officer to sign and if not then to get a member of the public to sign 

WM: I don't know 

22 Nov 10:45

TP: Did you read it from here, or did you give it from memory? 

WM: From memory

TP: Did you give all 10? 

WM: Maybe not all, but I explained the basic rights 

TP: Do you have any written proof of this? 

WM: No 

TP: So we must rely on your word? 

WM: When you effect an arrest on the person, you warn them verbally, and when you get to the charge office, that is when you give them the written version 

TP: Answer my question, you are not listening. Did you put anything in writing proving that you had warned Mr Siyoni? 

WM: I have already said, I didn't 

TP: So we come back to the question I asked three questions ago, we have to rely on your word 

TP: Because Mr Siyoni told this court you never gave him any warning 

WM: I did give him his rights, verbally at Kwanobuhle, and when we detained him I gave him his written rights 

TP: And you put this in your diary 

WM: Yes 

22 Nov 10:40

TP: I want to take you to another document, it is very similar, except that this relates to Siyoni 

TP: That is your signature and I am sure you will say it is Siyoni's on the left 

WM: Yes, that is correct 

TP: When did you fill this in? 

WM: I filled it in at the charge office 

TP: What time? 

WM: The time will be in the occurrence book 

TP: But there is no time filled in here 

TP: I want to take you to paragraph 3b. Did you warn him that he does not have to make a confession? 

WM: Yes I did warn him that he was not compelled to make a confession 

TP: Did he react in any way? 

WM: No 

TP: Is this the only SAP14a that you filled in for Siyoni, from the time you took him from Infinity? 

WM: Yes, it is 

TP: But you claim you warned him in Kwanobuhle, after you took the statement from Babalwa 

WM: Yes 

TP: Same rights as you have here? 

WM: Yes 

22 Nov 10:35

TP: What did Sizwe say when you told him he had the right to an attorney? 

WM: I want the court to understand, I was not consulting with the suspect. I was merely reading him his rights. 

TP: I can't believe I am hearing this from a colonel in the police. Are you saying he never responded to you, he never made any choices? 

WM: When you read these rights, you must read these rights to the full. There is nothing that requires the suspect to make a choice when you read it to him. 

TP: You obviously have no idea how the law works. Let me put it to you this way: What would you have done if Vumazonke had asked you for a lawyer? 

WM: I would have been compelled to make arrangements with the charge office to make a phone available so that he can call his legal representation, and an entry would have been made in the occurrence book to say who he had called. 

TP: So you are saying he never gave you any answers? 

WM: There was only one answer he had to give me, and that was whether he understood his rights as [I] explained it to him. 

TP: So in your version, he never said he wants a lawyer or doesn't want one? 

WM: He said he understands his rights and he will see what he will do 

TP: You don't answer my questions. Did he say I want or I don't want a lawyer? 

WM: I didn't ask him if he wanted or needed the services of a legal representative. I merely explained his rights. 

22 Nov 10:30

TP: So you translated all these rights into Xhosa? 

WM: Yes I read his rights out in Xhosa, and he said I don't have to repeat it in English as he is aware of his rights 

TP: I am going to ask you to translate Section 2a in Xhosa for this court, and the court interpreter to reinterpret it back to us 

[WM reads clause about the rights to an attorney] 

TP: Did you make him aware that he had the right to immediate representation? 

WM: That is correct, I did explain to him that if he had an attorney he can call him and he can come represent him 

TP: Where did you write this down, this warning? 

WM: I just explained what is written here, I don't have to write this down 

TP: But why didn't you write it down? 

WM: It is already written down here, and as it is written, I will provide him with the original 

TP: How can this court be certain that you told him he can call his attorney immediately? It is not written anywhere in any of your statements. 

WM: What happens, when the person is detained, and he wishes to contact someone to be his legal representative, then a phone will be made available to him. 

22 Nov 10:23

TP: Did you offer him medical assistance? 

WM: He would have been offered medical assistance where he was being detained. I do not have medicine on me. 

TP: I am not asking you if you had medicine, I am asking you if you could take him to the doctor 

WM: I would not have been able to take him to the doctor, as I have said I did not have a state vehicle, besides it was not my duty to offer him medical assistance. 

TP: Why did you not say to the police at Dispatch that the man needs medical treatment? 

WM: The obligation lies with the charge office to take a person to get medical treatment should he require medical treatment. 

TP: Did you advise him that he has the right to medical treatment? 

WM: Yes, it is part of the warnings that are given 

TP: And what language did you warn him in? 

WM: Xhosa 

22 Nov 10:17

TP: This is the notice of the rights you read to Vumazonke on the 3rd of May 2015 at 6am 

WM: That is correct 

TP: Is that Vumazonke, bottom left corner? 

WM: Yes, he signed there 

TP: When you allegedly gave this warning to him, was he injured? 

TP: Injuries that you could see 

WM: Yes, I did observe something 

TP: Tell us 

WM: I can't recall if it was his left or right eye that was swollen 

TP: Swollen shut? 

WM: At the time we met, it was not swollen shut 

TP: But it wasn't a small little cut? 

WM: I can't say the size of the cut 

TP: Did you ask him what happened to him? 

WM: No 

TP: Why not? 

WM: I was not investigating the case 

TP: You are a police officer, you are supposed to look after accused people, why did you not ask? 

WM: What I know, for him to be registered in the occurrence book, you need to state how he sustained an injury 

TP: Are you saying you asked him that? 

WM: What I am saying, when he was detained, it was obvious he would have been asked how he sustained the injury.

22 Nov 10:12

TP: I want to get to your statement 

[TP calls up the document] 

TP: [reads] "During this time I received a call from a source who wanted to speak to me about the people involved...

WM: Yes 

TP: "I then drove to Port Elizabeth where I got the name Thando Siyoni...

TP: What do you have to say to that? 

WM: What I said, when I wrote this statement, I did not find it necessary to dwell on the source and detail.

WM: What is evident, I would not have left from Alice to come to PE, if it was not something substantial. 

TP: Your comment is directly contradicted by your statement in paragraphs 2 and 3 

WM: I wrote the statement after everything. I did not write it on the way from Alice. 

TP: But the statement says clearly you only got the name Thando Siyoni when you got to PE 

WM: I have said when I left Alice, I was already provided with names and information. I still had to come and verify that information. I had just heard the name, I still needed to verify it. 

TP: I am going to move on from this, but I will argue that you have sidestepped this question because you cannot answer it. 

WM: I have no reason to sidestep this question 

22 Nov 10:06

TP: What did the source tell you in that telephone call? 

WM: The source said to me that he wanted to see me because he had information relating to the planning and killing of this case. 

TP: Was a name given? 

WM: The source referred to a teacher from Uitenhage 

TP: That is not a name, did they give you a name? 

WM: If my memory serves, the person did say it relates to Jayde 

TP: Is that all the source told you on the phone? 

WM: The source also told me briefly whom I needed to meet with 

TP: And whom did they say you must meet with? 

WM: Now the source told me that the person who was working for Christopher, named Thando Siyoni 

TP: So before you even came back to PE, you knew that the suspect was Chris and Thando Siyoni? 

WM: No I want [you] to understand. According to the source, the person [who] would provide me with full information was Thando. Thando who was employed by Chris 

TP: You are not answering. Please listen. Before leaving Alice for PE, did you already have the names Chris and Thando? 

WM: I had both names 

22 Nov 10:01

TP: You are not listening, did you ever say you don't trust the source and want to speak to them yourself? 

WM: I did say that I did not know the person, and I did not know what the nature of the information was, as such I had to go and meet the person myself and determine what the information was 

TP: Did you say, in your statement, that the person was someone who you had never met before? 

WM: I never said that, as I did not see the relevance of the information 

TP: So it is the first time you have mentioned to anyone, and correct me if I'm wrong, that this person wanted to speak to you and only you, was yesterday? 

WM: That is correct. It came out from a question put to me. 

WM: There was no reason to put it in the statement. 

TP: The reason you are avoiding the question is because you are trying to avoid why you did not contact Koen like you should have done. 

WM: I have been working with sources for quite a long time. My sources are not a person I can make available to anyone. My source is only whom I can deal with and I am doing that to protect the identity of that source.

22 Nov 09:55

TP: So here you are treading in a case that has nothing to do with you, you are not even in the same unit, why didn't you call him first? 

WM: I explained this. This was information I received and I still had to verify it. 

TP: But why could Koen not verify it, he knew a lot more than you did 

WM: Even if he did know a lot more about the case. The person who chose to give me the information was only prepared to speak to me, so I had to verify it. 

TP: So they only chose to speak to you? 

WM: That is correct 

TP: Is this a person you never heard of before? 

WM: That is correct, it is a person I never heard [of] before 

TP: Did he give you a name? 

WM: Yes, he gave me a name 

TP: And did you tell that person you didn't trust him? 

WM: The person said he wanted to speak to me and no one else 

22 Nov 09:51

TP: I am now going to show you the distance from Infinity to Mount Road, it's 10.7km 

TP: You had offices there, without a doubt 

WM: Let me explain, the offices we have at Mount Road, we use offices belonging to VIS and we use it during the day 

TP: Did you not tell this court that the reason you didn't use this office is because you didn't have keys? 

WM: That is correct. I did say that. 

TP: It would have been very easy for you to phone someone to get those keys 

WM: It didn't occur to me to wake up people when we did have an office we could use 

TP: Here is another office, Kabega Park police office, it's 10.9km 

WM: I see that 

TP: You knew that the investigating officer was based at Kabega 

TP: And based on your testimony yesterday, you had his cell number 

WM: I did not have his number. It was a number that I asked from someone at the time I called him to come. 

TP: So you had easy access to it? 

WM: Yes 

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