Senator fears N Korea nukes may be sold

2011-12-25 22:24

Washington - The top Republican on the Senate foreign relations committee says he fears that someone in North Korea might try to sell that country's nuclear materials or nuclear weapons.

Senator Richard Lugar of Indiana says his worst fear is that something might happen to North Korea's nuclear material or nuclear weapons and that some in the North might try to sell them to others because of the country's economic crisis.

Appearing Sunday on CNN's State of the Union, Lugar said the US must track what happens to this material.

The senator said the Chinese must determine whether to treat North Korea as a province of China.

He said China is concerned that North Koreans could start crossing the border and drain Chinese resources.

  • spartanx93 - 2011-12-25 22:42

    more fictitious US propaganda...... Just like the WMD's in Iraq.

      Richard - 2011-12-25 23:38

      US propaganda or not, it is still a scary thought....

      Chris - 2011-12-26 01:25

      @Richard. I don't see the scary part, especially when compared to the mad dog of the middle east, Israel, who have these weapons, have delivery systems, and a plan called the Samsom Option...

      spartanx93 - 2011-12-26 08:11

      What is scary is living in SA with an uncontrollable crime rate.

      Jerhone - 2011-12-26 08:13

      to Chris How can you call Israel the mad dog of the middle east? how many times have they been attacked? plenty, have they once used nuclear weapons ? never, have they ever threatened their neigbours with nuclear weapons ? never, the Sampson option is a guarentee of their survival in sea of hate that surounds them, if they should use it on their neighbours the fallout to themselves would be catastrophic.

  • Tony - 2011-12-26 00:26

    I wish those bloody Yanks would keep their noses out of other countries' business. Who on earth do they think they are?

      Juan - 2011-12-26 03:09

      Well if they kept their noses out of Europe we would have been ruled by the nazis today

      spartanx93 - 2011-12-26 08:12

      The Russian pretty much turned the tide with WWII. The yanks entered in towards the end and was primarily based in the pacific. They only had bit and pieces involved in the actuall war.

      Win - 2011-12-26 09:36

      @ Spartan, you obviously know nothing. The Russians were only able to do their final onslaught because of the war supplies and materials they got from the Americans in the last war year, no other reason. In this way, the Americans also empowered Russia to become the great communist empire after the war.--- And another thing: we all better hope that the Americans carry on policing the planet. It is quite possible that North Korea will sell some atom bombs to Iran! And then the great Armageddon will start because those Muslim extremists are planning to destroy the planet for their god, i.e. the last great suicide bombing.

      George - 2011-12-26 10:32

      Name the only country in the world to use the atomic bomb against innocent civilians....yuuup you guessed right, the good ole USA. And now they want to "save" the world???

      George - 2011-12-26 10:34

      Juan, I suppose it was an American who told you that. Britain wont the war old son it just finished quicker witht the involvement of America. Please tell me one battle America has won entirely on their own.

      Johannes - 2011-12-26 10:52

      @win: and I dear friend, woud suggest you spruce up your knowledge of history. While American supplies did indeed aid the Russian war effort, the idea that it proved invaluable to the Soviet victory is pure hogwash. With 25 million casualties and two defining victories to its name (Stalingrad and Kursk-Orel) the Soviet Union determined the outcome of WW2. American profited greatly from Soviet sacrifices

      Jerhone - 2011-12-26 11:33

      They the USA are only the greatest country on planet earth, who everyone else is jealous of, no country on this earth has clean hands, so whats your beef?

      Johannes - 2011-12-26 11:49

      @jerhone I see Fox news has done well to create another brainless nationalist sprouting loose slogans like "America is the greatest" yada yada. The U.S. is a counry in decline, economically, intellectually and politically. The only people who believe that America has a manifest destiny in the 21st century, are the idiots voting republican

      Yar - 2011-12-26 11:59

      Serious lack of historical knowledge in this thread. @ Spartan Without the allies providing MASSIVE (mostly Amarican) supplies to the Russians the Russians would have stood no chance. Without the allies opening up other fronts (North Africa, Italy, France and the Balkans) the Germans would have chased Joe Stalin all the way to Vladivostock. Please remember that the Russians started WWII on the Germans side by invading Poland from the East. If the Allies (mainly Americans) had not occupied Western Europe, the Russians would have. That would have meant the end of civilised democracy as we know it. (@Juan - your point is good) @Spartan - Americans were not primarily based in the Pacific. They had far more land forces and aircraft in Europe than the Pacific. @George Please don't call the Japanese innocent Civilians. 1 They started it 2 Almost without exception the entire Japanese population was totally comitted to the war. 3 Japanese casualties were far far less than the Chinese & Korean civilian casualties inflicted by the Japs. The Japs deserved the Bomb and they got 2. Its called justice. @Johannes 25 Millions Russian Casualties - mainly due to the military doctrine of the Soviet leadership. They treated their own soldiers with little respect. Their own casualties were of no concern to their military top brass.

      Johannes - 2011-12-26 12:11

      @Yar Firstly; don't sound so arrogant. Secondly; although you are correct in stating that the large amount of Soviet casualties were caused by Soviet military doctrine, there is no denying the fact that the Soviet union bore the largest brunt of Nazi hostility. The examples are too numerous to list all of them in this thread. While your historical amnesia could be forgiven, your statement that the Nazis would have destroyed the USSR without American help is as absurd as it is blind. By the time a second front was opened, the Soviets had already broken the back of the Nazi warmachine (regardless of the manner in which it was done). The Allies had to rush to get to Berlin at the same time as the Soviets, fearing that the whole of Germany would fall into Soviet hands.

      Yar - 2011-12-26 12:34

      @Johannes Please fill me in on my historical amnesia. I forget which part you are talking about. I don't believe that the germans were broken in Russia until 1943 (Battle of Kursk Aug 1943 and Stalingrad Feb 43). By that time fronts against the Germans were opened in the Balkans, Greece, North Africa (2 fronts), Western Europe, The Battle of Britain. If the Germans had driven the Russians further East and beyond the Caucasus the Russians would have lost their industrial base and their food supplies. Game over.

      Johannes - 2011-12-26 12:52

      @Yar: Just to be clear, the fronts you refer to involved small scale clashes on the outer reaches of Nazi occupied Europe. The Italian invasion, while causing inconvienience to the Germans, was by no means catastrophic, seeing that the Allies had little chance of successfully launching an attack across trans-alpine Italy. As for Yugoslavia, the Allies had very little to do with that either, seeing that Tito's partisans (supported by the Soviets)were facing off to the Germans. As for Britain, those fools were holed up on their little island, thanking God that the Soviets were caught in the firing line. Your statement that the Soviets would have been driven behind the Causcasus is not historical fact, but merely a hypothesis (a bad one at that if I may be so blunt). Supposing however that they were driven back, do you really think the Nazis would have managed to hold on to the largest territory on earth indefinitely?? Pie in the sky my not so erudite friend, pie in the sky.... To conclude: the Soviet Union (and not the Yanks)broke Nazi Germany

      Yar - 2011-12-26 13:53

      @ Jo-royal-highness You make a categorical statement - "To conclude: the Soviet Union (and not the Yanks)broke Nazi Germany " - and I am expected to just accept and shut up. Sorry, can't do that. You state - "the fronts you refer to involved small scale clashes on the outer reaches of Nazi occupied Europe." How can you refer to the entire North African campaign as a small scale clash? Get real. Same for other campaigns. How many German troops were tied down which would have badly hurt Joe Stalin's comrades. You have also stated - "As for Britain, those fools were holed up on their little island" 1 The Atlantic War wasn't a trivial exercise, at least half of which ensured that massive American armaments and supplies got to Murmansk for Uncle Joe's army. 2 You have glossed over the Allied bombing campaign - which eventually broke the back of Germany's industrial production and public morale. 3 Those 'fools' on that 'little' island masterminded the war. It took them until the 1980's to repay their lend-lease debt. Give some credit. I don't dispute that the Russians suffered massively and had the worst part of the war to fight, but they helped start it, and deserved to pay for that. I dispute: Your inference that the rest of the Allies were "spectators". That the Russians were the major combatants and single-handedly won the war. Where did you get your education - Moscow? I do believe that without Western Allied help and material they would have lost.

      Yar - 2011-12-26 14:03

      @Johannes Rubbish Go and study

      Rory - 2011-12-26 16:12

      Excellent insight Yar. Tony your ignorance is appalling.

  • Tshivhombela Fhatuwani - 2011-12-26 02:08

    Lame excuse to attack N. Korea but this may have catastrophic results to Seoul.

  • braamc - 2011-12-26 06:34

    China to start doing something positive for world politics for a change

  • Donald.P.Muller - 2011-12-26 12:13

    @Yar, agree 100% with you. It seems that the moment the Americans come into any debate certain groups of people go into brain bypass mode.

      Johannes - 2011-12-26 12:29

      Quite rich coming from someone with such a profile pic...were your mother and father related by any chance?

      Donald.P.Muller - 2011-12-26 13:09

      @Johannes, is that the best that you can do? Your brain has definitely gone into bypass mode.

      Yar - 2011-12-26 14:32

      @Donald Our friend Johannes is biased and will not allow facts or rational debate to influence him. When challenged he resorts to personal insult, the last tactic of a pseudo-intelectual.

  • Johannes - 2011-12-26 14:37

    @Yarmouth I never stated that the Allied effort was negligble. What I found preposterous is the way in which you seem to minimize the Soviet war effort. To actually compare the Eastern campaign to the Western campaign, as you seem to do, is absurd. Adding to you stupidity, is the thoughtless way in which you try to lay the blame for Nazi agression on the USSR. Was Western Europe ever confronted with the horrors of Nazi eintsatzgruppen?? Were Western cities like Paris and Amsterdam ever encircled and systematically starved like Leningrad and Kiev? Also, If you had been lucky enough to get an education you would have known that the Allied bombing campaign only really started in 1944 and was aimed at civilians. You state that the bombings destroyed German armaments..hahahahah...the Nazis were still succesfully producing tanks and weaponry until late in the war (due to the technocratic leadership of Albert Speer). If you compare the loss of life (military and civilian), weapons used and general barbarity, the North African and Atlantic were mere side shows to the carnage the Russians had to face. Idiot. P.S. Moscow polytechnic is actually known for the respected scientists and physicists it has managed to produce over the years. Your statement thus just confirms what a tool you actually are

      Yar - 2011-12-26 15:12

      Dear Johannes "I never stated that the Allied effort was negligble." Yes you did, go read your comments. "Adding to you stupidity, is the thoughtless way in which you try to lay the blame for Nazi agression on the USSR." Wrong - I only accused the Soviets of complicity, and they were complicit. Einsatzgruppen were active in France, Holland, Belgium, Czechoslovakia, Italy, Yugoslavia and Greece. Allied Bombing campaign started in 1941, not 1944. Civilians are part of the means of production. Please refer to your copy of the Communist Manifesto and the twisted economic ramblings of Karl Marx. Thanks for calling me stupid, an idiot and a tool.

  • Johannes - 2011-12-26 14:48

    @Yar, I only actually resort to insults when I am confronted with quasi-scholars who parrot western (Anglo-American) history books.

      Yar - 2011-12-26 15:24

      And name calling, don't forget the name calling? PS: why are Western (A-A) history books invalid?

      Yar - 2011-12-26 15:30

      I think you resort to insults when you run out of logic or your facts are found to be full of holes. This why you start insulting so soon.

      Donald.P.Muller - 2011-12-26 15:50

      And Johannes bites the dust!! -20 for Johannes and +50 for Yar.

      mundu.olewega - 2011-12-27 04:41

      Johannes why don't you quit while you are ahead. The allies should have let the Russians sink for their pact with the devil (Poland 1939).

  • Johannes - 2011-12-26 16:08

    Dear Yar, I see we struggle with short term memory loss. You write: "I only accused the Soviets of complicity, and they were complicit". What you however actually wrote was: "I don't dispute that the Russians suffered massively and had the worst part of the war to fight, but they helped start it, and deserved to pay for that." Any historian worth his salt will tell you that barbarity of Einzatsgruppen in Bellorussia, Ukraine and the Baltics were on a totally different par to those in the West. Just because they operated right across Europe, doesn't mean that the Slavs (untermenschen) were heavily targeted. If you would take the time to read some basic literature about Nazi ontology, you would have realised this. You also write: Allied Bombing campaign started in 1941, not 1944. Actually, the firebombings of Dresden, Berlin etc. only took real effect in 1944. British aerial raids were ineffective for most of the early 1940's. Once again, please see my earlier comments regarding the need to read up on your history. The insults were my pleasure by the way. Now take your little lapdog (Donald) and visit a library.

      Yar - 2011-12-26 16:30

      Dear Johannes Bombing Campaign - Berlin and Dresden firestorms were undertaken by the Allies to disrupt the Germans on the Eastern front. Just another favour for the Russians, courtesy of the Allies. By 1944, Bomber Harris and US Air Force had no more industrial targets. So much for only starting in '44. PS: Don and me - we have already been to the library. Why are you calling the Slavs "untermenschen" - you sound like a Nazi troll, not the Soviet apologist that you pretend to be.

  • Johannes - 2011-12-26 16:20

    @Donald Trying to hide your limited intelligence by sheltering behind the arguments of another, is pathetic and sad.

      Yar - 2011-12-26 16:36

      @Donald Now he's picking on you. Because he thinks you might be chicken. Give him a smack. Soon he will start sulking.

      Donald.P.Muller - 2011-12-26 16:48

      Not as sad and pathetic as someone trying to pass themselves off as an intellectual. "Yar's lapdog" Oh! you are really hurting my feelings now, how dare you say such a nasty thing. I simply back Yar because he/she makes a far more convincing argument than you do.

      Yar - 2011-12-26 16:53

      Thanks Don

  • Brian - 2011-12-26 16:25

    America is in no position to lecture anyone on nuclear weapons , it holds the largest nuclear arseanal in the world, it is planning to spend billons of taxpayers hard earned cash on building more nuclear weapons . It has the worlds largest stockpile of germ warfare weapons, on the planet also. It slaughtred millons of Japanease , men women and children in a nuclear holocaust ,and it routineally threatings Iran. N. Korea etc with nuclear attack . Its little wonder many nations would love to have nuclear weapons. Would American Zionist and their European allies , NATO, aka , North Alantic Terrorist Organisation, have attacked Libya to seize it vast oil and water reserves , if Libya had nuclear weapons to defend its soverigntry ?. America which the Zionist have looted and plundred , is now in terminal decline , and it only response to save itself , all but tempoary, is to wage war aganist poor defencless nations and plunder its resources to stave of it eventual demise.

      Donald.P.Muller - 2011-12-26 16:50

      Oh Boy, here we go again.

      Yar - 2011-12-26 17:02

      Your turn Don. Have a go!

  • Johannes - 2011-12-26 16:47

    Yar, I was refering to the Nazi terms for my comments properly next time. "Bombing Campaign - Berlin and Dresden firestorms were undertaken by the Allies to disrupt the Germans on the Eastern front"Bombing Campaign - Berlin and Dresden firestorms were undertaken by the Allies to disrupt the Germans on the Eastern front. Just another favour for the Russians, courtesy of the Allies." Tut tut my little friend. These bombings were unnecessary as the Germans were already defeated. Winston and his allies merely wanted to inflict victor justice on innocent German civilians (same as the Yanks did when they dropped the second nuke on Nagasaki). Please show statistics with which to back up your claim that Allied bombings made such an impact in the early 1940's as opposed to 1944 (when the Soviets were already at the gates of Warsaw). Just because you've been brainwashed to believe everything that is bad about the USSR, try to keep an open mind when having an intellectual argument

      Yar - 2011-12-26 17:01

      Even sarcasm is lost on you. Let's not even get into a debate about Soviet treachery at the gates of Warsaw.

  • Johannes - 2011-12-26 16:52

    @Yar, Donald I have to end our little tit for tat now. Thx for an amusing afternoon. I always enjoy sparring with plebs. Regards,

      Yar - 2011-12-26 16:59

      You condescending prat

  • Phillip - 2011-12-26 19:03

    Then again Israel, Russia, China, India, France and even the good old US of A are all selling their nuke spares to their friends. Some of the people here sounds like they belong on the Jerry Springer show. And no, I know absolutely nothing about the second world war.

      John - 2011-12-26 20:21

      My farther told me that I would never have been born but for the help of the Americans during the war, I was born in England. Britain stood alone in 1941 against most of Europe, France with the fourth largest navy in the world gave up with little fight,Britain was almost bankrupt,but for the help from America and the commonwealth countries they would have certainly been defeated. Britain paid heavily for their freedom, they started paying back the loans from America in 1951, they finished paying in 2006, on the day of the last payment a British minister stood up in parliament and thanked the American's. "God save the queen". Farflung.

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